So, Arrows are actually paper airplanes now...

[Tears of Destiny]

I'm kicking ass on my archer, maybe you should try aiming higher, you know like a real bow, it's not a 50 cal anymore, deal with it.

Out of Idle curiosity, name of archer character?

[Warcat]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3997HZuWjk

nice video, now compare what an arrow from a good bow does to a naked/leather armored/13th century non "specially hardened and toughened armor" with what arrows do in cRPG. Even if someone survives a blow through their body, they won't be back in that battle doing a Boromir on their enemies like nothing happened.

[Paul]

"150 miles per hour" 

Your video proves his point, that arrows are absurdly slow.

What the f...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnPcyGjYZmc&feature=related

He clearly states(1:20) that the arrow starts at 52 m/s or 171 fps (117 mph) when using ungabunga units. In crpg the longbow starts (minimum PD) at 60 m/s or 200 fps(136 mph). The guy in the video is said to be an expert archer using a high end 150 pound longbow.

[Seawied]

using ungabunga units

 


btw, 52 (meters a second) = 116.320687 mph

[Elerion]

What the f...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnPcyGjYZmc&feature=related

He clearly states(1:20) that the arrow starts at 52 m/s or 171 fps (117 mph) when using ungabunga units. In crpg the longbow starts (minimum PD) at 60 m/s or 200 fps(136 mph). The guy in the video is said to be an expert archer using a high end 150 pound longbow.

If you're going to keep using that documentary as a source for missile speed, you might also consider the part where he says Longbows could shoot "more than twice as far" as crossbows.

--> http://youtu.be/85CcSgnDgPo?t=1m23s <--

That implies crossbows had far lower missile speed than bows (at least in a universe where all arrows/bolts have the same flight physics).

[Paul]

Ok, in the other video they say that they use 140 mph which is just above the 60 m/s we use(minimum PD, mundane longbow). Fine to me. And we don't set the starting velocities because of that video. We did some research about experiments being done and used historical sources. 60 m/s is a good value in my opinion when using battle arrows.

I also don't think the long bows can go much faster even with lighter(flight) arrows. It the nature of the bow being a one material bow with a limited "spring speed". I see the natural border at 70 or 80 m/s. It is a bit hard to explain but it doesn't behave like a ideal spring with F = m*a = D * s where the final speed after the acceleration can be increased endlessly with raising the spring constant or draw lengh(D, s) or lowering arrow mass(m). At some point the wood can't go faster and even a lighter arrow would have the same starting speed as a heavier one (and the bow thus loses efficiency). So the only thing a very high draw weight(>150 pond) longbow can do better than one of those in the "sweetspot" draw weight of 130-140 pound is accelerating heavier arrows (pretty important to penetrate armor) close to the bows max speed.

Composite or even steel bows(xbow) are different. Here the max spring speed seems to be alot higher allowing to achieve very high starting velocity(and thus high range) with special light flight arrows. So with special arrows those turkish composite bow can achieve 250fps++ easily. However with battle arrows that need some weight to be useful against armor they are back at equal ground with the longbow I think with the draw weight and thus human strength as a limiter.

At the moment we can't use different arrow types that have their own starting velocity/friction simulating heavy battle, lighter flight arrowsand  maybe with some kind of hybrids in between. Without WSE it's battle arrows for everyone.

[Gnjus]

Aaawww, poor little archers things, my soul weeps for you and my heart is broken......

[Paul]

It implies that arrows performed alot better aerodynamically. In the future with WSE I'd give bows a lower friction value than crossbows. I agree though that the 1 slot crossbows have a too high starting speed. The ones with the steel bow(2 slot) are fine in my opinion.

[Kenji]

Fister_Sister

Fallen archers have my respect, shooting me off my horse is a death full of agony and honor.

I can't really tell if the archers are actually buffed or nerfed, since I don't notice taking great damage from cut bow users (Longbow/Xbow/Throw still hurts, a lot)

[Jayne_Cobbb]

It is much harder.  Just hitting people with the slow speed is hard.  Also, the Heirlooms do not help any more (not really), so +3 bows are not really worth it.

The damage is not changed too much, but i have noticed that vs high armor I never get kills unless I head shot. 

[Elerion]

It implies that arrows performed alot better aerodynamically. In the future with WSE I'd give bows a lower friction value than crossbows. I agree though that the 1 slot crossbows have a too high starting speed. The ones with the steel bow(2 slot) are fine in my opinion.

I don't disagree that aerodynamics could be a significant reason, but as mentioned, in the Warband universe all missiles have the same physics. The way the Warband engine handles this is by giving crossbows higher damage (representing a potentially higher muzzle speed and more devastating missile) and low missile speed (representing worse aerodynamics, causing them to drop faster). Bows on the other hand get reduced damage and a high missile speed, giving them a longer trajectory but causing less damage once they hit.

Now, for some reason, bows in cRPG have less damage and a shorter trajectory. It doesn't make sense from a game balance point of view, nor from a realism point of view (which I think we should just ignore, but still).

If you were worried about Strategus, I would have done this: http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,10317.0.html

[Lactose_the_intolerant]

on plain battle fields. i laugh at the arrows coming at me and dodge em. like at the end of this video :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bFTw95pJp8

[Beans]

Why is there such a hard on for realism with archery in regards to velocity? Who gives a fuck? I feel pretty bad for archers, the arrows are so slow dodging arrow fire is a complete joke now. It was even easy before but now I barley have to zig zag at all.

Literally nothing else in the game is balanced around what is realistic, just basic reality, IE armor adds weight and increases protection.

[Gorath]

Literally nothing else in the game is balanced around what is realistic, just basic reality, IE armor adds weight and increases protection.

And being unable to sheathe a pike in your ass magically.
Carrying a flamberge, katana, shield, great maul all at once.
etc

But yup, literally nothing else is balanced around what's realistic.....

[Mannhammer]

On the bright side. One bonus to the new arrow speed is that when I get shot at by another archer I can go outside have a smoke, come back in then dodge.