autobalance is awful

[BADPLAYERold]

i know complete balance is impossible to achieve in this game really, id just like a somewhat even amount of cav/ranged on each team because depending on the map having a large amount of either of them is an insane advantage.

[Lactose_the_intolerant]

you dont want complete balance or there would never be *5

[Turboflex]

others have said, but the real prob is cav is overpowered.

auto-balance works for banners just fine, but it can't balance OP cav and people take advantage by stacking onto a single cav banner (GK on EU, BRD on NA).

Cav needs to be nerfed hard, it's just retarded atm and wrecking game. Superfast horse all over only backstabbing and horsebumping is not fun, nor is trying to swivel 360 constantly to watch for them. Not even getting to HX people who delay round ends even tho they outnumbered 10 to 1.

There's no downside to cav, the expense doesnt matter since loom points are 650k and rising, that will fund many gens of expensive gear, you get huge speed and utility bonus, and when your horse is killed under you, you fight on without a scratch like nothing happened.

My solution is (if possible in engine) horsedeath should cause large damage to rider in the fall, preferably based on speed + horse size.

[Vexus]

It's not possible to have an autobalance after first round and another after 3rd round or some other round?

I rather prefer having a "class tag" on our characters depending on what skills we learn and autobalance would filter from there but that is something that was suggested long long long ago but as you can see it wasn't implemented.

[BADPLAYERold]

man you are an idiot, boo hoo cavalry is OP because i'm retarded and bad at the game and can't kill them. please shut up about things you have no idea about thanks.

i am one of the only cavalry players who want cav nerfed in some ways, but in many many ways it is very easy to kill cav. when i'm dismounted 95% of cav are free kills since they are so bad. learn to play the game before talking about balance.

[Kafein]

I love how everyone always think we win because of teamplay and tactics.

Well you can call it the way you like it, but I consider sticking with your bro's in a tightly packed polearm salad something different from what the pubs usually do (the well-known "charge in every possible direction" tactic)

others have said, but the real prob is cav is overpowered.

auto-balance works for banners just fine, but it can't balance OP cav and people take advantage by stacking onto a single cav banner (GK on EU, BRD on NA).

Cav needs to be nerfed hard, it's just retarded atm and wrecking game. Superfast horse all over only backstabbing and horsebumping is not fun, nor is trying to swivel 360 constantly to watch for them. Not even getting to HX people who delay round ends even tho they outnumbered 10 to 1.

There's no downside to cav, the expense doesnt matter since loom points are 650k and rising, that will fund many gens of expensive gear, you get huge speed and utility bonus, and when your horse is killed under you, you fight on without a scratch like nothing happened.

My solution is (if possible in engine) horsedeath should cause large damage to rider in the fall, preferably based on speed + horse size.

Lol troll moar... Cav is the weakest of all classes in 1v1 combat, deal with it. We end up being sneaky backstabbers because it's the only thing we have left, and it's the only thing some players will never learn to defend against.

[EyeBeat]

My solution is (if possible in engine) horsedeath should cause large damage to rider in the fall, preferably based on speed + horse size.

Been saying this since day 1.

Either reduce horse bump damage to 0.  Or make it so riders take damage on falls.

[Vexus]

I'd rather have that than the insane amount of time it takes to go up it is now (The duration was extended. With a fast weapon your able to hit twice a downed cav before he's able to wake up.).

[Loar Avel]

I love how everyone always think we win because of teamplay and tactics.

"Move foward and RAPE them all!" IS a valable tactic ;)

[Joker86]

Step 1:

Clean out all maps that are not perfectly even.

Check out if there are "natural fortifications" (turning battles into "soft" sieges), if the distances to choke points are equal (the team spawning closer to the central bridge will lose in the majority of all cases), and if both teams spawn on the same height level (so one team doesn't need to fight uphill).

Step 2:

Remove banner balance

Step 3:

Implement faction balance.

It's basically like the faction system of strategus. It works over the character page, not ingame by banner. You can either create your own faction, or join an existing one by dropdown menu and "apply" button.

