So, is Horse Archery Skill really Balanced?

[Cris]

I've been off for a couple of days, I've just had a quick look all post, and its just funny how people complain about HA so much and about what we are asking. I am assuming most people haven't even looked at my video to have a decent understanding of what we are talking about.

Bonze, I've gotten much more than 20 kills as HA, i will assure you, those 20 kills are not of full health people, and probably a lot are bumping and sideweapon. And peasants.

Also, most best melee players will survive a HA one to one, it only takes some awareness and understanding of the HA class (not hard if you actually look at it with a bit of brains)

As usual, most people here complain about HA with really baseless arguments and limited experience on the class, it weaknesses and strength. Furthermore, good players doesn't mean the class is balanced, many of my clan mates can get a decent score on peasant gear, that doesn't mean peasant gear is OP.

Horse Archery needs a buff, right now, it takes easily over 8 arrows (not bodkin, too expensive to upkeep, but still over 5 of them anyway) to kill anyone of decent armor, landing those arrows at speed is already very hard, as player skill is totally ignored by huge reticules...

Also, because of the hate of people for HA, the HA WPP penalty means we are underpowered on foot, which means all small anti cav maps, rageball, DTV, siege and any strat battle without horses. That is most of the game.

HA should be buffed in order to be balanced, or allowed to have different builds for all game types but battle... or removed, which would mean a skill and attribute point reset for all people with HA skill and all loom points given back.

Lessing - I would love to play on a ranged only server, it would be fun, but im insane that wat :-P

About upkeep, the problem with upkeep is that HA pay for the increased archery upkeep, but we already carry most cost than many melee players, and HA delaying is just as bad as campers. I personally will not delay if I dont have a chance, unless i really wanna get one player. I will usually change to sword or stand still to be killed.



To reply to one of jokers all post - A game mode where HA was worth using but its not kill all only would be great, right now HA is nerfed only cos people in battle cry about it. I cant remember the last time someone that only played siege cried about HAs

[Tindel]

Its a beta, if a part of it doesnt add to the whole, doesnt contribute.   Remove it.

[Tindel]

[Kirman]

I like the background music  Anyway, i think HA should be much more effective than Horse Xbow but its still annoying shoot/ride away/shoot/ride away/.....

[Rumblood]

Did those statements come from your ass? What a bunch of crap, cant you ever write something worthwile reading.   YOU can be disqualified.  thankyouverymuch

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[Tindel]

Thats the wrong imagine for that quote,  here you go lad

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No need to thank me, im always ready to help the misinformed.

[Leesin]

I don't care if HA never gets any buffs again tbh. The only builds that don't have a weapon and/or defense vs them is 2h and polearmers that don't have a shield, kind of like how a fast shielder can make a foot archer next to useless in a 1v1 situation. I'm sorry but HA are designed to catch you 2h heroes spinning in circles in the middle of a field because you're so awesome, we have to put you down. Just remember that foot archers > horse archers where accuracy, damage and firing speed is concerned and if you play smart you can nullify a Horse Archers advantages. Give your archers some protection and they should be able to take down the HA's, unless they suck.

[Overdriven]

- Psychological warfare and having fun by annoying the enemy or provoking aggressions is highly unsocial. You seem to forget that after all you don't play AGAINST, but WITH the others, even if they are in the opposing team. They have the same right to have fun like you, and trying to annoy people on purpose is very egoistic and - in my eyes - shows lack of maturity. Because if everybody was trying to annoy the shit out of the others people would GTX by and by, and after some time there is nobody you can play with. Having a community which lasts long means not only to keep the annoyances as low as possible, it also means to keep their distribution as even as possible.

- Yes, there are counter classes in this game. But you always need to look at the whole class balance to determine whether something is okay or not. Yes, a plated 2hd hero is a pretty strong class in many, if not most situations. But if he, in certain situations, has no chance of winning the round, something is not okay in my eyes. I think all classes should have the same chance of influencing the end of the round by the same extend (!). But if the end of the round is achieved by killing all enemies, and a few, mobile and ranged classes are fighting some slow, short ranged ones, I call it unfair. Never mind if both classes have the same amount of kills, or even if the second class has more kills.

Well there are enough dicks in crpg, and people like to rage at HA regardless of whether we are charming or arseholes. So that has pretty much led to my attitude of enjoying making people rage. Otherwise the hate against HA just becomes tiring. It's an inevitability, so why not try your best to do it? That said if there is a player I respect on battle and I recognise them I'll be nice about it a lot of the time. Whether that means just shooting 1 arrow at them and buggering off rather than bumping them periodically/following their horse till it's dead or just leaving them alone entirely I do give some room. But there are enough idiots on crpg to take my frustrations about my class out on.

