Author Topic: throwing is broken  (Read 23527 times)

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Offline Rumblood

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #120 on: March 23, 2012, 10:03:40 pm »
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There are some good throwers out there. They've got some nasty tricks. It's a class that probably should take some skill (not everyone can just pick it up and do well *cough heavy lance *cough). Otherwise we will just hear another round of "Nerf ranged!".

I think it could probably stand some minor tweaks, but being able to wear more armor without penalty is not one of them. Armor would certainly effect a throwing arm more than simply drawing back a bowstring would, but archers are restricted to Paper Mache.

Perhaps a slight ammo increase, slight WPF increase, but not reducing the WFP penalty for armor.
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Offline Kansuke

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #121 on: March 23, 2012, 10:22:43 pm »
+8
Look at them cav downvoting my post  :rolleyes:

Your class is overpowered and throwing should be one of its natural counter, as it is now throwing isn't a big threat for cavalry but I hope this will change for the sake of balance, infantery and hybrid should be fun to play too.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2012, 10:31:42 pm by Kansuke »

Offline Lactose_the_intolerant

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #122 on: March 23, 2012, 11:27:46 pm »
+1
Look at them cav downvoting my post  :rolleyes:

Your class is overpowered and throwing should be one of its natural counter, as it is now throwing isn't a big threat for cavalry but I hope this will change for the sake of balance, infantery and hybrid should be fun to play too.

haha, so true!

Most cav when they see me with my throwing lances just avoid me!
But some are foolish enough to charge me! I remember Chargan charge me fullspeed only to see his horse one shot and kill him with another lance when he was on the ground! Another came fullspeed on his courser trying to couch me in a pure straight line, couldnt miss...1 shot...

7 pt + masterwork throwing lances + speed bonus = a dead cav!

and then some of them come to me QQing that it's op! What another class can one hit kill that is not cav? how can this be? and it one hit kills cav, how dare you!

guess what you just go by me, dont charge me and you will be fine! i have 4 lances cant afford to waste them!

We are your on foot pure counter...if only you come close...


Offline Leshma

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #123 on: March 23, 2012, 11:44:55 pm »
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i have 4 lances cant afford to waste them!

Then why you waste them on me?

Offline Lactose_the_intolerant

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #124 on: March 24, 2012, 12:07:38 am »
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mmm your not on my target list  :)

Offline Digglez

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #125 on: March 24, 2012, 06:17:03 pm »
+2
another thing that makes it a pain in the ass is if you pick up throwing during the round that you didnt spawn with, even if you use all of them up, you are still considered holding it for the purposes of spawning with it next round.

So if I'm out of ammo and see some stupid wardarts or something, I have to make sure I pick up more than 1 of them, so I can throw 1 and then drop the others so I dont get stuck with them the next round

Offline Lemmy_Winks

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #126 on: March 24, 2012, 08:56:39 pm »
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I think throwing needs to be altered in a way to make it a "skill" based class. At the moment aiming a throwing weapon is impossible, its basically a video game shotgun you have to get super close to someone and throw it in their general direction and hopefully you hit them. I see throwers all the time come up to a team mate fighting an enemy one on one, and they try to hit the enemy and end up tking there team mate, cause when u throw that weapon there really is no telling where it will hit.

This effects throwing greatly in that throwing is very easy to play, but you cant actually do really well with it consistently, by that i mean you cant actually become good at it, because there is no skill required to play it, just throw in a general direction and hope you hit someone whose not on your team. There needs to be some real aiming mechanic introduced into the game that is both challenging, but if you get good at it you can actually throw accurately.

Im tired of having a thrower try to help me in a one on one fight and there being as good as a chance of him hitting me in the head as there is him hitting my opponent in the foot, or as there is the weapon just flying off into space. And don't say running away and throwing at someone is a skill, every class has to run away in certain situations as a thrower does, its not a skill and its not specific to the class. As far as damage goes it does pretty good damage if your using a good throwing weapon, i ride a +2 destritier that gets one shotted by throwing all the time, throwing does so much damage their the one class im really cautious about attacking. Like i said throwing is basically CRPGs version of a shotgun in a FPS.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2012, 08:58:17 pm by Lemmy_Winks »
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Offline Rumblood

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #127 on: March 24, 2012, 09:00:43 pm »
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I think throwing needs to be altered in a way to make it a "skill" based class. At the moment aiming a throwing weapon is impossible, its basically a video game shotgun you have to get super close to someone and throw it in their general direction and hopefully you hit them. I see throwers all the time come up to a team mate fighting an enemy one on one, and they try to hit the enemy and end up tking there team mate, cause when u throw that weapon there really is no telling where it will hit.