Being the leader of a faction you get a rudimentary faction managment menu, like a member list and buttons next to them, like "promote" to make them either officer (can accept applications, too) or the new leader (can change all settings like faction name and stuff) or demote, for obvious reasons. Also a "kick" button is probably needed. You also get a list of applications with "accept" or "decline". All actions taken are saved in a small log which can be read by every member, so you see who gets promoted, demoted or kicked by whome, to prevent people of messing around with it and "being funny".

Auto balance now asks for your faction, instead of your banner. No more banner whoring.

Step 4:

Implement (hidden) player classes.

According to his skills and equipment, players get classified (right word? Or did I say they were made secret?) on the character page.

1. Check riding skill. Higher as 2? Rider. If not: Footman.
2. If rider: check horse archer skill. If higher than 0: horse archer. If not: cavalry.
3. If horse archer: check highest ranged WPF. Depending on this result classified as HA, HX or HT.
4. If cavalry: check highest melee WPF. Depending on this result classified as lancer, 1hd cav or 2hd cav.
5. If footman: check if Power Draw or Power Throw > 3. If so, classify as archer or thrower.
6. If no archer or thrower, check WPF in crossbow. If >74, then classify as crossbowman.
7. If no ranged fighter, check shield skill. If > 3, then classify as shieldman.
8. If shieldman, check whether highest WPF is polearm. If so, classify as hoplite.
9. If shieldman but no hoplite, classify as 1hd + shield.
10. If no shieldman, check highest WPF. If highest WPF 2hd, classify as 2hd infantry.
11. If 2hd infantry, check for crushthrough weapon. If so, classify as crushthrough infantry.
12. If no shieldman and no 2hd infantry, only polearm is left. If polearm infantry, check for pike weapon. If so, classify as pikeman.
13. If polearm infantry but no pikeman, classify as 2hd poleinfantry.
14. If no class can be applied, classify as peasant/weird hybrid.

This way the game knows exactly which class you are, recalling the prepared data as soon as you enter the server. It is rechecked on the server every time you change your weapons.

Step 5:
 
Track player skill.

Take his k/d into concern as well as his w/l ratio. Add the w/l ration on the character page, btw., it's a value I'd only be too pleased to see on the character page. Add this to his level, generation and the value of the items he equipped, and you've got a rough value about the player's personal experience.


Step 6:

Make fair teams.

First distribute the faction squads evenly among the teams (Biggest suqad to team A. 2nd and 3rd biggest squads to team B, 4th and 5th to team A again, and so on). Then look at the factionless pool, and distribute the classes accordingly. If you can't make up an overweight of one class with the same class on the other team, then fill up with their "counter class". The choice which class player gets into which team is solved by the player values.

Step 7:

Implement a command system.

So players can actually have a bigger impact on how well their team does. A command system would allow teams to adapt to superior enemies and turn the tables. Without command system you need a few horrible steamrolls to get people to listen and follow certain tactics.

Step 8:


Change multiplier system.

With a good working balance player would be stuck on x1 or x2 most of the time, not being able to wear any but the cheapest equipment. Either change the multiplier system, for example a loss gives only -1 on multiplier, instead of resetting it, and/or lowering upkeep cost accordingly, making a x5 even more of a reward.

[hippy_with_a_scimi]

decent ideas man ,


i want total random teams EACH ROUND  , so that we can only blame bad luck and not a retarded system

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

I love how everyone always think we win because of teamplay and tactics.

I said the opposite... YOU'RE WRONG TEETH!!!

[Turboflex]

man you are an idiot, boo hoo cavalry is OP because i'm retarded and bad at the game and can't kill them. please shut up about things you have no idea about thanks.

i am one of the only cavalry players who want cav nerfed in some ways, but in many many ways it is very easy to kill cav. when i'm dismounted 95% of cav are free kills since they are so bad. learn to play the game before talking about balance.

yeah cav is easy to kill if the cav is a moron who runs straight at someone who is watching him and has a weapon ready. which is why cavs with half a brain get their kills by running down people who are distracted (by other cavs or in combat). Cavs are basically lamers who get their kills by 1) backstabbing and 2) stunning people with horsebump. Neither of these practices adds much to the quality of the gameplay, especially in their current widespread state.

