Remove free wpp and buff cut damage

[Leshma]

As it says in the title. Free wpp or wpp you gain per level is the main reason why STR builds are more efficient than AGI based builds. Without free wpp they will be forced to have at least 3 WM (WM is completely marginalized at the moment).

About cut damage... well it's crap against everything. Guy with enough IF and heavy STR build while wearing wool cap or straw hat can survive overhead from MW danish and PS 6 which is... LULZ. Also some archers wearing low armor helmet can survive an overhead. I need to jump slash them in order to kill them because without speed bonus damage is pure crap

On the other hand while having 71 BA and 60 HP I lose 40-55% from one hit of most MW pierce weapons...

I'm pretty sure this suggestion will be down voted by forums retards like Digglez and co. but I still decided to try to give some decent feedback from my personal experience. I know it probably won't be taken into account but pierce and blunt damage are much more effienct in typical battle situations that negative features like unbalanced don't make much difference. Either nerf those two types so they make about 30-35% more damage compared to cut, not like it's now in some situations 200% more... or buff cut damage which you can easily call crap damage as well.

And yes I'm biased but at least I'm way better player than usual forum retards like Digglez, Joxer and others whose names I can't remember atm.

[Tydeus]

As it says in the title. Free wpp or wpp you gain per level is the main reason why STR builds are more efficient than AGI based builds. Without free wpp they will be forced to have at least 3 WM (WM is completely marginalized at the moment).

About cut damage... well it's crap against everything. Guy with enough IF and heavy STR build while wearing wool cap or straw hat can survive overhead from MW danish and PS 6 which is... LULZ. Also some archers wearing low armor helmet can survive an overhead. I need to jump slash them in order to kill them because without speed bonus damage is pure crap

On the other hand while having 71 BA and 60 HP I lose 40-55% from one hit of most MW pierce weapons...

I'm pretty sure this suggestion will be down voted by forums retards like Digglez and co. but I still decided to try to give some decent feedback from my personal experience. I know it probably won't be taken into account but pierce and blunt damage are much more effienct in typical battle situations that negative features like unbalanced don't make much difference. Either nerf those two types so they make about 30-35% more damage compared to cut, not like it's now in some situations 200% more... or buff cut damage which you can easily call crap damage as well.

And yes I'm biased but at least I'm way better player than usual forum retards like Digglez, Joxer and others whose names I can't remember atm.

I don't think anyone should be forced into a minimum of x WM just to get 100 base wpf. About buffing cut damage, are you talking about raising the numerical damage on all cut weapons currently in game or reducing armor's affect on cut damage?

[Leshma]

or reducing armor's affect on cut damage?

this

And WM is a skill just like PS, ATH or PD. You don't get added damage bonus or movement speed for free just by leveling, don't you?

[Gisbert_of_Thuringia]

Didn't you request buffing cutdamage just a week ago? o.O


I think you idea about free wpf might be a good thing. There are alot of guys who do not take much wm as they can still get more than 100 (I don't know the exact number) just by leveling their char 

[Cup1d]

Remove free wpp but add wm wpp. This way you can still be 30 str\9 agi mauler with 100 wpf, but AGI chars will benefit more (there is your buff to cut damage).

[Leshma]

Remove free wpp but add wm wpp.

Yeah, I had something like that on my mind, but that would make agi chars a bit OP if lets say, WM formula become 20+x*15 (where x represents level of WM).

[Balton]

Cut damage is fine, however, damage dealt to the head, by cut, pierce, & blunt, should all be doubled. This applies most of all to cut, since as far as I am aware, it currently possesses the weakest multiplier to the head hitbox. It really is ridiculous how people without helmets survive overhead slashes. I believe the current multiplier is somewhere around 2.1 for hits the head. A hit to the head should be a 1 hit kill, and if you are wearing a plate helmet, a 2 hit at most.

As for wpf, my suggestion of 5wpp per 1wpf point would be a simpler solution, seeing as removing the wpp you get per level would cause for the need of completely reconstructing ranged wpf.

[Ujin]

i'm a 24/15 hybrid with 140/60 wpf and i dissaprove . I don't want to be forced to go agi build (which are still good btw) only if i want to be a hybrid, i'm barely making it with a str build as it is atm.
 Also cut damage is still big , specially for 2h/polearm weapons.

What really should be done is a reduction of armor heirloom bonuses.


P.S. Balton's suggestion (doubling dmg to the head) is laughable at best. Unless you like watching people in closed helmets die from 1 left swing of a 1hander.

[Balton]

i'm a 24/15 hybrid with 140/60 wpf and i dissaprove . I don't want to be forced to go agi build (which are still good btw) only if i want to be a hybrid, i'm barely making it with a str build as it is atm.
 Also cut damage is still big , specially for 2h/polearm weapons.

