Author Topic: Wow... this is frustrating...  (Read 4241 times)

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Offline Elazul

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Wow... this is frustrating...
« on: October 01, 2011, 12:40:31 am »
+1
Like the title says. I been playing this for a little under a week so far. Currently have a 1h/shield character at level 19 and gotta say i'm fairly frustrated right now. I have died an incredible amount of times and killed exactly 4 people... mostly by accident. Can anyone tell me what i'm doing wrong? Build wise I am working at the standard 18/18 1h/shield build I found in these forums. Combat wise I suck... no I more than suck. I die to other peasants with pitchforks at the drop of a hat. Is there any ways to improve? I'm just not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel here and I gotta say its annoying.

Offline rustyspoon

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2011, 12:43:55 am »
+1
Wow I could write on and on about this.

The simplest answer, hang out on the duel server and ask for help.

I also think that no one should start out as a shielder. It's a good way to suck for a long time. Better off biting the bullet and starting out 2 hander and learning how to block.
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Offline Dezilagel

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2011, 12:51:26 am »
0
Wow I could write on and on about this.

The simplest answer, hang out on the duel server and ask for help.

I also think that no one should start out as a shielder. It's a good way to suck for a long time. Better off biting the bullet and starting out 2 hander and learning how to block.

I second this.

Also - you're going to be fairly weak until you hit lv 25 or so - hang in there!
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Offline Tot.

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2011, 12:54:43 am »
0
It's a good way to suck for a long time. Better off biting the bullet and starting out 2 hander and learning how to block.

Uh, no. Starting as a 2-hander will lead you to quitting the game if not jumping out of the window. I dont know anyone neither from native or from cRPG who didnt start as shielder to leatn the basics without dying like a fly every time someone looks at you.

@OP

There are two good tutorial movies about Warband combat, watching them is a very good idea and is quite enjoyable actually:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9jHcZjWw9U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZZnl09qBKM&feature=related

There's also a, uhm, duelling video. You could safely say that its petty much average level of a random player right now in Warband, unless he's really new.

Here's a guide about the basics of melee mechanics. Reading it might not be as enjoyable as watching the videos above but if youre feeling like you need to get a grasp on everything, there it is.

About duel server: it might be a good idea to try it, it is a good idea if you have someone to spar with. Usual duelling crowd will eat you alive honestly if youre as green as you say.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2011, 12:56:15 am by Tot. »
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Offline Torp

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2011, 01:11:24 am »
+1
i would start aiming for 25+ in battle servers, and your build seems good for not dying instantly. As a new guy on battle, try to see if you can survive for a long time, and try to take some hits for your teammates with your shield. That will also leave you with opportunities to get a lucky hit in once in a while.

After hitting 25, you can start gonig to duel servers - say that you are new and need help, and someone will most likely offer to help you, if not; post in here. Also try the single player practice mode - that's what taught me how to manual block.

Warband is a very hard game at first, and it takes a long time to learn the melee mechanics properly - but that is, in my opinion, what makes it fun. You actually have to practice and be good in order to do well, and you have to constantly think and react.

So to sum up; it will be hard and take time to learn it, but in the long run it 'pays off'

Offline Digglez

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2011, 01:33:26 am »
+1
Warband & cRPG in particular have high learning curves.  Give it time and you will be very pleased.  I was in the same boat as you, I probably got 10 total kills my first generation.

Stay shielder! You can contribute alot more as new player with shield.  Play on siege & buy small/medium/siege ladder/siege shield/construction material when money allows!

Medium ladder is the single biggest contributor of success to winning as offense on Siege.

Offline Slamz

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2011, 01:36:25 am »
+3
My game improved a fair bit after about an hour on the duel server in vent with people willing to help.  I learned stuff that I never adequately grasped during my entire first generation character's career.

For example:

Left-to-right swing (backhand swing)
This is your quickest attack and is best done while simultaneously stepping to the right of your target, as if you were going to run past him, then pivot to face him after your attack lands, block his counter-attack and repeat.  This is why you often see two people spinning around each other when they fight -- they are both doing the left-to-right swing with a step to the right, which causes them to whirl around each other.  If you don't step to the right of them as you swing, your attack will take longer to land and spammers will get you.

Right-to-left swing (forehand swing)
This is a longer reaching attack, but is slower to land than a backhand swing.  I use it against backpedalers (where left-to-right wouldn't have the range to hit them), people who turn their back and run away or to try and get a surprise hit on someone that's closing with me.  It's my least used attack.

Overhand swing
This is inferior to the backhand swing for fighting someone 1 on 1 but it's a great way to bonk someone on the head with little risk to your teammates.  I mostly do this when I come into a 5v1 melee where the 1 enemy is snaking his way through the crowd and the crowd is mostly killing each other with stupid side swings.  I ready my overhand and wait for the guy to snake past me and wham, right in the head.

Thrust
Use this similar to the overhand -- not for 1v1 combat so much as for group combat where you want to avoid slicing teammates, or to reach someone that's too far away for a backhand.  It has good reach.


Also be aware of the "hold" maneuver.  Consider the following scenario:
* You whack his shield
* He whacks your shield
* You whack his shield
* He whacks your shield
* You hold your attack for half a second, then release it
* He detects a pause in your tit-for-tat rhythm, sees it as an opening, goes to swing and them wham, your delayed swing hits him.

2H spammers often don't bother with this but shielders do it frequently.  Don't wait for him to attack -- just establish a rhythm and then throw in a delayed swing to throw off the rhythm.  Don't do this every time -- keep them guessing by doing it maybe 1 time in 3.


