Siege ladders

[RandomDude]

Well tbh I played plenty of siege maps where attacker team didnt bring any ladders and it was so hard to take the flag usually.

You could argue that because no1 brought ladders it showed lack of teamplay and then of course attackers will lose but thats just not true imo.

Some maps are so assholey for attackers that they need ladders to have a chance (and for attackers to use those same ladders, which is never guaranteed).

The main problem defenders have is whether ppl bother to defend the flag or not. Defence can be made really easy on some maps with use of construction materials, even just 1 per doorway can really slow attackers down.

Defenders became really bad recently for some reason. You cant just blame it on ladders as they've been around for quite a long time. I know I bitch about being on defence 90% of the time (true by the way!) but thats because when im on a x1 i'd rather be on the attacking team where I can DO something about it rather than sit at the flag, waiting for the inevitable 10 guys to rush me while I impotently type "FLAG" in team chat.

With a good team, defenders have a good chance.

With the exception of a crap defender team, attackers only ususally win in the last 1-2 mins, after they've made headway breaking down walls/opening gates etc. I know (as a 90% defender player) that to die in the last minute is the worst possible time because thats when flag needs you most, usually.

This is all with ladders implimented. Without ladders, there's only a few limited ways for attackers to get into castles and can you imagine the pain when defenders realise this and take more great mauls? It will be like when Fallen attacked Ichamur in Strat 1 under my command all over again!

[Sniger]

maybe a ladder limit

yes pls. total removal of ladders is pretty sick nerf. when you attack a castle, you aint restricted to a couple fixed ladder-locations just doesnt give any sense. i do agree gameplay > realism.

no ladders give defenders advantage. allowing ladders give attackers advantage.

as i see it, limit would seem natural

\sniger

[Sniger]

Some maps are so assholey for attackers that they need ladders to have a chance (and for attackers to use those same ladders, which is never guaranteed).

yup. just came from siege. its redicilous.

aint gonna play siege anymore unless ladders is limited or whatever. no big loss for you guys, huge win for me

i agree, pre-patch the ladder spam was just getting way too silly: ladders used to block enemy ladders, ladders used for blockades (like construction sites), ladders used for anti-cav on ground (cus of the slowdown - not really realistic and have nothing to do with gameplay) and what not.

if you remove ladders, then you should also remove construction sites.

ladders = attacker advantage
construction sites = defender advantage

yes?

[Memento_Mori]

NO, also would be nice if C-sites were gone from siege since you can't just ladder over their blockades anymore. There's quite a few new maps that have a lot of nasty choke points for these things & attackers are now basically forced into breaking them since they can't make another route using ladders.

ladders(ramps) made Attacking too easy, and also made walls, gate houses and basically all the 'defences' that DEFENCE is supposed to get totally useless.

This is the first time where I've ever actually thought Siege was balanced, now you don't need a clan to defend against the instant spawning attackers.

Some maps are hell without player placed ladders though, I do agree with that. (This can be fixed if people who make the maps would add more than 2-3 ladders leading to the walls & also probably the removal of C-sites)

[slimpyman]

construction sites were nothing more then a few whacks and they disappeared anyway.
 I havnt had any time to play, but ladders would seem ok omitted from seige. again, leet me play a feew rounds and see how it goes.

i anticipate it will be better without them

[BlameMeForTheNoise]

Just a wild idea thrown out there:

Some people say siege without ladders is in favour of the defending team.
How about Autobalance ensures there are always fewer people defending than attacking?
I dont have any exact numbers of course. But maybe this could tip the scales in a more even direction?

[Gortha]

Ladders are a must for Siege-Mode...

[Penitent]

Put ladder back...limited number of ladders, sure.  But we need something.

Remember that not all maps are equal.  Some really are easy to defend...some are easily attacked.  Regardless, before this change the team with the best teamwork usually won.

Remember that the seige server has not been full in a very long time.  When there are 50 people attacking and 50 people defending, many of the maps  have a different dynamic.  With fewer people on the server, larger maps are easier to attack, and smaller ones are easier to defend.  Keep this in mind when deciding the number of ladders to allow per team. 

There has to be some though.

[Malaclypse]

It would be nice to see ladders have a set amount that can be used in a given round or map. Alternatively, it would be nice to see ladders actually use Power Throw to determine whether or not you can use it. This would also cut back on the number of ladders, as throwers are one of the least played classes.

[Winterly]

It would be nice to see ladders have a set amount that can be used in a given round or map. Alternatively, it would be nice to see ladders actually use Power Throw to determine whether or not you can use it. This would also cut back on the number of ladders, as throwers are one of the least played classes.

You'll end up with trolls who spam ladders and waste them on the ground....

[Budikhan]

The problem here is actually MAP DESIGN not REMOVAL OF LADDERS.

I've played some seriously horrendous maps on Siege lately. No other way to put it. They just plain out suck for both sides. You wouldn't need to add in special siege ladders if the map creators could actually put the ladders up in good locations.

Some maps are entirely fun and fine with this removal of custom placeable ladders but others suffer simply due to horrendous map design.

However - Battle is now 100x better.

[killnaboy]

ladders please

[Angantyr]

I personally miss ladders sticking out everywhere, it was fun and gave some epic fights in sometimes very strange places. Always knowing where the enemy comes from, or where to go as attacker, is just plain boring. Taking away player choice and player freedom is not worth a slight decrease in flag camp, in my opinion.

Always found ladders to be such a cool, well-designed feature of cRPG, it's a real shame to never see them unless you play Strat.

[_Tak_]

-1 No ladders please. Now it is more realistic

[Angantyr]

Yes, very realistic with fixed positions for ladders..