I think the reduction in ammo, followed by the increase in damage, which needs to be balanced by not making it auto-1-hit-kill by making it inaccurate was a bad way to go. Give them more ammo, make it do less damage, but give it more accuracy in its given range. (25 yards or less, beyond that make it a crap shoot) I think I contradicted my earlier opinion, but I've thought about it more.  :lol:
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Offline Phew

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #128 on: March 24, 2012, 09:36:16 pm »
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The wpf requirement is about perfect too. With only 4 weapon master/4 PT, you can be 120 wpf in your main weapon and like 86 in throwing, which is enough for medium armor/helmet. Heavy throwing axe headshots kill most people with even 4 PT, or 2-3 to the body (if they are in heavy armor, don't waste your ammo). Or dedicated throwers can have like 9 PT, which can seriously mess people up with loomed Jarids or even War Darts.

I would like to see a slight bump in accuracy, so throwers could be more useful for anti-cavalry. Or maybe make PT over the weapon requirement significantly increase accuracy so only dedicated throwers could snipe horses?

Offline Lactose_the_intolerant

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #129 on: March 24, 2012, 09:40:20 pm »
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true throwing can be kind of random

but throwing a lance to a cav that is not charging at you but just passing by requires some skill trust me

Offline ammeron

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #130 on: March 24, 2012, 09:45:06 pm »
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yeah overall i think throwing is pretty terrible, a jarrid with some descent PT does hurt thou, but they have so little accuracy with a build like that its not like it matters. and so little ammo

Offline ROHYPNOL

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #131 on: March 25, 2012, 03:29:10 am »
+1
I actually got something to say about this.. I made a 10pt thrower with jarids, compared to when i did it probably 4 months ago it is totally changed. Archers do more damage to you riding at them than my jarids seem to do. I hit a guy on horseback riding full speed at me 3 times to kill him. Ive hit the same people 4 or 5 times to kill them. Well there is almost half my ammo i carry right there haha. I would say the damage or something is a bit nerfed and im not a dedicated thrower. Here is an idea, people crying about cav, just bump throwing damage back up and you wont see as many.
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Offline Lactose_the_intolerant

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #132 on: March 25, 2012, 03:04:32 pm »
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I actually got something to say about this.. I made a 10pt thrower with jarids, compared to when i did it probably 4 months ago it is totally changed. Archers do more damage to you riding at them than my jarids seem to do. I hit a guy on horseback riding full speed at me 3 times to kill him. Ive hit the same people 4 or 5 times to kill them. Well there is almost half my ammo i carry right there haha. I would say the damage or something is a bit nerfed and im not a dedicated thrower. Here is an idea, people crying about cav, just bump throwing damage back up and you wont see as many.

a pure thrower is still a good cav counter if equipped with trowing lances, but you have only four lances and i dont know much pure throwers out there on EU (stone cold and a 22nd). this is not enough to stop cav just crashing in a mob with no fear..

Offline Leshma

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #133 on: March 25, 2012, 03:04:52 pm »
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Throwing isn't terrible. I have 65 HP and 73 BA. Average arrow take away 15-20% of my HP, bolt fired from arbalest from 50-80%, single javelin about 30% and it is usually thrown by hybrid throwers who probably don't have more than 6 PT. So, it's not true that throwing is underpowered compared to other ranged options.

Offline Thomek

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Re: throwing is broken
« Reply #134 on: March 25, 2012, 03:33:06 pm »
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Throwing is almost ok. Could need a slight damage buff, but not a lot.

Main deal with throwing is ammo count, which makes it unique and interesting to play with. I go with three mw jarids and 8mw snowflakes. The jarids serve as anti-cav or cav detterent, allowing me to go alone on flanks without support. The snowflakes work against xbowers and making archers nervous, stopping them from running away and reloading.

Most unarmored horses go down with 1 headshot, but that's not an easy feat, and you always risk bump damage or missing (which means certain death). You have to stand still to get the accuracy required, and throw the jarid at the very last moment.

Before the last nerf I could aim for the rider, and be pretty sure he would be dead, but not anymore. They survive in 80% of the cases.

I miss that.. Especially with the last cav-influx throwing could use a slight buff. 10% to damage!
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