Did they change the 2h right swing?

[Xant]

Couldn't agree more.

1h is really under the radar for some reason, but it's too powerful for it's speed, animations, and defensive capabilities.

Yes, 2h can duel better, but cannot autoblock a certain radius, and deflect projectiles.
1h can do this, while having about the same damage, faster speed, and more headhits thanks to their reach/animations.

If you think that "low" reach is a disadvantage of 1h, you are very, very wrong. It's an excellent advantage, if you can use it.
(The angle "bouncing" and terrain collision was a beautiful onehander ninja buff for an example.)

1h shielders can kill people with ease with the left slash spam only, let alone abusing the damned spammitar for an example.

that's just wrong. Low reach is definitely a disadvantage of 1h. 1h also doesn't have "about the same damage".

[Christo]

Not really, it works both ways.

It can be a disadvantage, but it's an advantage because of the headhit tendency.
Also they are compensated with an auto block shield, for crying out loud. It evens this out.

Well, then why can 1h kill people in like two or three hits, just like any other weapon style?

[Xant]

Not really, it works both ways.

It can be a disadvantage, but it's an advantage because of the headhit tendency.

Well, then why can 1h kill people in like two or three hits, just like any other weapon style?

No, it doesn't. Low reach has nothing to do with headhits. 1h left slash animation would hit the head just as often if it had 200 reach.

Why couldn't it? Stack enough PS and you can kill someone in two or three hits with a practice sword. But when you hit someone with decent body armor in the body with a balanced build, you'll see the difference.

[Christo]

You don't get it.

They can get closer to you, in fact they must get closer to you, and can use quick attacks to slash or smash your head a lot easier than others, because the shielder will be in your face.

#2:

Then, your previous argument saying "damage isn't around equal" fails, Hence you saying that anyone can stack PS to two hit people.

I'm aware that this is leading to nowhere, but oh well.

[_GTX_]

I don't really want to start an agrument here

(click to show/hide)

Polearms can stagger people and you can win duels against worse people by just backpedalling and pressing S key. You can also stun most 1h with most 2h and polearms. The amount of hits it took me to kill a STR 2h (Hearst for example) with 8 ps and a ms knightly arming was around 7-9, it took him 2, 3 max .
My 1h gets stuck in teammates (or their shields) on the side/behind me in clusterfucks so often that sometimes i think that i'd be better off with a polearm holding overhead or a 2h thrust/overhead.

Now don't get me wrong, 1h are a really good option and they can still do great damage , especially when hits land on opponents heads.
Oh and i can kill people in duels if i pick a polearm or a 2h too, but you won't see me asking to nerf them on the forum.

Hitslashing was a trick that wasn't as easy to perform in native, it got popular in cRPG, yet i never had much problems with it (of course i got killed by it too sometimes) or never asked for a nerf. All you have to do against the "uberfastleftswingofdoom" of 1handers is to block right. It can't stun you, hitslash you,polestagger you,go around your block or crushthrough it.

I'm not a big fan of this nerfing fest lately to be honest (including the slower swing speed for 2h+poles), especially the "so now that my class is nerfed, i want others to be nerfed too" attitude. I especially don't like the tendency to slow down the speed of the battle, doesn't matter what weapon class we talk about. The only thing i didn't like in terms of balance (apart from certain weapons like the mace) was the polestagger.

Yeah i see 

Anyway wont argue with u, i have tryed argueing with personal opinions like this, there is different kinds of personal opinions, humans is different. Some opinions has got more actual facts in it, some less. And i just cba with this kind of opinions.

[Xant]

You don't get it.

They can get closer to you, in fact they must get closer to you, and can use quick attacks to slash or smash your head a lot easier than others, because the shielder will be in your face.

#2:

Then, your previous argument saying "damage isn't around equal" fails, Hence you saying that anyone can stack PS to two hit people.

I'm aware that this is leading to nowhere, but oh well.

Dude what? Low reach doesn't mean they can get closer to you, it means they need to get closer to you. It's not like you can't just as close with 2h or polearm if you want to. And since they need to get in your face, you can kickslash them easily for a free hit.

