Author Topic: archery..  (Read 53518 times)

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Offline Kafein

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Re: archery..
« Reply #795 on: April 26, 2012, 07:18:13 pm »
0
Except that he/she isn't a shielder. I have zero sympathy for dehorsed cavalry. QQ elsewhere.

Anything else to say ? I had 7 ath, 6 shield skill and 120 1h wpf with that guy. The fact that I was cav too is irrelevant.

Unless you bring some actual argument, my point stands...

Offline Rumblood

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Re: archery..
« Reply #796 on: April 26, 2012, 07:20:35 pm »
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The fact that you are cavalry is all the argument needed.

/win
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Offline Kafein

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Re: archery..
« Reply #797 on: April 26, 2012, 07:22:41 pm »
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The fact that you are cavalry is all the argument needed.

/win

Okay I think I need that image again.

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The other party being unable to answer any of the points being made, I think I won. Thank you for your participation.

Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: archery..
« Reply #798 on: April 26, 2012, 07:23:24 pm »
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Hmm, to be fair, he does have the athletics and shield skill to properly participate in this argument. If he was a 6 shield 0 athletic cavalry then yes I would understand ignoring him, but considering his build I have to take him in consideration.

Cavalry builds are usually ignored due to not having the prerequisite skills to mimic a shielder, but in this case due to his abnormal level/build he can mimic a normal level 30 shielder for the intents of this discussion.

That is just my opinion from an objective viewpoint though.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2012, 07:25:13 pm by Tears of Destiny »
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Offline rufio

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Re: archery..
« Reply #799 on: April 26, 2012, 07:24:58 pm »
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Offline MrShine

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Re: archery..
« Reply #800 on: April 26, 2012, 07:28:43 pm »
+1
As a shielder, when I fight two skilled melee I still have a very far from ridiculous chance of winning. As a shielder, my chances of winning against two skilled archers are less than 0.5%

Now if you don't see the problem here, I don't think we can progress in this discussion.

The wall of text was funny, but DAMN are you a big whiner.

Steps to deal with 2 archers:
-Chase the archer who seems to be slower/has the bigger bow. 
-Use '~' and only raise your shield when one of them has the bow drawn.  Be ready to do a 180 turn to catch arrows in your back.

If your shield is in good condition it's going to take a lot of time for their arrows to break it.  If it's towards the end of the round one/both will likely be out before your shield breaks.  In either case there is going to be plenty of time for one of them to make a mistake, or perhaps you might even catch the one behind you with their pants down if you quickly change targets if he gets too close.

I've had plenty of success in the past in 2v1 situations like this.  Of course the odds are stacked against me and if there are more than 2 left or my shield breaks I'm usually screwed, but boo hoo.

In conclusion: Sack up and stop whining.

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Offline Dezilagel

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Re: archery..
« Reply #801 on: April 26, 2012, 08:08:22 pm »
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Kafein, stop whineing. I just did gen as 2hander, NO problem dodging, NO problem catching most archers, some I couldnt catch but they couldnt escape far enough to pull back either, I just press w+t and wait till the kid gets bored.

Sure, sometimes your not paying attention, you get shot. Before that I was shielder, with round shield. Was shot....once? Two times maybe, caught all archers, killed all archers.


Now, in a 2v1 situation, if your enemy IS NOT a noob, your dead. You say you have a better chance vs 2 melee than 2 ranged. YOU DONT. You have EQUAL chance against 2 noobs, but you fight 2 decent players, YOUR DEAD. Your not especially good, you dont think much when you play, infact....your pure pecores. Im done here, this thread is pure farce.

Oh god.

Firstly, you are a horrible melee player. Really. The personal attacks are weak, but coming from you it's just downright pathetic.

Secondly: 2v1 vs. melee is a very common situation and one that is very much doable. 1v2 vs. shitty/mediocre players is easy, 1v2 vs. good players is hard, but most certainly doable.

