Author Topic: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke  (Read 5467 times)

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Offline Turboflex

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #15 on: July 09, 2012, 05:03:42 pm »
0
Bad title and poorly written post but he has a point there was no good reason to nerf 1h overheads/stabs and short hoplites... they weren't even strong attacks before and then cmp got all rude and arrogant about it on the forums even though he didn't even seem to know what people were talking about. Pretty bad balance change that we assume was to nerf lolstabs and drag overheads from long, slow weapons but ended up being collaterally a much harder nerf on already weak attacks for shorter weapons (overhead and stab).

Offline Spook Island

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #16 on: July 09, 2012, 05:04:48 pm »
0
I agree that the nerfs should have been ended 6 months ago, but I fail to see how they're making it more cav friendly?

They are making it more cav friendly by nerfing ground combatants, thereby limiting their effectiveness against cav.
Hence the reason you see most games where the player base consists of about 60% cav or ranged.  Especially now that vertical attacks have become obsolete by comparison.

It comes into effect even more blatantly when you realize the primary anti-cav attack (stab) suffered the largest penalty (seriously, who thought this would be a decent idea?).

Who would have seen the day come when horse riders have an easier time maneuvering their own attacks compared to people who aren't relying on an animal, traveling 30mph, to turn for them.

As crazy already mentioned, the nerfs should have ended months ago.  Now it seems like the Dev's are breaking things just so they can fix them; essentially creating work for themselves.
Well.. at least I hope to god they at least intend to fix them.
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Offline Paul

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2012, 05:15:44 pm »
+8
chadz renown farming again

Offline Spook Island

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2012, 05:16:39 pm »
-2
I don't know why people have a problem with the thread title.  I think it sums up the general idea of of the problem CRPG has run into these past few weeks.  The game was great the way it was just 2-3 months ago.  Sure, there were a few issues here and there, but they were all extremely minor and didn't take away the magic of the mod the devs worked so hard to create and maintain. 

There comes a time when you sharpen a sword so much that what you're left with is a small dagger.

To me, this is the perfect metaphor that represents what went wrong with the last few patches.
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Offline Son Of Odin

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2012, 05:21:13 pm »
+1
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Offline Tzar

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2012, 05:33:38 pm »
0
Polestagger removal was the best choice the devs had made in a long while.

Hoping pierce on bodkins gets removed next so we don't have retarded high lvl Snipers/Archers running around making you feel like you a zombie in some random crappy zombie shooter..

Turn speed nerf is annoying but you can work around it with some practice. granted it looks retarded when u have to land some urgent hits but its doable.
wouldn't mind to see it get reverted tho..
I've never played a server where people split up as much or as often as on EU1.  No wonder range is having a field day.

Offline Adamar

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #21 on: July 09, 2012, 06:27:43 pm »
0
They are making it more cav friendly by nerfing ground combatants, thereby limiting their effectiveness against cav.

The overhead attack nerf only makes melee fights slightly more demanding. What do archery and cav have to do with it, if they already had an inferior melee capability? Your misguied rage threatens your judgement young one.

Offline Strider

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2012, 06:34:17 pm »
+4
I Agree with spook island. We should stop trying to buff/nerf things over and over. Find a good balanced spot and keep it there.
Devs should use their precious time on more important things like new features/new gamemodes/new gear.
We don't need our beloved devs to waste time on things that will always be complained about.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2012, 06:44:09 pm by Strider »

Offline CrazyCracka420

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2012, 07:09:41 pm »
+2
I Agree with spook island. We should stop trying to buff/nerf things over and over. Find a good balanced spot and keep it there.
Devs should use their precious time on more important things like new features/new gamemodes/new gear.
We don't need our beloved devs to waste time on things that will always be complained about.

I blame the balance team.  They would be out of work if they just stopped "balancing things".  I swear they implement a nerf or change stats on an item and then the dev's have to clean up the mess. 

Nerfing one thing has a domino effect on lots of other classes, playstyles, and equipment.  It usually leads to other things needing to be nerfed to compensate and it's a never ending cycle.

