Author Topic: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.  (Read 9358 times)

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Offline Latvian

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #45 on: October 29, 2013, 04:31:56 pm »
0
i think it hurts more if you get hit by bastard sword which is sharp  for example than you get hit with spear which is wooden stick
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Offline Gurnisson

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #46 on: October 29, 2013, 04:39:30 pm »
+2
Coming from someone who uses a long axe almost exclusively, its speed is a joke compared to any 2hander and many 1handers.

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Offline MURDERTRON

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #47 on: October 29, 2013, 05:36:40 pm »
+1
You also have to remember that the backswing on left and right swings is much further back, and teammates walk into it all the time.  And yes, 2h have a backswing, too, but its much easier to avoid glancing on teammates with it.  So, if all other things were equal, performance-wise, the polearm would still be getting shit on.
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Offline DaruviansUnmutedAccount

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #48 on: October 29, 2013, 05:40:33 pm »
+1
Polearms are a very, very strong class right now. They do not need a buff. I die in 2-3 shots from an awlpike or bec de corbin, even through milanese plate and 33 STR/11 IF. Pikes are meant to be support weapons they don't need a buff.

If anything give lances a small buff maybe. Most polearms need no buff.

I topped my team 52-12 using a polearm the other day in a 50v50 battle. They are pretty stronk.

But hey what the fuck do I know?

Offline Kafein

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #49 on: October 29, 2013, 06:18:59 pm »
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All mid to high tier polearms swing much faster ingame than what they are supposed to be because pole animations skip frames like there's no tomorrow. Even movies from the 1900's look less jerky than a guy swinging a poleaxe.

Offline Falka

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #50 on: October 29, 2013, 07:04:57 pm »
+1
Coming from someone who uses a long axe almost exclusively, its speed is a joke compared to any 2hander and many 1handers.

The only polearm that could possibly stand up against 2handers apart from the war spear is perhaps the staff.

You're far more biased than Panos.. Okay, maybe exaggerated a bit, you're equally biased.
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Offline San

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #51 on: October 29, 2013, 08:11:04 pm »
+1
If we're going to talk about the little things, stopping your opponents in their tracks is also an invaluable polearm trait that I'm jealous I don't have. That and 3/4 of their attacks got buffed, so I don't believe they should fully match 2h stats without taking that trait into account.

Offline Kafein

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #52 on: October 29, 2013, 08:38:41 pm »
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If we're going to talk about the little things, stopping your opponents in their tracks is also an invaluable polearm trait that I'm jealous I don't have. That and 3/4 of their attacks got buffed, so I don't believe they should fully match 2h stats without taking that trait into account.

This. I can't count the amount of times I was happily fending off 2/3 normal people then a wild polearmer appears, one of his swings whiffs on my oiled skin but somehow it pins me to the ground and I immediately die...

Offline Visconti

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #53 on: October 30, 2013, 02:06:00 pm »
+1
Polearms are strong as fuck, stabbing polearms already dominate the battlefield... would be stupid to buff them

The only polearm that could possibly stand up against 2handers apart from the war spear is perhaps the staff. Even then a HBS or LS can probably outswing you 9 times out of 10 unless perhaps you have vastly superior footwork.

Why should a 4 directional polearm be as good as a 2h when 2/1 directional polearms are already so damn strong? Polearms strength are their versatility, they can fight like a 2h (poleaxe, hafted blades, long axe etc) use a shield (hoplites) and have access to the strongest group fighting weapons in the game (pikes/2 directional lawlpikes) not to mention being able to stop cav... and now, with all the animation changes, 2 directional polearms are just as good at 1v1s as they are at supporting their teammates.

Polearms are strong enough. No buffs please
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Offline Jona

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #54 on: October 30, 2013, 05:22:09 pm »
0
You're far more biased than Panos.. Okay, maybe exaggerated a bit, you're equally biased.

I do not speak from bias, merely from experience. I used to be a 2hander for a long time until it just got noticeably ridiculous and easy... as I got better 2hand just became an effortless, and therefore fun-lacking class. I only recently switched over to a polearm build.. spent maybe 10 gens 2hand... at most 5 as a polearm. All I meant by saying I primarily use a long axe is that I realize it is one of the fastest and therefore spammiest polearms... yet it is very easily outclassed by mostly any 2hand sword, and is also easily outspammed by any relatively speedy onehander. Not to mention that its reach is WORSE than a longsword or HBS. Lets look at the stats here: longsword/HBS are longer, have a faster base speed stat, hit earlier in the animation, and have a lolstab. Long axe has a slower base speed, longer attack animations, no viable stab, and is shorter. Only advantage it has is the higher damage on swings. Now lets compare it to onehanded swords. A good majority of onehanders are faster, have better animations and therefore a lolstab, and with animations any lengthy onehanders have the same, if not longer reach than the long axe. I am fairly certain that with the NEGATIVE reach "bonus" polearms get for most of their swings, and the POSITIVE reach bonus onehanders get (on the right swing, anwyays... not sure about overhead and left) a long axe is effectively shorter than any high 90s - 100 length onehander. Once again the only plus here is that the long axe has the higher damage.

