[STATS] Halfswording should use 2h prof

[Visconti]

Would be amazing to see this changed, im loling at the people saying "but you hold it like a polearm, so it must be used like one!" Fact is... anyone training with a greatsword would train in halfswording as well, as was already said, that doesnt mean hes gonna be able to use a halberd.

Love that there is an option to use halfswording, hate that this commonly used GS fighting style is not viable, iv been trying to use this in siege, and its completely useless.

[Jarlek]

Would be amazing to see this changed, im loling at the people saying "but you hold it like a polearm, so it must be used like one!" Fact is... anyone training with a greatsword would train in halfswording as well, as was already said, that doesnt mean hes gonna be able to use a halberd.

Love that there is an option to use halfswording, hate that this commonly used GS fighting style is not viable, iv been trying to use this in siege, and its completely useless.

Sigh. How hard is it to understand that you are not "training with a greatsword". You are training by holding the weapon that particular way. For instance. Going around swinging a 2h axe makes you better with greatswords? Makes no sense unless you look at the grip. A guy who trained with Greatswords to be awesome at Greatwords would train with BOTH the styles, normal grip at hilt (2h wpf) and halfswording (pole wpf). In this game the wpp category that closest resembles halfswording is polearm. Is it correct that a guy who knows how to use a poleaxe should be good with a sword? No. But the same can be said for a guy who is good with using a pike. A pike is VASTLY different from a glaive/axe/spear, yet they use the same wpf. Same with a maul/sword/morningstar for 2handers. Yet they all use the same wpf.

[Visconti]

Sigh. How hard is it to understand that you are not "training with a greatsword". You are training by holding the weapon that particular way. For instance. Going around swinging a 2h axe makes you better with greatswords? Makes no sense unless you look at the grip. A guy who trained with Greatswords to be awesome at Greatwords would train with BOTH the styles, normal grip at hilt (2h wpf) and halfswording (pole wpf). In this game the wpp category that closest resembles halfswording is polearm. Is it correct that a guy who knows how to use a poleaxe should be good with a sword? No. But the same can be said for a guy who is good with using a pike. A pike is VASTLY different from a glaive/axe/spear, yet they use the same wpf. Same with a maul/sword/morningstar for 2handers. Yet they all use the same wpf.

If your going with that logic, you can just say that the guy trained to be a master of all 2h weapons, which is why he would be good with so many different weapons, which, surprise, includes great swords! Which would mean he trains to use it in a half sword style. Same logic can be applied to pikes/halberds and what not.... guy trains to master all sorts of polearms.  Its also completely different from someone using a halberd being good with a pike..... the GS user is still using the exact same weapon, just in a slightly different grip. As was already said, I dont understand why someone who is apparently a master with a great sword, would suddenly have no idea what to do with his weapon because he put his hand slightly higher on the blade. There's no reason to even have this in the game if its so useless, not like making this use 2h wpf would make 2hs imba, you lose speed, reach, and damage, all you get is a short range stab.

[Rebelyell]

Half-sword, in 14th- to 16th-century fencing with the longswords, refers to the technique of gripping the central part of the sword blade with the left hand in order to execute more forceful thrusts against armoured and unarmoured opponents. The term is a translation of the original German Halbschwert. Equivalently, the techniques were referred to as mit dem kurzen Schwert "with the shortened sword."

Half-sword is used for leverage advantage when wrestling with the sword, as well as for delivering a more accurate and powerful thrust. Both of these are critical when fighting in plate armour, because a slice or a cleaving blow from a sword is virtually useless against iron or steel plate. Most medieval treatises show armoured combat as consisting primarily of fighting at the half-sword; the best options against an armoured man being a strong thrust into less-protected areas such as the armpits or throat or, even better, the same against a man who has already been cast to the ground. Some weapons may have been modified specifically for this purpose, sporting what is called a ricasso. Some longswords had a short ricasso, usually too close to the cross and hilt of the blade for practical use in half-swording except as a point of extra leverage in a thrust. The ricasso on larger swords, such as the two-handed sword, provided a longer area more fitting for gripping during half-swording. Filippo Vadi suggests that a sword be sharp only at the tip. It has been suggested that some swords were left unsharpened in a part of the sword a hand's breadth wide about half-way down the blade in order to facilitate this technique.

In Italian and English, "half sword" refers to a crossing of the sword in the middle of the blade, and by extension the relatively close range at which this takes place.

hmm wait so flamberg is best half sword ingame atm (there is only half sword animation) and no one complain

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


ah i found that in internet i am not such big proknowlaged

[Visconti]

Half-sword, in 14th- to 16th-century fencing with the longswords, refers to the technique of gripping the central part of the sword blade with the left hand in order to execute more forceful thrusts against armoured and unarmoured opponents. The term is a translation of the original German Halbschwert. Equivalently, the techniques were referred to as mit dem kurzen Schwert "with the shortened sword."

