Shields

[Tovi]

During Middle Age, most fighters had a shield. Look at all pictures of this period, they all have a shield. 2H heroes were very rare (some HRE schock troops, or berserkers, for exemple).
Archers, in Western Europa,were 30 to 50% of an army. In Eastern Europa and in muslim world... almost 100%

[Rebelyell]

During Middle Age, most fighters had a shield. Look at all pictures of this period, they all have a shield. 2H heroes were very rare (some HRE schock troops, or berserkers, for exemple).
Archers, in Western Europa,were 30 to 50% of an army. In Eastern Europa and in muslim world... almost 100%

at last someone got history lessons

[Thedric]

During Middle Age, most fighters had a shield. Look at all pictures of this period, they all have a shield. 2H heroes were very rare (some HRE schock troops, or berserkers, for exemple).
Archers, in Western Europa,were 30 to 50% of an army. In Eastern Europa and in muslim world... almost 100%

I dont ever remember reading about archers kiting when charged by inf. Besides back then inf was not armored (hence the need for shield) so arrows were effective. Once the troops started to wear armor only crossbows and longbows did any real damage.

I dont know where you got your crazy numbers from, but those of us who learn about history by reading instead of looking at pictures know that of all of western europe only England could muster armies with large numbers of archers. Muslims, although effective HA never had pure armies of archers or HA. It is widely documented that they did occasionally "charge"crusader armies, so they must have had a significant number of inf and cav.

All of this is of no import since crpg is made to be fun, not realistic, and archers are making it less fun for the rest of us.

[Torost]

A straight forward simple solution to all the kiting is to raise the PD requirements for all bows..... thus forcing less agi.
But then again , some will whine about bows hitting too hard.

Bows should be remade anyway IMO .. we dont need 8 bows where only 3 of them are usable.(Horn bow,Yumi and Rusbow)
The idea of marginally increasing all the stats is no good.
Should make bows with diffrent traits.
The accurate one - The hard hitting one - The cheap one - The fast one and so on.

Bring back the Warbow! PD10!

[Tore]

Free 10PD 2012

[Siberian_Wolf]

A straight forward simple solution to all the kiting is to raise the PD requirements for all bows..... thus forcing less agi.
But then again , some will whine about bows hitting too hard.

Bows should be remade anyway IMO .. we dont need 8 bows where only 3 of them are usable.(Horn bow,Yumi and Rusbow)

We don't need 200 melee weapons when only 30 of them are usable, shut up with that faulty logic lol.

[OpenPalm]

A straight forward simple solution to all the kiting is to raise the PD requirements for all bows..... thus forcing less agi.
But then again , some will whine about bows hitting too hard.

Bows should be remade anyway IMO .. we dont need 8 bows where only 3 of them are usable.(Horn bow,Yumi and Rusbow)
The idea of marginally increasing all the stats is no good.
Should make bows with diffrent traits.
The accurate one - The hard hitting one - The cheap one - The fast one and so on.

Bring back the Warbow! PD10!

lol

[Kafein]

For having played a lot both with and without shield, it doesn't change anything. As a melee char, you won't kill archers.

That is, unless you have a greater top speed, acceleration, turning angle, have a shield and there are no other ranged enemies that can shoot you.

So yeah, versus one archer, leoking will win.

[Tovi]

With a shield, an archer is not a real threat, and you don't need to chase him.

[Kafein]

With a shield, an archer is not a real threat, and you don't need to chase him.

Well of course, I will wait until he dies of a cerebral-vascular accident. Afterall, in battle you are not forced to kill everybody in the enemy team.

[Adamar]

If you can't chase him, make a ballanced build, wait for the flags, wait until he runs out of arrows, or until he decides he can't kill you without a melee aproach.

But that's boring right?

[Hunter_the_Honourable]

Even if you wait for flags, people think its smart to poll kick you for not chasing him 

[Kafein]

If you can't chase him, make a ballanced build, wait for the flags, wait until he runs out of arrows, or until he decides he can't kill you without a melee aproach.

But that's boring right?

Not only is that boring, but that's assuming your shield doesn't break and that there's only one archer and one shielder. If there are 2 archers and 2 shielders, if the archers have a combined IQ superior to that of an amoeba, the shielders die.

Btw, in this conversation you are implictly saying shielders aren't meant to kill archers. The natural question is, what classes are meant to kill archers ?

(click to show/hide)

And if you have the nerve to say cav I start laughing.

[Adamar]

No, Im suggesting shields can stop arrows, which helps you survive the process of killing an archer. You still need decent athlectics and a notion of timing to kill an archer or more.

[Kafein]

No, Im suggesting shields can stop arrows, which helps you survive the prcess of killing an archer. You still need decent athlectics and a notion of timing to kill an archer or more.

Well, I got 6 athletics, I don't even bother chasing archers, because the "process" of killing one can pretty much take the whole round if he likes running and on top of that is it very dangerous. Actually much more dangerous than fighting melee, since I won't be subject to as much flanking projectiles and cav, or faster melee catching up on me if I stay closer to melee fights.

Also, I'd like you to formulate precisely what do you mean by "a notion of timing".

A shield is only part of what is needed to be called an archer counter. The class that would act as an archer counter as well as archers act as a shieldless melee counter would need to have the speed of horses with the turning ability of humans, and an integral shield.