Honestly, the game is currently balanced for classes, and I think going back about 6 or 8 months (maybe longer now) the game was even more balanced (before they made pikes/longspears into 3 slots).  I don't think there is anything in the game that is "broken" enough to require developer or balance team intervention (in regards to nerfs/buffs).
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Offline Spook Island

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2012, 07:11:13 pm »
0
The overhead attack nerf only makes melee fights slightly more demanding. What do archery and cav have to do with it, if they already had an inferior melee capability? Your misguied rage threatens your judgement young one.

Cav have couching, speed, and generally weapon length or range on their side, not to mention bumping...  Ever seen someone ride around with a steel shield on a plated charger just bumping people instead of fighting?
You can't make the argument cav have inferior melee capability at all.  With the new stabbing nerf, there really is no question about it.  Hence why you see the rampant overload of cavalry in servers now more than ever before. 

And the whole "work around it" excuse is the worst blanket defense there is.  The people who should be "working around it" are the people who complained about swinging mechanics that have been in the mod for a couple years now, and were never deemed an issue, until a few pike users ruined some players (who didn't know how to simply block down) day.

I like seeing new additions to CRPG as long as they make the game more exciting and fun, while keeping balance with gameplay.

The recent changes were definitely the complete opposite of such an addition.


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Offline rufio

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2012, 07:19:40 pm »
-5
why is it only americans complaining about the changes?? all the players i know whom i deem good and experienced in crpg find the current changes good ones, these are all players with over 2k hours in crpg. ( all that these changes did is making melee have to time theyr releases better, nothing else changed, ..... except for blatantly stupid single player ai ballancing polestagger)
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Offline Spook Island

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2012, 07:46:28 pm »
+2
why is it only americans complaining about the changes?? all the players i know whom i deem good and experienced in crpg find the current changes good ones, these are all players with over 2k hours in crpg. ( all that these changes did is making melee have to time theyr releases better, nothing else changed, ..... except for blatantly stupid single player ai ballancing polestagger)

Honestly, it's a wide consensus on the NA servers, even among Admins, that it's the EU players who seem to be consistently calling for these recent nerfs to be put into place.

I wasn't going to bring it up, but maybe it needs to be addressed as well.  I'm guessing that is partly why we saw the polestun nerf be applied to EU before NA.

The vast majority of American players don't want to see ground combat watered down.  Quite the opposite.  Having cav in the game is a nice feature you don't find in another FPS medieval mods, but ultimately, Melee Combat for footsoldiers will always be the core bread and butter of the game (as it most definitely should be).  Simplifying the mechanics to make it easier on newer or less adept players who feel its somehow unfair to be able to pivot while attacking vertically doesn't enrich the gameplay.  It only waters it down.

So to your statement, Rufio: Americans only started complaining once EU players decided that melee should be vastly dumbed down for whatever reason still evades me.  At this rate in a few months, we won't be able to attack while moving, be able to jump, or even be able to turn into our horizontal swings.  Maybe after a year, we'll have autoblock turned on for everybody.
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Offline Haboe

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2012, 07:53:03 pm »
+2
I like how you bring up the NA vs EU argument after loads of posts with arguments that no one agrees to.

A argument no one can prove or disprove as a final statement, lovely way not to lose an argument (what this post has become) and drag it on to eternity.
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Offline TurmoilTom

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2012, 07:56:14 pm »
+3
It isn't that EU prefers "watered down" combat and NA prefers "enriched" combat.

It's the fact that some people want an "Arcade" cRPG (where the skill ceiling and skill floor are as far away from one another as possible) and other dudes want a "Realistic" cRPG (where combat isn't the priority, realism is the priority).

Whether someone is NA or EU has nothing to do with which side they are on.

Offline Turboflex

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Re: Devs, Please Stop "Fixing" Things that Aren't Broke
« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2012, 08:11:21 pm »
+2
rufio is cmp's clan buddy of course he will defend silly changes. derp derp americans so bad.

IN absolute terms, melee was dumbed down because 2 directional attacks were made weaker, and they weren't even strong attacks in the first place. For shorter weapons, overhead and stab have become much more difficult to pull off and have a very limited adjustment cone, and you have to be extremely careful when using them. Were they overpowered before? No, they were mediocre and situational, they weren't the best attack. I'm kind of annoyed cuz as a 1h fighter I now have even less options and have to crutch on my left swing even more so the fighting has been made less fun, and no real positive balance taken place since the nerfed things were not even unbalanced.