Use this Thread to Talk About that City

[Bravix]

This glitch in the map pragmatically made it so that Hospitaller could ONLY lose if they decided to lose by giving up that area (which they did not), and that in order for FCC to win they had to find a way to overcome a glitch that they should have had no obligation to deal with in the first place.

Didn't give it up? Please, do tell how Hospitaller was going to 'give it up'? We didn't have any more access to it then you guys did.

I understand that they decided to dedicate forces to it. But if they felt it was so unfair from the start, why didn't they just retreat and petition it? Instead, they chose to stay and fight it out. They lost. Now they call for a redo? (though nobody has directly asked for it in here yet, it has been stated elsewhere).  Should have ended it earlier and not wasted everyone's time.

Had you guys ignored the invisi-wall'd flag entirely and managed to take all of the other flags, I can almost guarantee you that the admins would have granted you the city.

I must say, when I saw that you guys had a catapult in the courtyard, I was extremely confused lol. Didn't know there was the glitched area at that time.

[Tomas]

Sorry Daruvian but your argument is flawed imo.  Yes FCC had to take players out of the main fight, but they were taken out to deal with Hospi players that had been taken out of the main fight making it the same for both sides.  In fact it was theoretically better for FCC who could at least control who fought there.

Its still crap and needs fixing though.

[GOBBLINKINGREATLEADER]

You know I really don't care what happens to FCC or Hospitaller with this... my way of looking at it is that the troops and equipment that were lost in a glitched battle that are just being treated like a "shit happens" accident... number more than the equipment and resources of my entire faction of about 15 active people on Strategus. To me it feels like admins could just let us all lose our time and effort with a shit happens attitude... and that really blows. For a faction like FCC this may not be a critical deal, but if you look at it relative to factions like Teutonic, Frisia, FIDLGB, Dracul, et cetera... shrugging off losses like this is like shrugging off the strength of an entire smaller faction.

[BaleOhay]

The reason i said stanging area is that you had guys build ladders from that spawn in two directions.

Into your city which I was fine with and those were put up first and quickly. You had people raining down on us from behind the entire fight (where we put our first inside forward spawn. Took us a bit to figure out how you were doing it. We had all the flags in that part of the city under control.

The part that made me say staging area is where you built ladders to the outside and had guys over and over again coming out and attacking our outside forward spawn from the non reachable area. Same group of guys over and over so we had to have people just stand outside. Then the archers and xbow men that hung out up there firing into us without us being able to clear the section. 

[CrazyCracka420]

Sorry Daruvian but your argument is flawed imo.  Yes FCC had to take players out of the main fight, but they were taken out to deal with Hospi players that had been taken out of the main fight making it the same for both sides.  In fact it was theoretically better for FCC who could at least control who fought there.

Its still crap and needs fixing though.

As someone who wasn't there and has no idea the circumstances except what people are saying in this thread, that's exactly what came to mind.

Anyone FCC had to set to guard that area, was attacking/killing defenders who were also unable to fight on the front lines...

[BaleOhay]

I am not asking for it to be done over but to say that flag had no affect on the battle is wrong.

we had 10 guys inside 20% of our force guarding 1 flag. then we needed an additional 5 outside (30% total) full time to cover one spawn point. That is debilitating. Prior to that things were going very clean.

Then we noticed we kept getting tagged from behind and flags were going up that were perfectly in our control.

had about an hour left. Once your timers got high we were going to push to corral and cap. Hard to systematically close.sections of the city when people can spawn behind u.

[Rikthor]

Sorry Daruvian but your argument is flawed imo.  Yes FCC had to take players out of the main fight, but they were taken out to deal with Hospi players that had been taken out of the main fight making it the same for both sides.  In fact it was theoretically better for FCC who could at least control who fought there.

Its still crap and needs fixing though.

The main issue with that, from my limited perspective admittedly, was that they were able to get out of that area both coming to the forward spawn area we set up on the other side of the wall/invisible wall in question and get out of the main outer wall. So they had two ways of getting out. It would only be speculation on my part if they were trying to stay there so I won't voice an opinion to that. What was clear, is certain players spawning there were actively destroying ladders and preventing people from the FCC side getting to that area to disable the flag. There were people guilty of trying to use that bugged area to their advantage, sorry, it's the facts.