Your best bet against the 2H spammers, though, is the backhand swing and step maneuver.  Delayed swings won't work against spammers because all they're doing is swing-swing-swing-swing-swing-swing-swing.  A good backhand-and-step, though, can often get in a hit faster than them and sometimes you can get in two or three hits before they realize they need to stop spamming and get in a parry.


Another thing to think about is to just hide behind your shield more and attack less, if you find yourself getting creamed while your shield was still full health.  By making someone bang on your shield for 10 seconds, you may be delaying one of the enemy's top players, and the longer you hold them off, the greater the odds are that someone will notice what's going on and help you.

At any rate, I think the best early thing to understand are the differences in the swings.  Newbie mistake #1 is probably just alternating the 4 swing directions without realizing the differences between them.  Forehand swings in a 1v1 duel generally do nothing except get you hit.

Also, you might try something like a Nordic Short War Sword or a Wakizashi.  The damage isn't great but the speed is.  Once you can start landing blows with those weapons, then try switching to some of the slower, harder hitting weapons and see if you can adjust what you learned to them.
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Offline Bjord

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2011, 01:44:33 am »
-1
Nah, it's not as hard as people make it sound.
 
Just spend a lot of time on the duel server, that's what everyone else who is good did. If you want die less and get more kills, just stick with your teammates. Ganking etc is the easiest way.
 
I recommend you try either 2h or polearm, the latter since it's pretty much the easiest of the no-shield classes. Assuming you're not aiming to be a hoplite.
 
It offers a wide variety of deadly and long weapons, and if I were you I'd try my luck with either the good ole poleaxe or long hafted blade. Can't go wrong with backpedal spam.
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Offline Dezilagel

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2011, 02:22:12 am »
+1
Uh, no. Starting as a 2-hander will lead you to quitting the game if not jumping out of the window. I dont know anyone neither from native or from cRPG who didnt start as shielder to leatn the basics without dying like a fly every time someone looks at you.

I did^^
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Offline Kafein

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2011, 02:25:35 am »
0
Play SP before even looking at that "Multiplayer" button or mods. Best piece of advice I can tell. No one I met that played SP a reasonable amount of time ever had problems starting MP. And it's really a fun game.


Shield is IMO not a good start if you already played a little SP. Having to block isn't that problematic when you have better reach and better damage (sometimes better speed).

Go for the cookie-cutter inf : DGS, 21/18 (to begin with) or 18/21. You don't need much more than basic offense and footwork to start killing, and cav will think twice before attacking you (not the case of shielders).

Offline Thucydides

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2011, 02:40:18 am »
0

Offline Corrado_Decimo

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2011, 02:45:02 am »
0
well you'll keep dying over and over... but keep playing and watch veterans, spend some time in duel servers.

you got some really good advices here already so you'll work your way and style pretty soon.

Offline Jarlek

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2011, 03:03:27 am »
0
Uh, no. Starting as a 2-hander will lead you to quitting the game if not jumping out of the window. I dont know anyone neither from native or from cRPG who didnt start as shielder to leatn the basics without dying like a fly every time someone looks at you.
-snip-
*Smiles and waves*

I started as a polearmer (with some 2h, herpaderpa first build fail) and was aiming to get a horse. This was in december 2010, mind.

Personally I say you should start as a polearm and stick in groups. Not as retarded as 2h, piking will ALWAYS be good for your teammate (except tk, duh) and the long reach and decent speed is good to learn with.

I also STRONGLY suggest you make a Skip The Fun character just to practice dueling with. Just go for any build you'll like and practice manual blocking. It's important for everyone. ESPECIALLY shielders/archers/throwers since people are gonna spam you the moment you lose your shield/they get close enough.

Personally I think that 1h is not the best class to start with in cRPG. The high weight of shields makes you really slow and kinda forces you to know a lot about weapon range and the like. I think that for melee the polearms are the easiest to start with if you play supportively and 2h if you just mindlessly rush (aka retard tactics) the enemy.

I'm also gonna +1 the "play SP" suggestion. There are LOADS of fun and great mods out there, where you can also practice teamtactics (they apply to MP too) while learning the basics. Just remember to turn of auto block and the like.

And at last I'm gonna give you the best advice you can get:
ALWAYS try.
If you can't manual block and find yourself without a shield, just TRY. After some time you will learn it.
Don't know how to use footwork properly? Just TRY to guess the range/speed/whatever of you and your opponents weapon. Sometimes you will be right.
Not sure where to aim to hit your enemy? Just TRY to shoot and see where it ends and change accordingly.

PS: You can also hop on a TS and ask for advice from people. Hit me up in 78.129.194.2:9106. I'm Jarlek. I'd be happy to give you tips and train a bit with you. Also I'm EU if you wanna train, but tips/suggestion/guidance is irrelevant of ping anyway.
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Offline Elazul

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2011, 05:15:44 am »
0
Wow... I didn't expect such a large amount of positive feedback! Thanks for the information everyone! I did go ahead and create a skip the fun character just now and made a 2h maul wielder. Fun stuff. Actually able to kill people occasionally... I just need to get better at blocking. Thanks again everyone!

Offline Elazul

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Re: Wow... this is frustrating...
« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2011, 10:22:09 am »
0
Ok, just going to ask this question here since I don't want to spam up the forum with new threads.

I just got to level 23 for my 1h/shielder. I ended up picking up a crossbow for a sidearm and I like it very much. I was wondering if I wanted to specialize in crossbow and perhaps some other melee weapon what would be a good build and should I reset my character or just create a new one or just wait until 31 and do the hairloom thing?