pike

[Haboe]

well thats not what you said the 1st time, you said with the pike tip behind them when you thrust

or someone did

That also happens, if you got enough ps you wont bounce off him ;) (im using a 33str char and i can do it)

[Tavuk_Bey]

that's why i play ranged, so many ridiculous lulz happen in melee like this case

[Relit]

The amount of Long spear and Pike confusion in this thread is astounding. I agree with every single thing Caita has posted in this thread(except for switching to a sidearm... ever). Lets clear up some things:

1: The Pike cannot do the same maneuvers as the Long spear.
Example: Stabbing a enemy when being facehugged almost never works with a pike, while LS can do it with a slight twist.

2: Pike is not a very good anti-cav weapon.
Reason: The Pike is a cavalry deterrent, long distance weapons like bows and xbows are really the anti-cav. Cavalry players will not get near a pike or LS if they think they will get stopped.

I am a 7 gen Longspear user and a 9 gen Pike user. I never use sidearms so I will refrain from commenting on that sillyness.

[isatis]

time to get that mw pike from market and own noob unaware ppl by holding attack forever


coooool

[Blashyrkh]

if pike/long spear can stab me from 50 cm distance, can you please make my 1h sword stab reach 300 cm?

[Zerran]

if pike/long spear can stab me from 50 cm distance, can you please make my 1h sword stab reach 300 cm?

Sure, but we'll give it an unbalanced tag, make it take two hands, bump it up to three slots, make it only able to thrust, make it unsheathable, make it take polearm proficiency, give it polearm thrust animation, drop the speed down to 68, and call it a Pike.

Oh, and the Pike can't hit targets that are closer than about 1-1.5 meters. Longspear can.

[Felix]

WTF ppl, learn to distinguish long spear from pike. All those lolstabbers are LONG SPEAR USERS, them are stabbing you from 1 cm distance. HATE THEM NEFR THEM we don't care, but stop bitching about PIKES.

[Ragni_Bross]

The pike could easily be fixed but people seem to be against the idea.

The pike is, however, as broken and messed up as can be. It's meant to be a weapon that's easy to manufacture and use, a weapon you could arm hordes of peasants with. At the moment it is way too expensive, it has only one attack, it can block and it cannot be braced. It's all stupid and ridiculous. The thing is that some idiots decided that it had to be a viable "main" weapon. It had to be able to block and be used at extremely close range to satisfy those morons and now we're stuck with a broken pike. The way to fix the pike is to make it a lot cheaper so that those who actually need it can use it. Having a pike so you can stand behind your more powerful allies is great for a low-level pesant struggling to learn how cRPG is. Giving it a high stab would allow two pikemen to work together and defend each other from charging enemies, it'd promote team work! Making it unable to block would mean that it'll have to STAY a support weapon so you can't simply use it point blank. It'd be necessary to have a sidearm but if the pike got more affordable you could easily have both. Make it braceable. This worked great in Deluge and it would allow pikemen to defend valuable allies from horsemen or to protect choke points. The pike could easily be fixed but the problem is that some high-level oafs don't want the pike to be fixed, because those kuyak-dimwits like their messed up fantasy looks.

FIX THE PIKE ALREADY! It's not meant to work like this and you could easily fix it in terms of realism AND balance. Why bother having historically accurate names if all you're keeping is the name and the looks? Make it work like it should

Also, Guiness is a lovely beer.

[Konrax]

The pike could easily be fixed but people seem to be against the idea.

The pike is, however, as broken and messed up as can be. It's meant to be a weapon that's easy to manufacture and use, a weapon you could arm hordes of peasants with. At the moment it is way too expensive, it has only one attack, it can block and it cannot be braced. It's all stupid and ridiculous. The thing is that some idiots decided that it had to be a viable "main" weapon. It had to be able to block and be used at extremely close range to satisfy those morons and now we're stuck with a broken pike. The way to fix the pike is to make it a lot cheaper so that those who actually need it can use it. Having a pike so you can stand behind your more powerful allies is great for a low-level pesant struggling to learn how cRPG is. Giving it a high stab would allow two pikemen to work together and defend each other from charging enemies, it'd promote team work! Making it unable to block would mean that it'll have to STAY a support weapon so you can't simply use it point blank. It'd be necessary to have a sidearm but if the pike got more affordable you could easily have both. Make it braceable. This worked great in Deluge and it would allow pikemen to defend valuable allies from horsemen or to protect choke points. The pike could easily be fixed but the problem is that some high-level oafs don't want the pike to be fixed, because those kuyak-dimwits like their messed up fantasy looks.

FIX THE PIKE ALREADY! It's not meant to work like this and you could easily fix it in terms of realism AND balance. Why bother having historically accurate names if all you're keeping is the name and the looks? Make it work like it should

Also, Guiness is a lovely beer.

I agree with everything except the last comment.

Pike/long spears should want to have a side arm, and those long weapons should become nearly useless in 1v1 and up close. I think being able to jump and swing the weapon at all should also be removed, or have jumping damage reduced since in reality land you actually need to be anchored to the ground to have any real power.

