Messages

1

Game Balance Discussion / Re: Blatant rage about 2h facehugging uber power

« on: November 11, 2011, 03:52:06 pm »

Well, by default the 1h, 2h and pole share the same sweetspot bounds.

(click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

   def get_sweet_spot_factor(deliverer_agent_no, receiver_agent_no):
            if deliverer_agent_no < 0 || agents[deliverer_agent_no].is_couching():
                    return 1.0
     
            attack_direction = agents[deliverer_agent_no].attack_rec.direction
     
            if attack_direction == at_overhead:
                    anim_progress = agents[deliverer_agent_no].action_channels[1].progress
                    sweetspot_lower_bound = 0.3
                    sweetspot_upper_bound = 0.9
                    sweetspot_optimal_upper_bound = 1.0
                    sweetspot_optimal_lower_bound = 0.45
            elif attack_direction == at_thrust:
                    anim_progress = agents[deliverer_agent_no].action_channels[1].progress
                    sweetspot_lower_bound = 0.3
                    sweetspot_upper_bound = 0.85
                    sweetspot_optimal_upper_bound = 0.7
                    sweetspot_optimal_lower_bound = 0.45
            else if agents[deliverer_agent_no].horse_agent_no < 0 and receiver_agent_no >= 0:
                    pos_diff_vec = (agents[deliverer_agent_no].position - agents[receiver_agent_no].position).vec2().normalize()
                    anim_progress = pos_diff_vec.dot(agents[deliverer_agent_no].movement_dir.vec2())
                    sweetspot_lower_bound = 0.05
                    sweetspot_upper_bound = 0.9
                    sweetspot_optimal_upper_bound = 1.0
                    sweetspot_optimal_lower_bound = 0.55
            else:
                    anim_progress = agents[deliverer_agent_no].action_channels[1].progress
                    sweetspot_lower_bound = 0.2
                    sweetspot_upper_bound = 0.9
                    sweetspot_optimal_upper_bound = 0.7
                    sweetspot_optimal_lower_bound = 0.45
     
            if anim_progress <= sweetspot_lower_bound:
                    return 0.0
     
            if anim_progress <= sweetspot_optimal_lower_bound:
                    return clamp((anim_progress - sweetspot_lower_bound) / (sweetspot_optimal_lower_bound - sweetspot_lower_bound), 0.0, 1.0)
     
            if anim_progress >= sweetspot_optimal_upper_bound:
                    return clamp((anim_progress - sweetspot_upper_bound) / (sweetspot_optimal_upper_bound - sweetspot_upper_bound), 0.0, 1.0)
     
            return 1.0

Could be split so 1h gets a less bitchy stab but that would need some work to get it done correctly. But cmp lazy and me too.

Isn't this determining the factor due to the stage of the animation during which the hit was detected (using anim_progress)? I was talking about the modification due to the distance to the hit relative to the length of the weapon (hilt vs. tip).

2

Suggestions Corner / Re: Add a 0 difficulty Francisca

« on: November 11, 2011, 03:38:57 pm »

I have been begging for years to get throw able boots. Boots are basic weapon that most soldiers fielded and virtually all of them had some skill in throwing their boots.
These is nothing more hillarious than a cav trotting along and get knocked off his horse with a boot to the head. If the first one does not kill him, you re-boot.

It will be 0 slot (uses the boots slot) 2 ammo (obviously) and do blunt damage.

3

Spam / Re: RELIGION

« on: November 11, 2011, 03:29:37 pm »

As an atheist I am offended by any mentioning of god. Any of them.

Discussing god should be a bannable offense.


God wills it!

4

Game Balance Discussion / Re: Blatant rage about 2h facehugging uber power

« on: November 11, 2011, 11:49:03 am »

It is not the collision detection. The mechanics are the same for all weapons. The difference is in the animation and the absolute length of the weapon.

Regarding the animation: the game considers the weapon and a straight line coming out of the right fist with length equal to the "reach" stat. Depending on the animation, you can have your fist inside the target before the rest of the blade hits. This is bound to happen if in the animation the wrist rotates, so effectively in the early stages the hilt is traveling before the tip, which catches up later. The system will register a "0" distance hit (from your fist).

