0 Weaponmaster should not be viable.

[Tears of Destiny]

Well straight up buffing WM would inadvertently buff ranged classes, but if you mean do something to make them help melee exclusively then I agree.

Yup, I was assuming that range would be adjusted accordingly by steepening the accuracy curve for bows and crossbows and throwing, and/or increasing the wpf/pd ratio.

Range is perfectly fine, it is the melee that needs the buff.

[kinngrimm]

Yup, I was assuming that range would be adjusted accordingly by steepening the accuracy curve for bows and crossbows and throwing, and/or increasing the wpf/pd ratio.

Range is perfectly fine, it is the melee that needs the buff.

so what you say is if wm gets a buff, then at the same time the ranged wmp distribution needs a slight nerf?

[rustyspoon]

Range is perfectly fine, it is the melee that needs the buff.

I honestly don't see why melee needs a WPF buff, or why the devs should spend the time rebalancing a bunch of shit just to make that work.

WM has its uses, it's just not for every build nor should it be. If you're using a slow weapon, WM is VERY useful. If you're using a very fast weapon, it's not that big of a deal. I don't see what the problem is.

[kinngrimm]

i tested from 120 - 190 wpf, before and after the big respec patch a year ago

i narrowed it down for the weapon i use to 140(other weapons do need different amounts also different playstyles and different classes do need different amounts) So a steel pick which i use is just fine with 140. With 160 which for me is a notable difference to 140 a steel pick is at its peak. With lvl 37 i intend to reach it, in 4 years  from now

A bit more general: For 1h weapons with a base speed around 98-101, for me it feels like their peak is in between 140 and 160 wpm, afterwards the increase is not worth mentioning.

[Tears of Destiny]

so what you say is if wm gets a buff, then at the same time the ranged wmp distribution needs a slight nerf?

I'm saying that a buff to WM would buff range, so the curve/penalties would have to be readjusted so that in the end (the long run), range is not effected and only melee is better then what it is now.

[Tzar]

While i agree that the 120 wpf might be alot from not investing any points into wpf i simly dont wanna see it go because combat is slow hell all ready this would just slower the speed even more 

[Slev23]

Archery should just be on a different WPF system than melee for obvious reasons. I agree that WPF needs to have a reward. I made a 39/3 STF duelist with a katana and honestly, it feels leaps faster than my 24/15 polearm, albeit, the katana is fast, but it shows how useless wpf is right now.

[Ninja_Khorin]

Au contraire, my old friend.

I think in an optimal world all builds should be viable.

[Knute]

I'd say leave the no WM people alone but significantly decrease weapon upkeep costs for those with high MW, maybe even make it branch out to armor a little bit? 

This would emulate a trained weapon user being less rough on his equipment (heh) than a strength build who's strong but kinda dumb.

[Grumbs]

I vote for less WPF gained per level. Then buff general accuracy of ranged to compensate

Or make WPF tied more to damage per hit rather than speed of attack

[ThePoopy]

speed should depend more on build and less on weapon

[IR_Kuoin]

Sounds like a good idea, atleast for a wpf spammer, mehself

[rufio]

no just no, dont touch it, no no no no no thomek why do you come with such suggestions, no non ononono its gonna ruin the game totally, nonononono thomek you are a pariah  , nononono dont do it , no nonono

[Berserkadin]

Well, why the hell dont you make IF mandatory too? You could buff WM but dont make it mandatory.

[Kafein]

Btw, I think there are linked problems here :

Melee isn't dependent on wpf enough (fighting with 1 wpf is harder but not impossible either)
Range is too dependent on wpf (especially archers)
The balance between the free and the WM wpf isn't right.

So : sharpen the wpf dependency of melee and smooth that of range, reduce the wpf/level and increase the wpf/WM.