But a slow arse heavy 2h will likely have a ton of armour? In which case an HA can barely even dent it. When I used barbed arrows they wouldn't even register a hit against heavier armour. Bodkins are only slight better. Not to mention that all you have to do is avoid arrows. Usually by end round weapons have disappeared so no more arrows for HA.

The whole point is that if you want to be melee you have to learn to accept ranged and rely on your cav/ranged to deal with them unless you get lucky and chase one down some how. If they don't then that is the fault of the team. It is a team game after all and no individual can conquer the battlefield. Sure that can be used as 'well HA should be happy with their role' and for the most part I am. But that doesn't stop others asking for buffs when they've been nerfed and HA was nerfed the worst of any. It's not even a big buff. Just people here are particularly unreasonable when it comes to HA and I don't care how much you hate the class, having a little sense and seeing the perspective is far more sensible. But naturally it is a game forum and no way is that going to happen.

[Berserkadin]

Its a beta, if a part of it doesnt add to the whole, doesnt contribute.   Remove it.

Yes please, permaban Tindel because he is such a fascist pig.

[Taser]

Saying that we should consider the fun an archer is having from shooting people that can't fight back is like saying that we should consider the pleasure a parasite is having from leeching victims blood. This game is about melee, your interference into the game mechanics of melee fights by arrow stagger is already more than enough and really frustrating, asking to boost your damage so that you're able to score kills without any risk is ridiculous.

Do realize that you are the guys who bring guns to a knife fight and ruin everyone elses fun.

PS.  Actually I'll just requote one of the first answers. It should end this silly thread right there, no idea what are you even talking about for ten pages.

I'd agree with you if it wasn't for the bolded part in which the OP asked for the removal of the -10 wpf per HA skill and is all he asked for. Its an accuracy boost. Period. End of story.

Although I do disagree that ranged "interferes" but that's my opinion.

[Kafein]

- Psychological warfare and having fun by annoying the enemy or provoking aggressions is highly unsocial. You seem to forget that after all you don't play AGAINST, but WITH the others, even if they are in the opposing team. They have the same right to have fun like you, and trying to annoy people on purpose is very egoistic and - in my eyes - shows lack of maturity. Because if everybody was trying to annoy the shit out of the others people would GTX by and by, and after some time there is nobody you can play with. Having a community which lasts long means not only to keep the annoyances as low as possible, it also means to keep their distribution as even as possible.

I can't emphasize this enough.

[Berserkadin]

I really enjoy playing ranged cav, but it sucks, especielly unloomed. Meleefascist like kafein and taser only thinks about their own fun. If their nerfs and intolerant views destroys the fun of others, they don't give a shit, aslong as they get to slash people without ever having to worry about ranged.

[CrazyCracka420]

Horse archers are part the game, like footman archers, 2h shotgun crossbows, and cavalry lancers.  Some of these may seem "gay" to 2h heroes, but this is a team based game, and all these classes add dimension to the game, and add to the "rock, paper, scissors" experience that makes this game so great.

Long story short:  If you have to wait until the 4 minute mark (3 minutes into the round) before master of the flag pops up, I say deal with it.  Horse archers (even as nerfed as they are) are still very valuable and have their place on the battlefield. 

My advice to people whining about horse archers/crossbows:  Suck it up.  Stop trying to chase down horse archers when you're on foot.  Hide behind a tree or building or shield (or protect your own archers) until MotF comes up

Disclaimer:  I say this as a class who's largest bane is ranged on horseback.  Although they are a lot weaker and less of a threat to me now than they were a year and a half ago.

[IR_Kuoin]

To all the people whining about HAs, try the class before you talk shit about it, then its legit

[Kafein]

I really enjoy playing ranged cav, but it sucks, especielly unloomed.

So, you feel underpowered. Has this anything to do with how fun it is for other classes to fight your class ? No.

Meleefascist like kafein and taser only thinks about their own fun.

Ho I'm sorry, I thought the debate was more like the whole community against HAs

If their nerfs and intolerant views destroys the fun of others,

Again, others ? Who exactly ? HA ? That's hardly a correct use of "others". I mean yeah I am not an HA myself but not everybody else is an HA. Btw "their nerfs" = decisions coming from the balance team.

they don't give a shit, aslong as they get to slash people without ever having to worry about ranged.

Surely I wouldn't use a shield and throwing weapons if that was the case.



Playing as a melee character doesn't generate a tenth of the rage HAs do. Deal with it. This is not an intolerant view, it's a fact. What you just said proves you are yourself extremely egoistic, or trolling.

This is not a balance issue, I would be fine with balanced HA if fighting them was enjoyable. It is not and never will be no matter how much they are nerfed, so I think the only way to solve this problem is to keep the HA population at a minimum.