With 2H animations, the orientation of the blade during the swing is such that it rotates less than the 1H blade. The 1H animation chamber position really pulls it behind you back. Compare for example  the right swing -  in 1H you start with the blade tip pointing nearly backward and the hilt travels in front of the blade. Not so much with 2H. Also the overhead - in 1H you start with the blade so far behind your shoulder that a short range hit is like hammering the opponent with your fist which the blade is in the opposite direction.

Regarding the absolute length: the game modifies the damage depending on the relative values of the "reach" parameter and the distance of the hit detection from the fist. With short weapons, every cm makes a much bigger difference. Since there is also some discretization in the hit detection it is very likely that with short weapons it will produce extreme readings, meaning many hits will register as 0 range hits (hand inside the opponent mesh), but fluctuations to the other side do not truncate to full range hits, they just become misses. short weapons become increasingly sensitive to this and daggers in particular are terrible because of this.

TL;DR
Not much can be done, unless the modders can mess with how damage is modified according to the hit detection distance. If they can, the variation in damage as a function of the relative distance along the blade (0--100%) should scale less as the weapon is shorter (i.e. smaller difference in damage between 0 and 100% of the reach). Dagger length weapons should not be affected by this mechanism at all.

5

General Discussion / Re: I'm done with C-RPG unless upkeep costs change

« on: November 11, 2011, 11:16:44 am »

1. play your toon to 31
2. check the market for highly sought after looms
3. retire and loom that item
4. sell your new heirloom for an absurd sum
5. play in plate and helmet with gilded mustache till your next retirement.

(I am pretty sure that there should be a "profit" in the list somewhere)

Remember that you need the helmet with the gilded mustache. That is very important.

6

Suggestions Corner / Re: SO whats up with Long Spears/Pike

« on: November 10, 2011, 12:20:48 pm »

This would be a buff...

How is unbalanced a buff?

7

Realism Discussion / Re: Horses dont have genitalia

« on: November 09, 2011, 04:26:48 pm »

Brilliant idea!

8

Suggestions Corner / Re: Alt XP + Gold bonus to main

« on: November 09, 2011, 04:03:51 pm »

copied for another thread:

When retiring an alt, allow it to inherit all its belonging to any of your characters

This means very long cycles of equipment/money transfers and a real investment in the alt. Since you spent time in the game and money is the same as spending time, there is no balancing issue - someone played in pesant gear in order to make money, it does not matter with which character. For the other players it does not matter if I play my main or my alts, they do not see any real difference.

No XP transfer. That is silly and against the very word "experience", as you main did not experience anything.

9

Suggestions Corner / Re: Making alts more viable again

« on: November 09, 2011, 03:59:14 pm »

When retiring an alt, allow it to inherit all its belonging to any of your characters

This means very long cycles of equipment/money transfers. Since you spent time in the game and money is the same as spending time, there is no balancing issue. For the other players it does not matter if I play my main or my alts, they do not see any real difference.

No XP transfer. That is silly and against the very word "experience", as you main did not experience anything.

10

Suggestions Corner / Re: SO whats up with Long Spears/Pike

« on: November 09, 2011, 03:48:09 pm »

Old suggestions have been to slow down attack speed more, or remove block. Dunno just seems one of those few items that screams 'balance ' me. What do you all think? 

Slowing the animation means even more area attacks. Hit detection is on as long as the animation is playing - longer animation means a longer period of waving it around till it touches something and registering a hit.

Removing block is killing the weapon, especially since it cannot even chamber block swings. Whoever is carrying a long spear already pays a lot in defense - he runs slower and exposed to arrows, not to mention the slots restriction.

"Unbalanced" flag as someone suggested above does make sense though. Unlike a spear or a Bec, it is gripped off its center of gravity. In compensation it should get a small damage boost and speed boost (fast thrust, but predictable, cannot spam it or faint quickly).

11

Suggestions Corner / Re: We should be able to arrange are C-Rpg inventory...

« on: November 09, 2011, 03:38:23 pm »

Yes please!
At least a storage or a flag for items that I do not want to appear in-game equipment screen. I have too many items that I barely use but don't want to sell.

12

Suggestions Corner / Re: Make the Flamburge sheathable!

« on: November 03, 2011, 11:03:38 am »

Atleast at one point in all of our lives.. We have pondered the age old question: "Wait... Why can you sheath glaives, long hafted blades, awlpikes, great long bardiches, long bardiches etc. And not the flamberge, yet all these weapons are longer?"