What really should be done is a reduction of armor heirloom bonuses.


P.S. Balton's suggestion (doubling dmg to the head) is laughable at best. Unless you like watching people in closed helmets die from 1 left swing of a 1hander.

Yes, Ujin. If it were up to me, everyone would die in one shot from most everything. But the least I can do is lobby for increased damage to the head, seeing as doubling all damage would make the game unfriendly for most.

Also, you fail to realize, hybrids are meant to be agility builds, not strength builds. The fact that you are getting by at all, as a hybrid with 9 more strength than agility, is perhaps the best reason to make changes to the wpf system.

[Thomek]

The solution is not nerfing STR.

Let me illustrate, I call the below graph the:

===== GRAPH OF STR VS AGI AWESOMNESS =====
                                  Higher is better

What we have now:
PURE STR                      BALANCED                  PURE AGI
---------------------------------------
                                                -----------
                                                              --------
                                                                        ------
                                                                                ----

It is bad because we reduce player type variation.
                                                   

If you nerf STR only it will look like this:
PURE STR                      BALANCED                  PURE AGI
                                     -----------
                        ----------              -----------
             --------                                          --------
     ------                                                               ------
 ---                                                                               ----

It is even worse, because everyone will go balanced.

What it SHOULD look like is this:
PURE STR                      BALANCED                  PURE AGI
----------------------------------------------------------------------

In the ultimate STR vs AGI balance, every kind of AGI to STR should be equally good, but different to play.

How should one buff AGI side?
More wpf = game breaking speeds. (More bugs and netcode problems) So not that.

Also one must take into account Hybrids.
My proposal with them is to treat wpf curves differently if u have more than 1 skill.

[Ujin]

Yes, Ujin. If it were up to me, everyone would die in one shot from most everything. But the least I can do is lobby for increased damage to the head, seeing as doubling all damage would make the game unfriendly for most.

Also, you fail to realize, hybrids are meant to be agility builds, not strength builds. The fact that you are getting by at all, as a hybrid with 9 more strength than agility, is perhaps the best reason to make changes to the wpf system.

Well actually the fact is i'm a lvl 33 (34 before respecing) hybrid who can afford it. And when i say "afford it" , i mean barely make it, since 60 wpp is not that much to say the least, especially when you're wearing a semi decent armor.
Also, nobody's meant to be anything, this game is about variety. I've had balanced/ agi builds before, now i'm testing out a STR build and can honestly say that both have their benefits (actually i'm pretty sure that i'd  even do better with less STR and more AGI). But i want it to be my choice, not some bunch of guys on the forum making a big deal out of me having "9 more STR than AGI " .

[Bobthehero]

Disagree on the cut damage. A str build wearing a straw hat doesn't survive a MW Danish hit thanks to his armor

[Balton]

Well actually the fact is i'm a lvl 33 (34 before respecing) hybrid who can afford it. And when i say "afford it" , i mean barely make it, since 60 wpp is not that much to say the least, especially when you're wearing a semi decent armor.
Also, nobody's meant to be anything, this game is about variety. I've had balanced/ agi builds before, now i'm testing out a STR build and can honestly say that both have their benefits (actually i'm pretty sure that i'd  even do better with less STR and more AGI). But i want it to be my choice, not some bunch of guys on the forum making a big deal out of me having "9 more STR than AGI " .

And it is your choice, whether to play a hybrid or not. I would also like to be a cav/inf hybrid, ride a courser, & have 8PS, but that is no longer possible for balance reasons, the same should be with str heavy hybrids.

[Ujin]

And it is your choice, whether to play a hybrid or not. I would also like to be a cav/inf hybrid, ride a courser, & have 8PS, but that is no longer possible for balance reasons, the same should be with str heavy hybrids.

I can't ride a courser, only a destrier. Can't swing a german poleaxe like it's a mw LHB, can't polestun people, slower than pure lancers with my lance. And btw, you've missed the point where i mentioned that my STR hybrid build can be pretty much pulled off with a 33+ level. But it's okay, keep speculating.

[Balton]

I can't ride a courser, only a destrier. Can't swing a german poleaxe like it's a mw LHB, can't polestun people, slower than pure lancers with my lance. And btw, you've missed the point where i mentioned that my STR hybrid build can be pretty much pulled off with a 33+ level. But it's okay, keep speculating.

The argument isn't really focused around you. It's obvious that hybrids will always be weaker at a single proficiency than pure builds. What I am stating is that hybrids shouldn't be an option for builds that are neither balance nor agi heavy, period.