1h shield is too difficult at the moment

[Bulzur]

I know. All I'm saying is that having ONE more attack direction wouldn't suddenly make them "OMFG OP" but it would REALLY help them out. Currently they are the least powerful melee option, all I want is to give them a buff.

LOL
Forgive me, i just imagined how the overhead one hand spear animation would look.
So we have this spear/shield guy, immune to cav and archers, if he's smart. But he can't duel properly against other melee users, so you want to give him a "big" buff, by allowing overhead with it, imaright ?

I say "no". For the reason i'm the 2h miadao melee guy who want at least one easy kill, or one sure hit when i manage to reach that spear/shield guy alive. The difference between only downblocking, and being aware of the ennemy animation, and doing upblock or downblock according to the situation is huge, imo. That's the reason why pikemen get slaughtered, and longspearmen can own you.
I don't think they need a buff just because the other 1h weapon for shielders are so op that they are overused. I played a spear/shield once, and most of the times, ennemies don't expect your spear to hit so early, and take a LOT of damage from that pierce stab. Enough time to switch to a quaterstaff, without a shield, and have all 4 attack directions.

[Jarlek]

LOL
Forgive me, i just imagined how the overhead one hand spear animation would look.
So we have this spear/shield guy, immune to cav and archers, if he's smart. But he can't duel properly against other melee users, so you want to give him a "big" buff, by allowing overhead with it, imaright ?

I say "no". For the reason i'm the 2h miadao melee guy who want at least one easy kill, or one sure hit when i manage to reach that spear/shield guy alive. The difference between only downblocking, and being aware of the ennemy animation, and doing upblock or downblock according to the situation is huge, imo. That's the reason why pikemen get slaughtered, and longspearmen can own you.
I don't think they need a buff just because the other 1h weapon for shielders are so op that they are overused. I played a spear/shield once, and most of the times, ennemies don't expect your spear to hit so early, and take a LOT of damage from that pierce stab. Enough time to switch to a quaterstaff, without a shield, and have all 4 attack directions.

So your saying that spear+shield would be OP if they had 1 more attack direction? Doesn't necessarily have to be overhead btw.

And "immune to cav and archer" my ass. Sure, cav wont be able to to touch him, but shields aren't that good against archers, really. They can stop the arrows in front of them, but the decrease in shield width makes them able to shoot on your sides. (where side=anything not 30 degrees infront of you). Also archers can just run away from people with shields because of their huge weight. Still this is not relevant really, you just don't want spear&shields to get another attack direction because it's the only class you can kill. You said so yourself.

And of course I know you can switch to no-shield mode. That's not the point. The point is that there really is no reason for spearmen to only have one attack direction. And they don't do "a LOT of damage" with the spear. Yeah, if you got the speed bonus from you running towards the ennemy and him running to you, then yes you do a lot of damage. That is the same for ALL weapons. The spear&shield also have a lot of bouncing because of it's length, it's damage reduction and because it's a stab (stabs, because of their animations, usually hit early so they are outside the "sweetspot". This is why most people, regardless of the weapon, looks to the side/ground/air when they start the animation and then "move" the stab into the enemy).

[Corrado_Decimo]

LOL
Forgive me, i just imagined how the overhead one hand spear animation would look.
So we have this spear/shield guy, immune to cav and archers, if he's smart. But he can't duel properly against other melee users, so you want to give him a "big" buff, by allowing overhead with it, imaright ?