Half-sword is used for leverage advantage when wrestling with the sword, as well as for delivering a more accurate and powerful thrust. Both of these are critical when fighting in plate armour, because a slice or a cleaving blow from a sword is virtually useless against iron or steel plate. Most medieval treatises show armoured combat as consisting primarily of fighting at the half-sword; the best options against an armoured man being a strong thrust into less-protected areas such as the armpits or throat or, even better, the same against a man who has already been cast to the ground. Some weapons may have been modified specifically for this purpose, sporting what is called a ricasso. Some longswords had a short ricasso, usually too close to the cross and hilt of the blade for practical use in half-swording except as a point of extra leverage in a thrust. The ricasso on larger swords, such as the two-handed sword, provided a longer area more fitting for gripping during half-swording. Filippo Vadi suggests that a sword be sharp only at the tip. It has been suggested that some swords were left unsharpened in a part of the sword a hand's breadth wide about half-way down the blade in order to facilitate this technique.

In Italian and English, "half sword" refers to a crossing of the sword in the middle of the blade, and by extension the relatively close range at which this takes place.

hmm wait so flamberg is best half sword ingame atm (there is only half sword animation) and no one complain

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


ah i found that in internet i am not such big proknowlaged

Yes, the Flamberge is a good halfsword weapon..... but whats your point? there are other great sword that you should be able to halfsword with, Danish, German, Sword of War, regular Greatsword, Two handed sword, Highland Claymore.

Also, id imagine that the reason you can only halfsword with a Flamberge is because its way to big to use any other way.

[Rebelyell]

but still no ones have to use that weapons like polearms... and stop with that complaining about pole mode coz it make no sens!
how you can use 2 h like polearm???? Pole weapon is some kind of long stick(sometimes only stick) with kind  of blade(or mace axe ect) on the end.
maybe dev make pole mode but still is so similar to true halfswording technique(shorter reach weaker swings more powerfull stab you grab sword on balade and... weapon is way slower.... slower)

and do not cry abou that op stab on german coz on mw GGS is some like 33( alwpikes 34~35) and that sta is so short, so it oly for special occasions
not for regular.

btw flamberge is strange.... its like half and half swording

[Visconti]

but still no ones have to use that weapons like polearms... and stop with that complaining about pole mode coz it make no sens!
how you can use 2 h like polearm???? Pole weapon is some kind of long stick(sometimes only stick) with kind  of blade(or mace axe ect) on the end.
maybe dev make pole mode but still is so similar to true halfswording technique(shorter reach weaker swings more powerfull stab you grab sword on balade and... weapon is way slower.... slower)

and do not cry abou that op stab on german coz on mw GGS is some like 33( alwpikes 34~35) and that sta is so short, so it oly for special occasions
not for regular.

btw flamberge is strange.... its like half and half swording

What?? I didnt see anyone crying about stab on the german greatsword... as to the rest of your post.... what????

[RandomDude]

It is a bit pointless to have halfswording use polearm prof imo.

I dont think ive ever seen a 2h switch to halfsword in order to stop a cav also so the "losing rear horse" ability isnt a big loss

With swords getting stuck on all sorts of stuff then it would help a lot.

It wouldnt help me, of course, as I use TEH FLAMBERGE! But if the half swords get this "buff" then I can lobby for some changes to flamberge!

[Tot.]

Bump.

PS. Some dev input like 'okay, we'll try to fix it in the next patch' would nicely close the case. 

[Rebelyell]

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Gorath]

If halfswording is changed to use 2h prof, then by the exact same logic the fighting axe, langes messer, military sickle and such should all use 1h prof when used in their alt-mode as 2her's.  It's not like someone who is training to use a langes messer would just suddenly forget what the hell is going on if he puts his second hand on the handle.

Exact

same

logic.

Make it happen.

[Jarlek]

If halfswording is changed to use 2h prof, then by the exact same logic the fighting axe, langes messer, military sickle and such should all use 1h prof when used in their alt-mode as 2her's.  It's not like someone who is training to use a langes messer would just suddenly forget what the hell is going on if he puts his second hand on the handle.

Exact

same

logic.

Make it happen.

And throwing weapons! It's not like someone who is trained in throwing axes would just suddenly forget what the hell is going on when he uses it in melee!

Exact

same

logic.

It really is silly, isn't it?

[Gorath]

And throwing weapons! It's not like someone who is trained in throwing axes would just suddenly forget what the hell is going on when he uses it in melee!

Exact

same

logic.

It really is silly, isn't it?

Agreed.  These changes need to take place now.

[Zisa]

If halfswording is changed to use 2h prof, then by the exact same logic the fighting axe, langes messer, military sickle and such should all use 1h prof when used in their alt-mode as 2her's.  It's not like someone who is training to use a langes messer would just suddenly forget what the hell is going on if he puts his second hand on the handle.

Exact

same

logic.

Make it happen.

Those weapons should use either wpf, whichever is greater.

[Gorath]

Those weapons should use either wpf, whichever is greater.

No.  They should use whatever wpf their starting "class" is.  Otherwise 2hers that can halfsword should use 2her or polearm wpf, whichever is greater.
Since the base class for langes/fighting axe/mil sickle/etc is 1her, it should use 1her.
throwing weapons = throwing wpf
2hers/halfsworded = 2her

By just having them use "whichever is greater" we're getting into the territory of why bother having wpf classes at all.