Author Topic: compensate for taking away polestun  (Read 2909 times)

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Offline Hunter_the_Honourable

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compensate for taking away polestun
« on: June 14, 2012, 12:24:36 pm »
-12
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Offline Leshma

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2012, 12:36:10 pm »
+3
Polestagger was a chance to deal more damage. Polearms should get more raw damage. Simple as that.

Offline Hunter_the_Honourable

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2012, 12:39:42 pm »
0
tbh Anything would do but just taking away the stun has just made it frustrating for me when I hit people More damage would be good for replacing the stun but then people going to QQ that its OP because it will kill them but I guess thats just how it is
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Offline Vodner

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2012, 12:58:10 pm »
+3
The ideal longterm situation (in my opinion) would be to give polearms swing animations that aren't terrible:
  • Both side-swing directions can easily hit teammates that are nearly behind you, and will readily catch on any nearby obstructions
  • There is currently no reason to use the left swing over the right swing - the left swing has lower reach, and is far more likely to glance if you hit early in the animation
  • The overhead places anybody near your rear at risk, and is nearly unusable when attacking downhill
  • The thrust is fine as-is

The 'dueling' spears - warspear, spear, etc - also need a buff to side-swing damage. Previously the swings were a way to line up a stun, so that you could get a thrust in.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2012, 01:08:03 pm by Vodner »

Offline Teeth

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2012, 01:11:10 pm »
-2
what the title says, I expect allot of 2hers to post saying polearms are fine now but when I hit someone with a fully loomed poleaxe with 6ps and they barely flinch....makes no sense to me and the fact that a 1her has more stun confuses me even more.
What? There is no difference in stun duration after a hit with any weapon. Its just that 1h are faster.

Polearms were OP, they can have polestagger taken out without anything to compensate. They are perfectly fine.

but when I hit someone just as I finish my swing my opponent swings back instantly and I don't have a chance to block because my swing hasn't finished -.-
Not really sure what you are saying, but it seems to me this only applies to unbalanced weapons, cause you can always interrupt your swing and block with your aforementioned poleaxe. When you hit someone he cannot swing back immediately. If he can it is due to having a very fast weapon and your positioning being wrong. In any case this is not a polearm specific problem and all the other classes would have to deal with this aswell.

Imagine taking away the stun from 2hers, suddenly 2hers become allot harder to play no?
What stun? Only polearms had a specific sort of stun, polestagger to be more precise. Thats why it had to go, it was an unecessary class specific advantage. 2h do not have stun, so you are on a level playing field with 2h now. Life is difficult eh, getting your class balanced with the other ones after being OP.

The ideal longterm situation (in my opinion) would be to give polearms side-swing animations that aren't worthless. Both side-swing directions can easily hit teammates that are nearly behind you, and will readily catch on any nearby obstructions. Also, there is currently much no reason to use the left swing over the right swing - the left swing has lower reach, and is far more likely to glance if you hit early in the animation.
The right swing is an awesome attack, which has very little range reduction compared to other polearm attacks. You pretty much grab it like a 2h when rightswinging. Great about the right swing is also that you can cancel it very far into the animation. These late feints got me many a good hit in. The left swing is shit though.

The overhead is a fucking great attack. The animation exactly follows the center of your screen. It is much easier to aim than the 2h overhead. First thing I noticed when I went polearm after 2h was the ease with which I could split heads with the overhead. You can barely miss it. With the 40+ cut weapons it is mostly 1 to 2 shots to the head. With 130-140 length weapons you can use it in close quarters no problem. 

The 'dueling' spears - warspear, spear, etc - also need a buff to side-swing damage. Previously the swings were a way to line up a stun, so that you could get a thrust in.
Agreed, these side swings are quite useless now, rendering the entire group of weapons useless.

Offline Hunter_the_Honourable

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2012, 01:26:24 pm »
0
Teeth 2h DO have stun if you havent seen it then are you sure your fighting 2hers? and the Poleaxe is not unbalanced yet people still swing before I finish my swing and when I say that I mean my attack has hit them but before my guy holds his weapon properly im hit my self

What stun? Only polearms had a specific sort of stun, polestagger to be more precise. Thats why it had to go, it was an unecessary class specific advantage. 2h do not have stun, so you are on a level playing field with 2h now. Life is difficult eh, getting your class balanced with the other ones after being OP.

I never said the stun wasn't OP infact I said it was and could of done with the nerf, and if polearms are on the same "playing field" how come 2hers are the better choice? faster, longer stab reach then nearly all polearms and they do get a stun/stagger.

Hardly a level playing field when 2hers have the advantage
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Offline [ptx]

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  • such OP. so bundle of sticks. wow.
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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2012, 01:27:43 pm »
0
wat

Offline Teeth

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2012, 01:28:54 pm »
0
Lemme guess, played polearms forever?

Offline Hunter_the_Honourable

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2012, 01:31:20 pm »
0
Played 2her at the start and have an alt for every class so I am not just basing it on my main character
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Offline Vodner

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2012, 01:33:28 pm »
0
Quote
2hers are the better choice? faster, longer stab reach then nearly all polearms and they do get a stun/stagger.
Two-handed weapons do not stagger. If you get hit with one, then you will still always have time to block the followup attack.

Offline Hunter_the_Honourable

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2012, 01:43:03 pm »
0
perhaps but I rarely see it, perhaps its because I dont play EU 1.

But still I agree with leshmas Idea
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I never trust Humans.

Offline Lichen

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2012, 04:34:35 pm »
-1
Maybe give long axes and bardiches more damage BUT also make them all unbalanced.

Offline Penitent

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2012, 05:15:12 pm »
0
People were saying it was a bit OP.  I never noticed, but that's not the point.

Taking it away was a big move.  Why not just reduce the stagger change by a %? 

The game is largely balance, and we need fine strokes to tune it I think, not complete changes, respectfully.

Offline oprah_winfrey

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2012, 07:07:09 pm »
0
Quote from: Paul
On a normal hit(1h, 2h) strike and strike2 animations are called. They got a duration of about 0.5 to 0.6s depending on hit location. They are the same as in Native and can be checked with the Native MS in the animations.py. On a polearm hit there is a 50% chance that strike3 are called instead and they got a duration of 0.8 to 1s. The code says that polearms with the knockdown flag never call the strike3 animation.

I am assuming the devs simply removed strike3, so polearms will cause the same stagger as any other weapon.

Offline Teeth

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Re: compensate for taking away polestagger
« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2012, 07:18:57 pm »
0
Taking it away was a big move.  Why not just reduce the stagger change by a %? 
Because having a random chance of getting two hits in an opponent which only works for one specific class is not at all a desirable game mechanic.