Again, what? C'mon Christo... that doesn't make any sense. Being able to stack PS and two hit anyone has NOTHING to do with damages being equal.

[Ujin]

Not really, it works both ways.

It can be a disadvantage, but it's an advantage because of the headhit tendency.
Also they are compensated with an auto block shield, for crying out loud. It evens this out.

Well, then why can 1h kill people in like two or three hits, just like any other weapon style?

I don't know if you've ever played as a 1h, but a shield is a disadvantage in many situations, for example it's harder for me to duel with it then without it in most cases.

@ Teeth- pay Tor to give you some lessons.

@ GTX in an argument, everyone's opinion is personal. And yeah, i got into this argument after all, but someone had to take the banner for the other side. At least Xant is here now .

[Christo]

Gah.

Xant, you make a whole lot of sense as well.

 

If that's not related to damage, then what is?

@Ujin:

I played around with 1h a bit with my own character.
Also played my friend's 1h+shielder.

I'm not saying that it isn't a disadvantage, it is. But it is very handy, especially boosting the killing power in battle.

Duels, well yes, the good blocking onehander is two times more dangerous unshielded. That's true.

[Xant]

Gah.

Xant, you make a whole lot of sense as well.

 

If that's not related to damage, then what is?

@Ujin:

I played around with 1h a bit with my own character.
Also played my friend's 1h+shielder.

I'm not saying that it isn't a disadvantage, it is. But it is very handy, especially boosting the killing power in battle.

Duels, well yes, the good blocking onehander is two times more dangerous unshielded. That's true.

Yes, I make sense. Let me try to explain this to you in simpler terms:

Weapon A does 30 damage.
Weapon B does 40 damage.

If you get 15 PS, you can 2 hit someone with weapon A.
If you get 10 PS, you can 2 hit someone with weapon B.

You can two hit with both weapons if you stack enough PS. Do they deal equal damage because of this?

[Christo]

Weaker damage gets compensated by increased power strike or speed bonus.

So in theory, yes.

Mathematically, no.

But it's going to two hit reliably, so that's what matters.


Tbh we are going nowhere with this, and it's seriously off topic now.
Want to continue n/n?

[Ujin]

Weaker damage gets compensated by increased power strike or speed bonus.

So in theory, yes.

Mathematically, no.

But it's going to two hit reliably, so that's what matters.


Tbh we are going nowhere with this, and it's seriously off topic now.
Want to continue n/n?

I never knew mathematics and theories don't go along so well...

[Xant]

Weaker damage gets compensated by increased power strike or speed bonus.

So in theory, yes.

Mathematically, no.

But it's going to two hit reliably, so that's what matters.

Power strike works on percentages. Which means PS increases a lower base damage less than a higher base damage.

So what are you saying again? It deals equal damage because you can make a 40/3 build at level 32 and 2 hit people when 2h only needs 30 str*? But hey, you can two hit in the end, that's all that matters right! Equal damage!

*not actual numbers

[Christo]

I never knew mathematics and theories don't go along so well...

My bad, I meant in real situations, ergo in practice.

Also stop bringing up extremities. Weapons don't need even 30/9 builds to reliable two hit people.
God. Stop. Now. 

[Xant]

Yeah, everyone knows that mathematics work in some absurd different reality but just goes poof when it comes into contact with the real world.

... It was an example. You are really bad at logic aren't you, Christo?

[Hideyoshi]

Well you have to be quick about that block, cause the hit is lightning fast, and when you think you've blocked it, there comes another one. It can't hiltslash you, but it can double leftslash you, pretty much same effect.

Lag

The time I need to hold an attack to stun a 1h is enough for the 1h to get another leftslash hit in.

Range?

1h attacks should be really evened out, same goes for all classes, but the 1h leftslash in itself is overpowered, sure the other attacks are weaker, but who needs it when 1 attack suffices for almost all situations.

Teeth I know how you are fighting, it always takes you a split second before you attack back after blocking and you feint way too much, its easy to spam you and nobody needs a onehander for that.
You could also try using a polearm with more than 89 speed...