The bigger, more annoying issue to me, is just the show stain of a server we have to play with for strat battles. It wasn't even 5-10 minutes into the battle before the lag started in. Near the end of the battle, just running forward felt like a massive undertaking in frustration. Better servers please.

[BaleOhay]

New server incoming according to thread in general forumn.

and yes several defenders were using that bug spawn to great advantage. nothing to do about it now but fix the map. I do not mind losing a fight. It happens. Losing when I felt we had a solid chance of winning sucks. Up till that stupid spawn we were ahead of schedule.

having a counter to show how many flags remaining might be a nice additio

[Smoothrich]

What was clear, is certain players spawning there were actively destroying ladders and preventing people from the FCC side getting to that area to disable the flag. There were people guilty of trying to use that bugged area to their advantage, sorry, it's the facts.

Guilty of what?  Playing?  What would you rather they do?  Drop their weapons and surrender?  Get banned?

I don't understand what people wanted or expected the players or admins to do.  They were just trying to play and contribute by fighting and defending while FCC tried to kill them in a trapped in area. Its a game about killing people and things after all.

[Tomas]

(click to show/hide)

You know I really don't care what happens to FCC or Hospitaller with this... my way of looking at it is that the troops and equipment that were lost in a glitched battle that are just being treated like a "shit happens" accident... number more than the equipment and resources of my entire faction of about 15 active people on Strategus. To me it feels like admins could just let us all lose our time and effort with a shit happens attitude... and that really blows. For a faction like FCC this may not be a critical deal, but if you look at it relative to factions like Teutonic, Frisia, FIDLGB, Dracul, et cetera... shrugging off losses like this is like shrugging off the strength of an entire smaller faction.

As a small faction with total resources of 3k heavily armed troops would you send all of them against 5k heavily armed troops in a city that you hadn't fought in before? 

There's only really 3 things to consider for a siege.  Yourself (resources and merc skill), your enemy (resources and merc skill) and the Terrain (map).  In this case FCC were fairly certain of the first two but did not know the map and so took a risk in making the attack.  In their eyes however the potential gain was worth the committed resources.  Other factions have to weigh up the risks for themselves though and will therefore come to different conclusions. 

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

Yeah, it's FFCs fault they didn't know the map was sorta broken, you deserve it for expecting the town you attack not to have any technical issues. 

[Rikthor]

Guilty of what?  Playing?  What would you rather they do?  Drop their weapons and surrender?  Get banned?

Guilty of preventing the attackers from reaching them in a bugged area. It's not a tough concept to understand. Since no one on your side wanted to be back there, letting FCC disable the flag back there would have been beneficial for both sides to get back to fighting instead of FCC wasting manpower on that area and Hospi's having people stuck back there.

[Smoothrich]

Guilty of preventing the attackers from reaching them in a bugged area. It's not a tough concept to understand. Since no one on your side wanted to be back there, letting FCC disable the flag back there would have been beneficial for both sides to get back to fighting instead of FCC wasting manpower on that area and Hospi's having people stuck back there.

So they were guilty of defending themselves as the defense of a siege.  I don't think thats a rule mate.

[Rikthor]

So they were guilty of defending themselves as the defense of a siege.  I don't think thats a rule mate.

Stop being willfully obtuse mate. There is a difference between defending oneself and actively preventing people from reaching you in a bugged area mate.

[Smoothrich]

Stop being willfully obtuse mate. There is a difference between defending oneself and actively preventing people from reaching you in a bugged area mate.

Show me the rules that say you can't defend an area as defense if the flag has a glitchy perimeter in a Strat battle.  Or an example of people being banned for this.  Maybe I will change my perspective then.  Until then I consider everyone saying people who fought and defended themselves at their glitchy spawn were exploiters as biased (shockingly all from the losing side of a battle)  with poor common sense for rules.

All have a case of the Kesh.  Go to the doctor.