Pikes and similar

[zagibu]

I got to watch a pike demonstration earlier illustrating the problem with these guys.

Player with Pike, positioned right behind his teammate. He thrusts down and left, swings the pole through his teammates body, then releases through the teammate and kills the enemy.

Glitching in order to be viable as a weapon choice really isn't a good gaming choice.

In a way, it simulates real shieldwalls and pikemen behind them.

[Oggrinsky]

I got to watch a pike demonstration earlier illustrating the problem with these guys.

Player with Pike, positioned right behind his teammate. He thrusts down and left, swings the pole through his teammates body, then releases through the teammate and kills the enemy.

Glitching in order to be viable as a weapon choice really isn't a good gaming choice.

This "glitching" is only creating a convenient substitute for the lack of good pike/hit box mechanics in the game. This is an absurdly long weapon. If you were standing behind someone with a shield, holding a pike, you wouldn't hold the end of pike at your buddies back would you? No, you wouldn't. You would hold the pike so it moved in between the ranks of other infantry... like how a Sarissa phalanx worked for the Macedonians. This "glitching" is necessary unless further changes can me made to the engine with WSE.

[dodnet]

I got to watch a pike demonstration earlier illustrating the problem with these guys.

Player with Pike, positioned right behind his teammate. He thrusts down and left, swings the pole through his teammates body, then releases through the teammate and kills the enemy.

Glitching in order to be viable as a weapon choice really isn't a good gaming choice.

Similar bugs are with EVERY weapon in the game as it doesn't count hits on anything with the shaft. Its stupid that you can start a 2h thrust into nothing and and turn it during the animation from the back into someone making heavy thrust damage. Or archers shooting out of hey and half through doors.

I don't think that it can be fixed as you wouldn't be able to move anymore with a long spear/pike if you get stopped every time it hits an obstacle. You would get stuck in a door, near walls, in groups as you can't hold the pike in another way then the game suggests.

[darmaster]

And I find it strange that ONE PERSON can block an infinite number of pikemen as long as they face them and down block. Have you ever tried dueling with these weapons? I'd rather have a danish or LHB any day if I'm dueling someone who isn't a complete noob.

Apologies for the rant, it just amazes me that of all weapons, people complain about these two and completely ignore the fact that cav are still OP enough that the team with the most cav wins 90% of the time.
[/quote]

yep maybe for pikes, but bamboos and long awplikes are quite OP maybe :/ as i said imo they're SUPPORTING weapons

[dodnet]

yep maybe for pikes, but bamboos and long awplikes are quite OP maybe :/ as i said imo they're SUPPORTING weapons

Yeah, bamboo spears are so OP that almost no one ever uses them *facepalm* learn2block

[[ptx]]

My Greatsword+Khuyak-using alt approves of this. Also, narf shields and ranged and polearms, please.

[darmaster]

Yeah, bamboo spears are so OP that almost no one ever uses them *facepalm* learn2block

well don't know where you play, but even people without wpf uses bamboo spears (:

[Tears of Destiny]

And I find it strange that ONE PERSON can block an infinite number of pikemen as long as they face them and down block. Have you ever tried dueling with these weapons? I'd rather have a danish or LHB any day if I'm dueling someone who isn't a complete noob.

Wait, so you want to nerf the crap out of this weapon, yet dislike that one person can block... countless... wait...

I'm confuzzled 

[Zerran]

Wait, so you want to nerf the crap out of this weapon, yet dislike that one person can block... countless... wait...

I'm confuzzled 

He messed up a quote. That was something I said but he accidentally deleted the top line. 

And back on topic, You DO realize that every weapon in the game aside from longspear and pike are impossible to block if you just have 2 people swinging different directions at you, right? It's not like bamboo spears and awlpikes have this magical capability to ignore blocks. The reason you get gangbanged by them is because generally people using these weapons ARE using them for support, and so run in groups and WORK TOGETHER, while 2H heroes are much more likely to run around solo, and when they get in groups they just rush forward without thinking about what the others are doing.

[Tears of Destiny]

He messed up a quote. That was something I said but he accidentally deleted the top line. 

Oh... That makes more sense. 

[dodnet]

well don't know where you play, but even people without wpf uses bamboo spears (:

Mostly on EU1 and I rarely see any bamboo spear. Even long spear and pikes aren't used much despite the many cav around. I'm one of the few to hold a long spear from time to time.

[dodnet]

First: This is Game Balance board, not Realism board.
Second: Have you ever wondered how the hell do you block with a 40cm hammer or a 48cm handaxe or a...? You would get you hands cut of or smashed into pieces if you try to block with these toys.

Edit: nevermind, misunderstood the post before me 

[darmaster]

First: This is Game Balance board, not Realism board.
Second: Have you ever wondered how the hell do you block with a 40cm hammer or a 48cm handaxe or a...? You would get you hands cut of or smashed into pieces if you try to block with these toys.

Edit: nevermind, misunderstood the post before me 

well listen: ask yourself why pikes and bamboos are not allowed in melee server

[RibaldRon]

This actually seems perfectly fine to me.

Yes there are some weird "glitches" which are a part of gameplay, nothing you haven't seen before in a movie.  Not on the realism board, remember?  And these moves are TOUGH to get off.  If you've got a team around you, even the pro-est of the pros will be hesitant.


I have seen multiple pikes used to great advantage, and I've seen them destroyed on subsequent rounds.

Pike users are in big trouble if somebody just downblocks, or approaches with a shield.  There's your counter.    Long spears and such weapons with side-swings and overheads are still fairly slow enough that it should be easier to block than many other weapons.  It's not as though they have crushthrough and knockdown like a maul - as in they can be LITERALLY impossible to block.

[Diomedes]

The only thing about pikes I take issue with right now is the spin+stab.  Players who use this are able to hit an opponent a foot away from them with the full thrusting force of a meters long pike.  If the pike is so deadly at range (kills cav, hits through allies, and it exceptionally useful with groups) it shouldn't be so deadly in extreme close range.  I'd prefer that pikemen block normally but not spin+stab players immediately adjacent to them.  It would make it into even more of a support-class while not being entirely gimped in immediate close range.