TO THE DEVS TEAM !!

[Strudog]

I dont think that archery is that easy, especially as the movement of people has changed alot. Nobody is running in a straight line a long time, people are running around like rabbits on speed which makes anticipation very hard which is needed for long range shots.

I would be fine with having my reticule removed (talking xbow now) but I would need another thing to aim on the crossbow. You will probably agree that aiming without reticule in third person is hard. I would totally welcome this idea if movement would be made more realistic to fit the realistic aiming of ranged weapons.

What I mean with that is that changing direction 3 times per second in order to dodge an arrow or a bolt is about as realistic as somebody having a reticule implemented in his vision all the time.

Edit: Is there an ingame option to turn off the reticule? I would like to try it out.

Maybe a dot would suffice instead, instead getting rid of the whole reticule this way you know where you are shooting but not entirely sure what trajectory the arrow is going to take, bu the only reason people move like that is the fact that arrows are flying in from every angle and they most move around quickly to make it less likely to be hit.

Removing the reticule maybe too far as it will force people into 1st person view and be constantly stabbed in the back by horses, maybe if all range agree that the dot idea would be a could compromise and i am even happy to give more damage back and allow them to kite like my old friends.

I know that i constantly move in all direction if i am not attacking someone, reason being is that i know one of the ranged on the enemy team is trying to kill me (reason being so many of them), i can live with the fact that i will die to range a lot because they have that advantage and that i know i will lose to more than 1 ranged like with any class. But there comes a point where the whole teama re archers and there is nothing the melee team can do.

I am might go and change my reticule to a dot, (if possible) and come back with results and see how more challenging/good or bad it is, i am sure not to be biased in my results as i have played 6 gens as archer, 6 gens as xbow and 6 gens as melee

[Joker86]

You're right, but my suggestion wasn't meant to make kiting archers fight in melee (nothing could force them), but it meant to make melee-archers NOT LOSE their ranged abilities and be equial in shooting with "no melee", so basically archers who wouldn't use their melee abilities would look like a cav that doesn't use weapons and only uses his bumps.

Okay, the idea seems legit, but buffing archers in melee and still having good ranged capabilities seems a bit OP to me. I think it is fine that a dedicated archer has poor melee capabilities, otherwise it's plainly unfair for infantry which survived the enemy fire and reached the archers to have to fight decent melee fighters to finally be able to score a kill.

I am more a fan of keeping the weaknesses and strengthes of classes as extreme as possible, so that players are forced to play together, instead of everyone being more or less flexible and thus every player playing for himself. If archers are weak in melee, they need to rely on cav and infantry to be protected, as much as infantry needs to rely on archers to give them "covering fire" or cavalry has to rely on them to kill those HAs which otherwise shoot their horses under their butt. You know what I mean?

[Blackbow]

omg the only thing u keep from this video is legolas and avatar ???
u dumb ass phase =p

[Alexander_TheGreat_]

omg the only thing u keep from this video is legolas and avatar ???
u dumb ass phase =p

Yes you are right blackbow, i support your thread: NERF ARCHERS!
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[Kafein]

to the devs team (and only the dev team i dont care what think crying inf or trollers)

guys i was going to ask you if you are stupid and rage but i will not.
i will be honest and concise i had lot of fun playing on crpg i know devs spent lot of hours and i'm very greatfull to you for it!
i play since 2 years and since 2 years each patch make the game worst
i just saw your new archery nerf (jump shot ) like always no patch log an other ninja patch ... do you know crpg is the only mod who dont give patch log ?
but i will talk about the last archery nerf ...

you know since 2 years ppl crying about archery damage 
you added the slot system and 0 slot shity weapon
so archers had nothing to defend themselves so they started to kite

- then to counter kite you increased weight of quivers and bows
- each patch you decrease the missile speed who make the arrows buged (ghost arrows
passing through people or horse at long or low range)
- you decreased accuracy so know long range shot are fucked and we have  to get closer
- you decreased model size of the flying projectile (bolt and arrows) so we just have to kill our eyes on screen to see where we shot... but after some meters u cant see anymore where is going your projectile
- now you added this amazing anti jump shot so now we cant jump to dodge cavs rly nice idea guys ...
- but you increased a bit damage ... why ??? ppl cry about archery damage but you increase it to compensate the nerf ???

