The State of Hoplites

[Kreczor]

So, here I am, second time retiring and almost doing it for the third and I'm being told that my build sucks.

Let me tell you a little about my crpg history:
Light cav (~2 months)
Sword and Board (~20-25 days)
Archer(~5 days)
Spearman(~a month)
and finally hoplite(~1-2 months worked in with others)

The current level 30 build that I'm going for will be 23-15 with:
7 Ironflesh
7 Power Strike
5 Shield
5 Athletics
1 Weapon Master

all wpf to polearms.

Ever since my last retire, I've been playing hoplite with an ashwood pike and a round shield. I'm currently at +2 ashwood pike as my only heirloom and I've been receiving quite a few negative comments on it. To my knowledge, as it comes to me from a high knowledgeable member of LLJK, that the Ashwood Pike is the highest damaging hoplite weapon in the game at the moment since the awlpike is no longer usable with a shield. I receive constant flak as I'm told that the hoplite is a "garbage class", a "broken class", and is generally disliked by the overall public of the game.

Personally, I feel like the hoplite is in a fair state of game, as I still do fairly well as one (I can average a 5-3 kd on average which is pretty good for my unskilled playstyle). Of course I still feel as if I could be a bit more powerful, and as I hear on irc and in-game, so do a lot of other people.

So, my question to you is, how do you feel the Hoplite class is doing compared to other classes currently? Do you feel that it is overpowered, underpowered or perfect the way it is? Is it limited to what it can do and needs to be buffed a bit?

I would love to hear your opinions so please do not feel obligated to post based on your current build (ie nerf paper, scissors are fine, sincerely rock).

~~LOVE KRECZOR~~

[Dezilagel]

As long as you don't hug your shield 24/7, the hoplite is a great class. Put some points in riding and you have the class of ultimate versatility.

[Christo]

Lol.

Not long ago the Ashwood Pike was an almost useless piece of junk.

Spear/Shielders get finally a dedicated weapon, that can kick ass even without their shield, ergo they are a bit viable, and people are going mad.
 I heard a lot of "Asswood Pike" and other crap too, and also got killed by one. Shit happens.

as it comes to me from a high knowledgeable member of LLJK, that the Ashwood Pike is the highest damaging hoplite weapon in the game at the moment since the awlpike is no longer usable with a shield. I receive constant flak as I'm told that the hoplite is a "garbage class", a "broken class", and is generally disliked by the overall public of the game.

Even though I am EU, I hear things about LLJK. Do you really handle that opinion so important? Ingore it.

[Kreczor]

Lol.

Not long ago the Ashwood Pike was an almost useless piece of junk.

Spear/Shielders get finally a dedicated weapon, that can kick ass even without their shield, ergo they are a bit viable, and people are going mad.
 I heard a lot of "Asswood Pike" and other crap too, and also got killed by one. Shit happens.

Even though I am EU, I hear things about LLJK. Do you really handle that opinion so important? Ingore it.

As a member of LLJK I would find it ignorant to not listen to someone whose been playing this game for so long. I appreciate your opinion on the matter however. The only problem I'm having is that I feel like I'm not playing a hoplite properly without my shield, however with it equipped I'm limited to the easily blockable thrust. Without a right sided 180 degree turn thrust, I can't seem to land a hit on those damn shielders!

[Cepeshi]

May i ask why 23/15? If you do not go for multiplications of three, the extra att. points are useless. If i was you, i would transfer the 2extra for skill and go with 5 WM, so it would look like:

21/15
 7 IF+PS
 5 shield, athl, WM

should get you around 150wfp, i played this build as onehander, was quite viable.

[Kreczor]

May i ask why 23/15? If you do not go for multiplications of three, the extra att. points are useless. If i was you, i would transfer the 2extra for skill and go with 5 WM, so it would look like:

21/15
 7 IF+PS
 5 shield, athl, WM

should get you around 150wfp, i played this build as onehander, was quite viable.

The reason I go for 23/15 instead of 21/15 is because I run around in extremely light armor so I'm generally easy to kill. With the extra health it allows me to survive for much longer and I don't feel the WM would help me as much as you think.

[isatis]

May i ask why 23/15? If you do not go for multiplications of three, the extra att. points are useless. If i was you, i would transfer the 2extra for skill and go with 5 WM, so it would look like:

21/15
 7 IF+PS
 5 shield, athl, WM

should get you around 150wfp, i played this build as onehander, was quite viable.

he want a 31 24/15 gimped built


oh wait sneak response...

bleh my answer is better

[Cepeshi]

The reason I go for 23/15 instead of 21/15 is because I run around in extremely light armor so I'm generally easy to kill. With the extra health it allows me to survive for much longer and I don't feel the WM would help me as much as you think.