[Lactating Vegetables]

kuyak-dimwits

your confusing 2h with polearms

[Vkvkvk]

I find it funny that the pikemen/longspearmen are lobbying about as hard as Cavalry does, coming up with all the bogus reasons they can possibly find.

[Tears of Destiny]

I find it funny that the pikemen/longspearmen Community are is lobbying about as hard as Cavalry they always does, coming up with all the bogus reasons they can possibly find.

[Zerran]

(click to show/hide)

The pike could easily be fixed but people seem to be against the idea.

The pike is, however, as broken and messed up as can be. It's meant to be a weapon that's easy to manufacture and use, a weapon you could arm hordes of peasants with. At the moment it is way too expensive, it has only one attack, it can block and it cannot be braced. It's all stupid and ridiculous. The thing is that some idiots decided that it had to be a viable "main" weapon. It had to be able to block and be used at extremely close range to satisfy those morons and now we're stuck with a broken pike. The way to fix the pike is to make it a lot cheaper so that those who actually need it can use it. Having a pike so you can stand behind your more powerful allies is great for a low-level pesant struggling to learn how cRPG is. Giving it a high stab would allow two pikemen to work together and defend each other from charging enemies, it'd promote team work! Making it unable to block would mean that it'll have to STAY a support weapon so you can't simply use it point blank. It'd be necessary to have a sidearm but if the pike got more affordable you could easily have both. Make it braceable. This worked great in Deluge and it would allow pikemen to defend valuable allies from horsemen or to protect choke points. The pike could easily be fixed but the problem is that some high-level oafs don't want the pike to be fixed, because those kuyak-dimwits like their messed up fantasy looks.

FIX THE PIKE ALREADY! It's not meant to work like this and you could easily fix it in terms of realism AND balance. Why bother having historically accurate names if all you're keeping is the name and the looks? Make it work like it should

Also, Guiness is a lovely beer.

Making the Pike unable to block doesn't promote teamwork, it promotes people to never ever EVER touch the pike. Please try playing a pikeman before you suggest such nonsense.

Oh, and the Pike wasn't used by peasants, you're thinking of spears. Making a Pike required an extremely long piece of good, straight, wood, which, while not near as expensive as the metal for a knight's armor or such, was not cheap. A pikeman would also be outfitted with a dagger or sword, which would not be needed in the case of a spear, making a pikeman further more expensive to outfit. Now, again, they weren't nearly as expensive as a knight, but they were far more expensive than the peasant gear you're thinking of.

[Zanze]

Here is the argument that for some reason has not been disputed yet.

You argue realism for a pike being able to block? I argue realism for you to be able to block a stab to the face while your "block" is holding your weapon horizontal at the hip. You want to make me unable to block? Fine, then for the sake of realism you shouldn't be able to block my stab by holding your weapon at your waist. Directional block depending on where I am stabbing. Too hard to block against? Then don't argue realism against spears.

[Ragni_Bross]

Making the Pike unable to block doesn't promote teamwork, it promotes people to never ever EVER touch the pike. Please try playing a pikeman before you suggest such nonsense.

Oh, and the Pike wasn't used by peasants, you're thinking of spears. Making a Pike required an extremely long piece of good, straight, wood, which, while not near as expensive as the metal for a knight's armor or such, was not cheap. A pikeman would also be outfitted with a dagger or sword, which would not be needed in the case of a spear, making a pikeman further more expensive to outfit. Now, again, they weren't nearly as expensive as a knight, but they were far more expensive than the peasant gear you're thinking of.

Making the pike unable to block not only promotes teamwork it makes it necessary! If you can't block with your pike you can't use it one-on-one and you need to use a sidearm to fight on. What's wrong with that idea? Makes perfect sense to me.

Making it cheap means that those who don't like the idea of a realistic pike can simply pick something else as it isn't one of the top weapons suddenly being fixed.

By peasant, of course, I mean anything or anyone that isn't me or someone I like (du-uh). I see how that could've caused some confusion but well. It still doesn't change the fact that pikes are waaay too expensive compared to lots of other weapons and because of that you don't see that many low-level characters using them.

Here is the argument that for some reason has not been disputed yet.

You argue realism for a pike being able to block? I argue realism for you to be able to block a stab to the face while your "block" is holding your weapon horizontal at the hip. You want to make me unable to block? Fine, then for the sake of realism you shouldn't be able to block my stab by holding your weapon at your waist. Directional block depending on where I am stabbing. Too hard to block against? Then don't argue realism against spears.

The low block is outrageously stupid but it doesn't change the fact that you CAN block or deflect stabs coming at you with lots of weapons, be they from swords or pikes. The thing is, however, you can't really block a sword with a pike. A pike is way too heavy and it requires both space and time of which you have very little. The low block looks stupid but simply indicates a low guard of some sort or, more likely, a position that is close to the area you want to protect so that your weapon doesn't have to move very long.

Sure, you can block other pikes with your own pike, but the number of weapons you cannot block with a pike is so vast that making the pike able to block is simply put dumb.

We've done a fair amount of pike-work at my Historical Weapons Group and I can tell you that all of what I've said is true based on those lovely sessions :3