so if i follow your point of view, archers have to be close to fight because you fucked
accuracy but if they get charge they cant flee cause they are to heavy, they cant defend
themselves cause they have only a shit pickaxe and now they cant jump shot to try to kill
ppl runing after their ass... so sry i will have to tell it:
guys are you stupid ? did u ever play archers ? i guess no..

btw you can simply remove arrows and barbed arrows coz nobody will use it anymore with this fucking huge weight

so please instead of waste your time in shit like the anti jump shot can you fix some bugs ?

- like ghost arrows (it just need you increase missile speed like in 2 years ago)
- you tried to fix spinning around 2hander but you buged overhead...
- can you fix the quiver bug ... when you are out of arrows if you pick different arows on the ground than your arrows you will lost your quiver on the ground ...


so if sometime you listen your comunity and want to hear what an archer who play since 2 years think about that:

imo you should :
- decrease body damage by 20% or 30% and keep head shot damage
- increase missile speed (cause all this fucking ghost arrows start to make me crazy)
- and if possible decrease a bit weight of quivers
- give to archers a real 0 slot weapon a bit more longer... (if you give them a way to defend they will not kite)

you know archer is one of the hardest class to level up you are useless before the lvl 25
imagine a new player who try to play with simple arrows and a low bow during 25 level...
think about it...

i will finish by :
you work on this mod since 2 or 3 years and this mod is still unbalanced each time you make a patch you just make the game worst and less funny
dont tell me you have not the tools to fix all what i spoken

so for all this reason i cant believe in your project and cant give 50 euro to someone
who cant balance a mod after 2 or 3 years !!!

edit : cool with the jump shot nerf u cant jump to dodge a cav ... rly amazing patch clap .... noobz ...

i know some people like compare reality with the game so for those people i have a video of what can do an archer in real life

edit :I FOUND THE SOLUTION FOR ARCHERY !!! (thx to raylin)
http://forum.meleegaming.com/suggestions-corner/secondary-weapon-mode-melee-bow/

MORE SIEGE SHILD IN BATTLEFIELD :
http://forum.meleegaming.com/suggestions-corner/more-siege-shield-in-battlefield-!!!/new/#new

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[Templar_Steevee]

I think that archers should be more mobile, because atm with 5 ath I'm hardly able to follow my team without shooting, while guys in heavy armours and big weapons are faster than me, ligth armored archer.

[Vibe]

I think that archers should be more mobile, because atm with 5 ath I'm hardly able to follow my team without shooting, while guys in heavy armours and big weapons are faster than me, ligth armored archer.

so you can kite like whores again? no thanks

[Kafein]

Besides the brutal arrow weight thing, maybe the wpf curve of archery could be tweaked so that building a pure archer at level 30 has virtually no advantage over a pure archer at level say 21 ? This way archers would have great incentives to hybridize those 9 levels.

[Grumbs]

Why encourage hybridising though? I'm with Joker on that. It sounds good on paper in order to reduce kiting, but what you do is blur the lines between ranged and melee. Unless the ranged part is properly nerfed to compensate having OK melee capability

Why not all take a crossbow already? High melee wpf is virtually worthless. Heavy armour is not worth the upkeep or extra weight (except in some melee fights, but even then its only 50-100% of its shown value for determining damage reduction). You can go in medium armour, crossbow and 2 slot 2 hander/pole and weigh the same as heavy armour guy and have similar movement in melee and good enough armour, and 1 or 2 hit kills at range (if you hit head or 2+ body hits)

All you need in melee is the ability to manually block and you can negate a pure melee guys damage completely. If you can do that as an archer you can defend until you get to support or make your own attacks. Making them stronger in melee will make pure melee players wonder why they even take a pure melee build, we will just get more people playing a mix of range & melee, it will get worse than now.