2v1 vs. archers of ANY skill level is just complete pain though, provided the archers have an IQ >50 and decide to move apart.

There is no real comparison between fighting melee and "fighting" archers. If you kill an archer it's because you have enough ath/light enough armor/good enough shield... etc. Skilless, and boring.

If you fight and kill a melee player though it's because you beat him straight up in a fight. The fight is essentially what I play M@B for, it's fun, exciting and you're actually fighting someone on equal terms rather than forcing him to chase you in a long sequence of complete boredom while you try to pepper him using a 2003-ish aiming system of epic fail.

I honestly don't care about you archer and your "but archery takes skill!!!!!11111oneoneone". Yeah there are good archers and there are bad ones but whereas fighting good players is enjoyable the only thing that increases with the skill of the opposing archer is the amount of annoyance.

Granted, you might say the same about melee players, but shouldn't we really be playing different games then? And if fighting other archers is what you're after then why are there hardly any archers on the duel server?

+ I often get from archers "but archery is so tough, you have to be lv 25 to do any real damage". And you''re right. Archery REALLY sucks at low levels. And why is that? Because it's so incredibly stat-based! There's a reason for the whine about the performance difference of high lv + fully loomed archers vs. normal ones. Also: I once dueled and beat 11 people on a battle server at round end, at level 12! With peasant clothes and a spear! Could I do that as an archer? No way. And why is that...? Make what you want out of it.

Okay time to /endrant

The wall of text was funny, but DAMN are you a big whiner.

Steps to deal with 2 archers:
-Chase the archer who seems to be slower/has the bigger bow. 
-Use '~' and only raise your shield when one of them has the bow drawn.  Be ready to do a 180 turn to catch arrows in your back.

If your shield is in good condition it's going to take a lot of time for their arrows to break it.  If it's towards the end of the round one/both will likely be out before your shield breaks.  In either case there is going to be plenty of time for one of them to make a mistake, or perhaps you might even catch the one behind you with their pants down if you quickly change targets if he gets too close.

I've had plenty of success in the past in 2v1 situations like this.  Of course the odds are stacked against me and if there are more than 2 left or my shield breaks I'm usually screwed, but boo hoo.

In conclusion: Sack up and stop whining.



And what if the archers are non-retarded ones and actually time their shots?
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Offline Tears of Destiny

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Re: archery..
« Reply #802 on: April 26, 2012, 08:09:32 pm »
+2
And what if the archers are non-retarded ones and actually time their shots?
Then you will die just as easily as if you are fighting two melee who are timing their strikes so you literally don't have any time to counter attack.
I'm not normal and I don't pretend so, my approach is pretty much a bomb crescendo.
Death is a fun way to pass the time though, several little bullets moving in staccato.
The terror of my reign will live on in infamy, singing when they die like a dead man's symphony.

Offline Kafein

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Re: archery..
« Reply #803 on: April 26, 2012, 08:12:36 pm »
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The wall of text was funny, but DAMN are you a big whiner.

Steps to deal with 2 archers:
-Chase the archer who seems to be slower/has the bigger bow. 
-Use '~' and only raise your shield when one of them has the bow drawn.  Be ready to do a 180 turn to catch arrows in your back.

If your shield is in good condition it's going to take a lot of time for their arrows to break it.  If it's towards the end of the round one/both will likely be out before your shield breaks.  In either case there is going to be plenty of time for one of them to make a mistake, or perhaps you might even catch the one behind you with their pants down if you quickly change targets if he gets too close.

I've had plenty of success in the past in 2v1 situations like this.  Of course the odds are stacked against me and if there are more than 2 left or my shield breaks I'm usually screwed, but boo hoo.

In conclusion: Sack up and stop whining.