I say "no". For the reason i'm the 2h miadao melee guy who want at least one easy kill, or one sure hit when i manage to reach that spear/shield guy alive. The difference between only downblocking, and being aware of the ennemy animation, and doing upblock or downblock according to the situation is huge, imo. That's the reason why pikemen get slaughtered, and longspearmen can own you.
I don't think they need a buff just because the other 1h weapon for shielders are so op that they are overused. I played a spear/shield once, and most of the times, ennemies don't expect your spear to hit so early, and take a LOT of damage from that pierce stab. Enough time to switch to a quaterstaff, without a shield, and have all 4 attack directions.

well spearmen could use the overhead stab animation. anyway spearmen are so slow that you can't miss a block with em.

and about OP or not... usually the reason a build is underplayed is because it's gimp. 5 months ago, there was no throwers around. 3months ago throwers got balanced and now we see em a reasonable amount. 9 months ago there was an archery galore. they got the new nockin arrow animation and archer number gone down. now there is a reasonable amount.

should be the same with spearmen. i don't really give it a damn about playing it but all the fixes that brings a little diversity in the usual and boring builds is welcome imo.

last thing. now if you see a line of spearmen, you just block down and effortly pass through. while against a normal mixed infantry line you can't without blocking the impossible.

with a overhead stab, spearmens will still be slow as hell and easymode to kill but at least not THAT easy.

**same could apply to crossbows... when there is too much spam about one build, usually means that's a little unbalanced. (people will not magically roll one just for fun.. cmon.)

This is why most people, regardless of the weapon, looks to the side/ground/air when they start the animation and then "move" the stab into the enemy).

that's why i find the pikeman really effective at aiming the sky then releasing a downward stab. that bypass most near teammates to poke with good power the target 2 meters away. i used to aim sides, roflcopter, but the most effective (while the right to left stab is the most powerful) in terms of teamwounds and surprise, it's the "skydiving thrust of doom" 

[Tankkk]

I'm playing a polearm guy and I do like to use spears quite often as I use other weapons. And I don't do too  bad with spears. They are quite fast weapons without shield. Sure that you would'nt fight with a spear and a shield if you don't have some mates close to you to protect you.
If you're alone you just put your shield on your back to fight your oponent. It's exactly as using a bastard or a longsword, you can use a shield to protect from ranged but you keep it on your back when you fight because you don't wanna be to slow...

It's not the most destructive weapon of cRPG, ok.  For the moment it's a fast, long and cheap one. I think to make it more realist and effective, it should do 2 more damages points in piercing.

But please don't speak again about this one handed overhead stab animation of a 2.5meters weapon long that would just be horrible and out of any realistic considerations!  If I give you a shield and a spear that long in the other hand, you just could hit one way (piercing as it is in the game). I think it's a big enought reason to keep this one attack direction.

[Jarlek]

I'm playing a polearm guy and I do like to use spears quite often as I use other weapons. And I don't do too  bad with spears. They are quite fast weapons without shield. Sure that you would'nt fight with a spear and a shield if you don't have some mates close to you to protect you.
If you're alone you just put your shield on your back to fight your oponent. It's exactly as using a bastard or a longsword, you can use a shield to protect from ranged but you keep it on your back when you fight because you don't wanna be to slow...

It's not the most destructive weapon of cRPG, ok.  For the moment it's a fast, long and cheap one. I think to make it more realist and effective, it should do 2 more damages points in piercing.

But please don't speak again about this one handed overhead stab animation of a 2.5meters weapon long that would just be horrible and out of any realistic considerations!  If I give you a shield and a spear that long in the other hand, you just could hit one way (piercing as it is in the game). I think it's a big enought reason to keep this one attack direction.

Wut? Nobody wanted that! That would just look gay as hell! If I wanted a "up" attack it should rather be a high stab, like you see on those old greek heroic vases. But personally I say one type of swing would be usefull. Doing low blunt damage and not being the fastest move in your arsenal, but still goes a long way to make your attacks more than obvious. ("oh, that spearman just lowered his shield and is gonna attack! Gee, I wonder which direction he's gonna attack from, considering he only have one!" is how it is now)

[Xant]

I think that Paul and Fasader should quickly do something about this 1h+shield situation. They need a hefty buff. The sooner the better.

[Corrado_Decimo]

I think that Paul and Fasader should quickly do something about this 1h+shield situation. They need a hefty buff. The sooner the better.

stop trolling you! we serious!