You shouldn't have the best of both worlds. Either you have crappy ranged damage/accuracy and mediocre melee, good melee and no range damage (pure melee guy) or good range and no melee. I would prefer the first, so at least people are encouraged to play the game more as a melee type game

Maybe the problem is that power strike & powerdraw use the same stat, so if you go hybrid you get better damage in range & melee, and they buffed WPF with higher PD, and the top bows got better accuracy

[Kafein]

Why encourage hybridising though? I'm with Joker on that. It sounds good on paper in order to reduce kiting, but what you do is blur the lines between ranged and melee. Unless the ranged part is properly nerfed to compensate having OK melee capability

Why not all take a crossbow already? High melee wpf is virtually worthless. Heavy armour is not worth the upkeep or extra weight (except in some melee fights, but even then its only 50-100% of its shown value for determining damage reduction). You can go in medium armour, crossbow and 2 slot 2 hander/pole and weigh the same as heavy armour guy and have similar movement in melee and good enough armour, and 1 or 2 hit kills at range (if you hit head or 2+ body hits)

All you need in melee is the ability to manually block and you can negate a pure melee guys damage completely. If you can do that as an archer you can defend until you get to support or make your own attacks. Making them stronger in melee will make pure melee players wonder why they even take a pure melee build, we will just get more people playing a mix of range & melee, it will get worse than now.

You shouldn't have the best of both worlds. Either you have crappy ranged damage/accuracy and mediocre melee, good melee and no range damage (pure melee guy) or good range and no melee. I would prefer the first, so at least people are encouraged to play the game more as a melee type game

These are valid points but for me all "non-melee" classes should be melee hybrids. Melee cav already is, throwers are too, if only because pure throwers aren't very good, dedicated foot xbowmen very often have decent melee, why not archers ? This isn't really about balance btw.

[Joker86]

These are valid points but for me all "non-melee" classes should be melee hybrids.

Although this game is mainly about melee, I disagree. In my opinion it would reduce the variety and thus the fun of the game. cRPG is about creating your own character and living with its strengthes and weaknesses, and every single game mode is team based, and not everybody vs. everybody, so I think the ONLY way to go are specialized classes which need to support each other to maximize their performance. The more everybody is capable of doing everything, the more the gameplay will become dull, and the worse the game will become.

[Tibe]

These are valid points but for me all "non-melee" classes should be melee hybrids. Melee cav already is, throwers are too, if only because pure throwers aren't very good, dedicated foot xbowmen very often have decent melee, why not archers ? This isn't really about balance btw.

Why force them all to hybrid? If they dont bloody want to melee, atleast let em compensate this with awesome shootingskillz. I know its pointless to bring realism into this, but still....archers didnt melee in battle. Throwers did and so did cav, but not archers. I like being a melee/archer hybrid, but I dont get why force some people's hand in this mod just cause couple QQ meleeguys cant catch them. And whose fault is it really if one team has only archers left and other has nobody with a build to counter archers alive.

[Joseph Porta]

Although this game is mainly about melee, I disagree. In my opinion it would reduce the variety and thus the fun of the game. cRPG is about creating your own character and living with its strengthes and weaknesses, and every single game mode is team based, and not everybody vs. everybody, so I think the ONLY way to go are specialized classes which need to support each other to maximize their performance. The more everybody is capable of doing everything, the more the gameplay will become dull, and the worse the game will become.

hey joker ive always wondered if you even play, ive never seen your name. 

[Kafein]

Although this game is mainly about melee, I disagree. In my opinion it would reduce the variety and thus the fun of the game. cRPG is about creating your own character and living with its strengthes and weaknesses, and every single game mode is team based, and not everybody vs. everybody, so I think the ONLY way to go are specialized classes which need to support each other to maximize their performance. The more everybody is capable of doing everything, the more the gameplay will become dull, and the worse the game will become.

It just kinda feels natural to me that everybody should be able to survive a little in melee, although with disadvantages, even when not specifically specced for it. Even though running up an archer and gutting him makes my day, I don't believe (fuck you ie and ei, I will never do it right) hard counters are good game design.

[Blackbow]

dont worrie guys all archers will become hybrid 2hander so they will nerf 2hander i guess
and this day i will laugh so hard =p

and btw you will be so mad when archers will be able to kill inf in range and in melee =p