I have thought that just now. If you people litter this thread saying "balance reasons", you obviously must be deluded. The great long bardiche is better in every way (+1 speed, +3 reach, bonus against shields sheathable. So think of that first. Kthx

/end rant

You got the problem right, but the solution reversed - ALL these weapons should have been unsheathable.

I dont know what stupid game started this trend of sheathing weapons on your back being cool. Yes it is, if you are about to march all day and have absolutely NO intention to use this weapon today, then maybe. It is actually much more cooler and tactically interesting game-wise, when you can only carry one oversized weapon and it drops to the ground when you pull out a secondary. Nearly all poles and 2H weapons should be unsheathable.

13

Game Balance Discussion / Re: Remove the polearm stun in the next patch please.

« on: October 24, 2011, 05:24:43 pm »

You do not recall correctly.
All testers did NOT agree.

OK not all, there was one that didn't.

And it wasn't spears needed help, it was Vaegir archers pulling out scimitars and owning Nords.
The justifications came later.

So Nords needed help in general against spamitars so polestun was implemented? Vaegirs also had a spear melee class.

The 2H spear classes were very weak. Initially the spears were made faster, but that just turned then into spam machines. Without any ability to control distance, it meant that most opponents and shielders in particular would simply run up to the spearman, block down (or everything with a shield), worst case get a low damage blow from a swinging spear and proceed to kill them from 0 range. polestun gave spears a chance for a second attack and some short range defense (low damage but at least a minor stun). It was mean for spears - a long stick with a arrow to dagger size tip, not to the guillotine on a stick polearms that we have in CRPG.

14

Game Balance Discussion / Re: Remove the polearm stun in the next patch please.

« on: October 21, 2011, 03:52:05 pm »

Most.....retarded.....frustrating.....shit.........ever!

Now I wonder, did the Warband devs actually put this in as a feature or was it some unpleasant side effect?

If the former is the case, what where they thinking? Hey, let's implement that when a polearm hits someone his character spasms like a moron. So that you can sidestep and keep hitting and stunning him! That's so cool cause you can kill someone without him being able to do anything about it! It's obviously a realistic representation of some effect pole mounted weapons have on the human body.

Lets see if I recall this correctly from WB beta...

All testers agreed that spears (in 2H grip) sucked and the game engine could not represent this style of fighting. The problem was that the spear had only 1 viable attack and the swings were very weak. Increasing spear speeds or swing damage was not a good idea. The devs tried a few things, for example giving spears KD when hitting the legs, etc to represent swipes and tackles moves, but that did not work out. Eventually they went with the stun to give spears the opportunity to hit with a swing for low damage and reposition for a stab.

That was with SPEARS in mind and later slow long axes, not monstrous and fast poleaxes and Becs that we have in cRPG. It was not an ideal solution, but it helped 2H spears a bit - the problem is that it applies across the board to all polearms and I think that also to 1H-polarm.

15

Suggestions Corner / Re: Make glancing happen less?

« on: October 21, 2011, 03:32:18 pm »

The 1H glancing is an old problem that has nothing to do with the weapon damage. It is a combination of tw othings:

1. The animation that makes you more prone to hitting with the lower part of the weapon at short range. E.g., "extended arm" animation means that you hit an enemy who is standing on your toes with the hilt of the weapon. Another e.g., the angle between the arm and the blade: lets say the enemy is directly in front and the blade is aligned with your arm then you hit at a given point in the blade. Now if instead the animation has an angle between the blade and the arm (like in a slashing motion) it could hit either higher or lower along the blade depending on the fine details and the exact distance. It will be prone to variations in damage, especially on a short weapon, which leads to the second point:

2. Fast variation of damage along the length of the weapon (1 cm difference in hit location is more significant on a 70cm blade than on a 120cm blade. No to mention the much shorter daggers where this is a major issue). A discrete hit detection in the game engine makes this fluctuate more and in daggers this means more extreme full/minimum damage instead of smooth variations.

If this is at all possible with the new tools, I suggested in the fast to disable the damage variations on very short weapons, or alternatively, decrease the difference between max and min damage as a function of the weapon reach stat, such that shorter weapons suffer less relative penalty: e.g. if now it is between 0.1--1.0 of the damage for hilt--tip collision, it should be X--1.0 range where X is a function of the weapon reach stat.