 There's no downside to starting the round on a horse, besides cost, which is being obliterated by loompoint prices. If you added something like damage from your horse dieing under you, it would add some balance to the equation.

[Stabby_Dave]

Step 1:

Clean out all maps that are not perfectly even.

Check out if there are "natural fortifications" (turning battles into "soft" sieges), if the distances to choke points are equal (the team spawning closer to the central bridge will lose in the majority of all cases), and if both teams spawn on the same height level (so one team doesn't need to fight uphill).

Step 2:

Remove banner balance

Step 3:

Implement faction balance.

It's basically like the faction system of strategus. It works over the character page, not ingame by banner. You can either create your own faction, or join an existing one by dropdown menu and "apply" button.

Being the leader of a faction you get a rudimentary faction managment menu, like a member list and buttons next to them, like "promote" to make them either officer (can accept applications, too) or the new leader (can change all settings like faction name and stuff) or demote, for obvious reasons. Also a "kick" button is probably needed. You also get a list of applications with "accept" or "decline". All actions taken are saved in a small log which can be read by every member, so you see who gets promoted, demoted or kicked by whome, to prevent people of messing around with it and "being funny".

Auto balance now asks for your faction, instead of your banner. No more banner whoring.

Step 4:

Implement (hidden) player classes.

According to his skills and equipment, players get classified (right word? Or did I say they were made secret?) on the character page.

1. Check riding skill. Higher as 2? Rider. If not: Footman.
2. If rider: check horse archer skill. If higher than 0: horse archer. If not: cavalry.
3. If horse archer: check highest ranged WPF. Depending on this result classified as HA, HX or HT.
4. If cavalry: check highest melee WPF. Depending on this result classified as lancer, 1hd cav or 2hd cav.
5. If footman: check if Power Draw or Power Throw > 3. If so, classify as archer or thrower.
6. If no archer or thrower, check WPF in crossbow. If >74, then classify as crossbowman.
7. If no ranged fighter, check shield skill. If > 3, then classify as shieldman.
8. If shieldman, check whether highest WPF is polearm. If so, classify as hoplite.
9. If shieldman but no hoplite, classify as 1hd + shield.
10. If no shieldman, check highest WPF. If highest WPF 2hd, classify as 2hd infantry.
11. If 2hd infantry, check for crushthrough weapon. If so, classify as crushthrough infantry.
12. If no shieldman and no 2hd infantry, only polearm is left. If polearm infantry, check for pike weapon. If so, classify as pikeman.
13. If polearm infantry but no pikeman, classify as 2hd poleinfantry.
14. If no class can be applied, classify as peasant/weird hybrid.

This way the game knows exactly which class you are, recalling the prepared data as soon as you enter the server. It is rechecked on the server every time you change your weapons.

Step 5:
 
Track player skill.

Take his k/d into concern as well as his w/l ratio. Add the w/l ration on the character page, btw., it's a value I'd only be too pleased to see on the character page. Add this to his level, generation and the value of the items he equipped, and you've got a rough value about the player's personal experience.


Step 6:

Make fair teams.

First distribute the faction squads evenly among the teams (Biggest suqad to team A. 2nd and 3rd biggest squads to team B, 4th and 5th to team A again, and so on). Then look at the factionless pool, and distribute the classes accordingly. If you can't make up an overweight of one class with the same class on the other team, then fill up with their "counter class". The choice which class player gets into which team is solved by the player values.

Great ideas but actually implementing them would take a lot of work. It would basically be completely redesigning the entire autobalance system.

[Gravoth_iii]

Its not always the autobalance's fault. You cant blame it when your team is repeating the same tactic over and over when it clearly isnt working. Autobalance does a decent job, but you cant rely on it making your team win.

And for bannerbalance i think its a good thing that teamwork gets this, because teamwork in a game like this should be rewarded.

Thirdly, if cav gets stacked on one team you just have to adapt, stick with pikemen and camp ruins. Then charge out when archers have pinned down enough horsies.