[Siiem]

I think that Paul and Fasader should quickly do something about this 1h+shield situation. They need a hefty buff. The sooner the better.

This!

[Leshma]

I think that Paul and Fasader should quickly do something about this 1h+shield situation. They need a hefty buff. The sooner the better.

I agree.

I hurd you've got Spamitar. I laid my eyes on steel pick

When I get MW version I'm gonna change name into Druzhina_Leshma_FuckYeah

[San]

One handed:         29799 (24.5%)
Two handed:        44510 (36.6%)
Polearms:         47422 (38.9%)

I wouldn't say too difficult, just worse.

In NA, you rarely see steel picks or even scimitars (compared to before) nowadays.

But that's probably because

(click to show/hide)

I never see that many 1h anyways

[Siiem]

I wouldn't say too difficult, just worse.

I agree, buff it so it's more equal to the rest of the statistics you can find! Keyword, buff.

[Karmazyn]

I spected Paul and he as 1h shield always switched to polearm to buff his kills.
When I talk about 1h shield I talk about normal builds not about 12/24 mw steel pick exploit builds.

[Leshma]

When I talk about 1h shield I talk about normal builds not about 12/24 mw steel pick exploit builds.

So you call a whole clan exploiters. Shame on you!

[Corrado_Decimo]

One handed:         29799 (24.5%)
Two handed:        44510 (36.6%)
Polearms:         47422 (38.9%)

I wouldn't say too difficult, just worse.

In NA, you rarely see steel picks or even scimitars (compared to before) nowadays.

But that's probably because

(click to show/hide)

I never see that many 1h anyways

well in eu, the majority infantry rerolled polearms. the bigger part of ranged gone crossbow. a good amount of 2h rerolled 1h STR biased builds with some riding points. the russians still stay with STR shielders, 1h cavalry, some good archers.

i see a bit lesser 1handed than the rest of builds but the few i see are really good, smart and steady scoring like a "one man army".

[Bulzur]

well spearmen could use the overhead stab animation. anyway spearmen are so slow that you can't miss a block with em.

and about OP or not... usually the reason a build is underplayed is because it's gimp. 5 months ago, there was no throwers around. 3months ago throwers got balanced and now we see em a reasonable amount. 9 months ago there was an archery galore. they got the new nockin arrow animation and archer number gone down. now there is a reasonable amount.

should be the same with spearmen. i don't really give it a damn about playing it but all the fixes that brings a little diversity in the usual and boring builds is welcome imo.

last thing. now if you see a line of spearmen, you just block down and effortly pass through. while against a normal mixed infantry line you can't without blocking the impossible.

with a overhead stab, spearmens will still be slow as hell and easymode to kill but at least not THAT easy.

**same could apply to crossbows... when there is too much spam about one build, usually means that's a little unbalanced. (people will not magically roll one just for fun.. cmon.)

that's why i find the pikeman really effective at aiming the sky then releasing a downward stab. that bypass most near teammates to poke with good power the target 2 meters away. i used to aim sides, roflcopter, but the most effective (while the right to left stab is the most powerful) in terms of teamwounds and surprise, it's the "skydiving thrust of doom" 

Groups of spear/shield can be deadly, since they can stab at your side, and once they hit you, they can spam that till your death. On Eu1, just today, you can see 4 Board Shield/awlpikes going together, led by Sultan Eren. And they're doing fine, imo.

Oh, and Zapper, about the "you bounce often with a spear/shield", l2p. All longpsear and pikeman know now how to aim at the side before going on the target, for speed bonus and such. Why shouldn't the shielder do that too ? Because they're used of just facehugging, block, slash, block, slash ? Not our fault.
And yes, i DO want at least one easy kill, that's the rock/paper/scisors thing, imaright. I get owned by archers, cav, got duels with 2h/Polearms and shield/1h, and can deal with more ease with longspear/pike and shield/spear. That's the way it is.