Also, as someone previously mentioned, polearms tend to catch on people/objects far more often than other weapon types due to their animations. You would think that the shortness of the long axe would help it out here, but it doesnt. One of my clanmates picked up my long axe and started running around with it and while yes he said that thing is pretty darn fast (compared to his poleaxe) all it did was glance. For whatever reason even solid hits with the damn thing will glance occasionally. Maybe if I was a pure str crutch it would glance less, but I wouldnt know.

Polearms are strong as fuck, stabbing polearms already dominate the battlefield... would be stupid to buff them

Why should a 4 directional polearm be as good as a 2h when 2/1 directional polearms are already so damn strong? Polearms strength are their versatility, they can fight like a 2h (poleaxe, hafted blades, long axe etc) use a shield (hoplites) and have access to the strongest group fighting weapons in the game (pikes/2 directional lawlpikes) not to mention being able to stop cav... and now, with all the animation changes, 2 directional polearms are just as good at 1v1s as they are at supporting their teammates.

Polearms are strong enough. No buffs please

Spoken like a true 2hander...

Sure, 2 directionals are great for a support class. So are 1 directionals (hoplites or pikes/longspear). However, what you fail to realize is that anyone flailing around a 2handed sword can just as easily play a support role. Their stab is just as good as any polearms. You just dont see it because they can play any way they want. And who would RATHER play support when they can just as easily be a hero? I've done it plenty of times in siege... when its a moshpit instead of jumping into the fray and helicoptering everyone I would stand behind my allies and poke poke poke with a longsword or danish greatsword. Just as effective as a hoplite.

Also, your argument that they can fight like a 2hand is just bull... sure, they can swing in 4 directions... FIGHT LIKE A 2H? I think not. No polearmer will ever best a 2hander of equal skill in a duel. Therefore, they are in no way "like 2h."
« Last Edit: October 30, 2013, 05:31:03 pm by Jona »
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Offline Kafein

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #55 on: October 30, 2013, 11:45:19 pm »
+3
No polearmer will ever best a 2hander of equal skill in a duel.

Reality check : no.

Offline BlindGuy

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #56 on: October 31, 2013, 12:02:15 am »
+1
You also have to remember that the backswing on left and right swings is much further back, and teammates walk into it all the time.  And yes, 2h have a backswing, too, but its much easier to avoid glancing on teammates with it.  So, if all other things were equal, performance-wise, the polearm would still be getting shit on.

Your looking at an advantage that poles have and seeing a negative.

Polearms: Not the easiest class, but probably the most powerful. Its just... not for nabs. If you have trouble with polearms, just get a 2hander. Its easier. Cause your a nab. Polearms fucking rock socks, jocks, hard cocks, blocks and smocks.

EDIT: noticed some nabs in this thread mention "Swords hit earlier in the animation..." when they were comparing to GLB. Hahahahahahahahahahaha! Ha! AHAHAHAH! ahahahah! haha! You have just failed so hard im tempted to draw you a picture of a triangle, compare it to a straight line, and explain why your stupid. But Im lazy, so do your own thinking.
I don't know enough

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Offline Kafein

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #57 on: October 31, 2013, 12:10:37 pm »
0
OMFG !

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Offline Tydeus

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #58 on: October 31, 2013, 02:10:41 pm »
+1
I can't imagine we'll ever do a generic +1/-1 to any "class" of weapon. Tweaks will certainly still be done, but not generic, broad buffs/nerfs, which means this thread topic is kind of pointless. Talking about one weapon or subclass of weapons at a time, is a much better approach, both in chance to succeed as well as likelihood to be taken seriously.
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Offline Jona

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Re: Increase the speed and damage on polearms.
« Reply #59 on: October 31, 2013, 08:55:12 pm »
+3
OMFG !

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How to get +1 from kaoklai:

-Say 2handers are balanced.
-Say all stabs are perfectly balanced

How to get -1 from kaoklai:

-Point out obvious game breaking mechanics that he always abuses
-Say something that makes sense
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