Well, to be honest, 2 more STR points over 4 WM when you already have 7 IF, that is weird choice:) But, whatever floats your boat, i always maxed out WM in every build so far, sometimes it can really make a difference. How much wpf you gonna get with this build anw? If under 100, then it is not that good imho (not just for the repair chance).

Well yeah, if he goes for 31 and on, then i get it But, if this is designated for 30 and then retire the minute he hits 31, i would do it differently due to reasons stated above

[Kreczor]

Well, to be honest, 2 more STR points over 4 WM when you already have 7 IF, that is weird choice:) But, whatever floats your boat, i always maxed out WM in every build so far, sometimes it can really make a difference. How much wpf you gonna get with this build anw? If under 100, then it is not that good imho (not just for the repair chance).

Well yeah, if he goes for 31 and on, then i get it But, if this is designated for 30 and then retire the minute he hits 31, i would do it differently due to reasons stated above

Without any points in WM you reach 111 at level 30. By 30 I should have.... well I don't really know to be honest! I tend to die quite a bit so that's why I prefer the higher armor/hp when it comes to builds. Perhaps when I become a bit more skilled I will pursue a more WM sided build.

[Cepeshi]

Without any points in WM you reach 111 at level 30. By 30 I should have.... well I don't really know to be honest! I tend to die quite a bit so that's why I prefer the higher armor/hp when it comes to builds. Perhaps when I become a bit more skilled I will pursue a more WM sided build.

True that when i started playing this, i usually went more str and IF pumped builds in order to survive a little, but later as my skills started to develop (i am not the best, not even one among the above average, i consider myself average player pretty much), i found more agi builds more fun. Usually i go for 15/18str, with full PS and 1-3 points in IF (not many more left), and even with this "squishy" build sometimes i can kill 3-5 guys before they kill me

[Kreczor]

So by the responses in this thread being limited to but a few players, I have to assume that the popularity of the hoplite build is quite low. Does anyone have an idea as to why this is? I have lots of fun personally playing it, and although the choice of class is entirely subjective to the person playing, it does raise questions as to why more people don't try it out. I'm sure if more people did we would have a more substantial place in the crpg world. By this I mean; there are very few well known hoplites.

[Christo]

Simple.

You are countered by a down block, and die alone.

It's dedicated support with one attack direction, it's not for everyone.

[Cepeshi]

Well, that KingGylpe comes to mind, aswell as SlickyRicky and if i tried remember much, much harder, i might come in with another one...do not take this as any statistics tho, i have seen quite a lot hoplites recently actually, with the ashwood pike and huscarls or whatnot, and i have quite problems fighting them. They just freaking facehug you and spinthrust the shit outta you, sometimes they manage to do that even thru block. Was thinking of going hoplite/polecav for my ultimate build for lvl 32 actually, with some riding, shield and all the other shit so it would be viable both on foot and on whorsie

Me, personally, i would say numbers of hoplites increased recently, but that might be subjective as i really remember getting stabbed by some shielded guy quite often

Christo: even when i approach guy with downblock and he is good hoplite, i get owned...he starts spinning and shit and even before i realise he released his weapon i already lost HP (or life)

[Winterly]

I used to hug the shield, but I'm trying a build with no shield this time. I spent a shit-ton of time on the duel servers honing my block/dodge skills and I feel like I'm actually getting better at this game.  The shield makes the hoplite class too stagnant/predictable. I fought you a few times Krek, the speed disadvantage + the less dmg is way too detrimental.  You'll do a lot better without the shield using footwork and weaving...I'm looking for a loomed ashwood pike right now and I plan to use it without a shield as well.

(Only time to use a shield is obviously against enemy ranged)

[Kreczor]

I used to hug the shield, but I'm trying a build with no shield this time. I spent a shit-ton of time on the duel servers honing my block/dodge skills and I feel like I'm actually getting better at this game.  The shield makes the hoplite class too stagnant/predictable. I fought you a few times Krek, the speed disadvantage + the less dmg is way too detrimental.  You'll do a lot better without the shield using footwork and weaving...I'm looking for a loomed ashwood pike right now and I plan to use it without a shield as well.

(Only time to use a shield is obviously against enemy ranged)

I figured as much, as of late I've been ditching the shield in melee battle. I just figured (thought more of) that I'm not playing a hoplite unless I have the shield out.