That's usually what I do and sometimes it works. When archers don't sync properly or when the one I'm not chasing stays too far away for example. The problem with the 1 minute chase still stands though. But what happens really often is that I don't even bother attacking multiple archers until I'm forced to. I'm not whining as this problem doesn't really ruin my game (I'm 18/18 1h cav now with much more armor) in any way, but I do think shielders need some love against range, and some nerf in melee to balance it.

Offline Dezilagel

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Re: archery..
« Reply #804 on: April 26, 2012, 08:31:01 pm »
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Then you will die just as easily as if you are fighting two melee who are timing their strikes so you literally don't have any time to counter attack.

Okay, Dezi's quick guide to avoid getting fucked in 2v1 in melee vs people who hold and time their strikes:

First you need to realize that in order to get into a situation where two people have you completely cornered they must be in almost perfect position. If your melee positioning isn't completely retarded and you don't have an NA build they are going to have to work a little to get there.

What usually gets me in that position is that one guy holds his strike allowing for his friend to get into position and then stagger you to hell. To avoid this you must act quickly. Try to bait the swing by doing a fake attack. If he bites? Well then you have the advantage and a chance to attack him/move into a better position/surprise his friend. if he doesn't bite? Try a few more times and then for a quick, aggressive strike. Or just go for the attack directly, if you feel lucky. Noone has the reflexes to fully counter this bait/attack tactic, provided you are quick enough.

Of course, getting an attack off just once isn't going to cut it for most fights, but then you have to realize the massive advantage being the one who's "attacking" in a groupfight is, and you need to make the most out of it. When being in the "attacking phase" you're free to move without your opponent unleashing a held strike on you (that's why 2v1 can be so dangerous, you don't need very quick reflexes to release a held strike on someone who is trying to spam his way out).

Also there's the standard groupfighting tips such as making sure to be very aggressive and keep the pressure up so they make mistakes but I'm sure you're familiar with that.

That being said, a 2v1 is considerably harder than a 1v1, for obvious reason. Vs good players it's really hard but not in any way impossible. And it's actually a load of fun once you get the hang of it.
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Offline Moncho

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Re: archery..
« Reply #805 on: April 26, 2012, 08:41:35 pm »
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phew 1 day without checking the forums and 4 new pages in this senseless thread???? omgwtf
And quit QQing biatches, its not that hard to at the beginning of the round make a kinngrimm (go around, flank, get those archers from where they like it, get 5/6 almost free kills, profit!)

Also, what about using some teamplay and one person attacks frontally, and when the archer tunnelvisions him, you attack from the side/back?
What about not going head on as some blind rhino?
Would you attack a sniper/tank in a modern fps? No, you go around and put a mine below it!, you knife him from the back, etc.
Also, the side shoot is a move only doable by a few archers properly, the good ones. Probably if you face a skilled 2her your chances are small.
I repeat: Man up, quit the fucking QQing, im tired of QQing at your useless stupid QQing...
AND LET THIS THREAD DIE!!!!
« Last Edit: April 26, 2012, 08:45:40 pm by Moncho »

Offline zagibu

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Re: archery..
« Reply #806 on: April 26, 2012, 08:42:50 pm »
+1
Another 10 pages of supporters for archery nerf and devs sit by idly.
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Offline Ronin

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Re: archery..
« Reply #807 on: April 26, 2012, 08:46:31 pm »
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Another 10 pages of supporters for archery nerf and devs sit by idly. I am too lazy to read. Oh look! There has been 10 more pages=Archery is OP.
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Offline Leshma

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Re: archery..
« Reply #808 on: April 26, 2012, 08:47:53 pm »
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Archery is weak, very weak. Dedicated archer hunter speaking here. I've probably killed more archers than all of you who posted in this thread.

Offline Tzar

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Re: archery..
« Reply #809 on: April 26, 2012, 08:48:54 pm »
+3
Archery is weak, very weak. Dedicated archer hunter speaking here. I've probably killed more archers than all of you who posted in this thread.

Cool story you should write a book about your adventures im sure we would all read it...
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