cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: CrazyCracka420 on October 01, 2013, 07:38:41 pm

Title: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on October 01, 2013, 07:38:41 pm
The area of effect is ridiculous, and it still kicks you after the animation is stopped.  it's literally like a 4 or 5 foot wide kick, and stays active until the foot is dropped back to the ground.   

Feels like I'm going up against Chun Li's rapid fire kicks in Street Fighter 2.

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Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 01, 2013, 08:05:55 pm
The area of effect is ridiculous, and it still kicks you after the animation is stopped.  it's literally like a 4 or 5 foot wide kick, and stays active until the foot is dropped back to the ground.   

Feels like I'm going up against Chun Li's rapid fire kicks in Street Fighter 2.

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i feel you man, i cant count how many times i was kicked even when strafing.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Inglorious on October 01, 2013, 08:09:28 pm
Got dehorsed on a stairwell. Slashed on ground, kick slashed upon standing [ we all know how that goes for downed cav infront of a two hander ] I jumped away upon finally recovering and immediately turned to helicopter stab. Ofc my heavy lance stab is blocked, I'm kicked slashed again, causing me to teeter glitch on the side of the stairwell where I'm yet again kick slashed for the final blow.

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Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Legs on October 01, 2013, 08:39:28 pm
LET'S FACE FACTS,  PROS LIKE ME WILL STILL BE KICKING THE SHIT OUT OF SCRUBS LIKE YOU NO MATTER HOW MANY NERFS YOU PILE ON.

GIT GUD AND LERN2DODGE INSTEAD OF BLAMING THE GAME FOR YOUR OWN FAILURES.

IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE THAT GO PLAY CALL OF DUTY OR SOME OTHER SHITTY GAME THAT PANDERS TO CASUAL GAMING SCUMS.

P.S. UR A my old friendET
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Strudog on October 01, 2013, 08:43:43 pm
Got dehorsed on a stairwell. Slashed on ground, kick slashed upon standing [ we all know how that goes for downed cav infront of a two hander ] I jumped away upon finally recovering and immediately turned to helicopter stab. Ofc my heavy lance stab is blocked, I'm kicked slashed again, causing me to teeter glitch on the side of the stairwell where I'm yet again kick slashed for the final blow.

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STR whore
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Clockworkkiller on October 01, 2013, 09:21:32 pm
FUCK KICKS
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Prpavi on October 01, 2013, 09:25:48 pm
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 material here
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Teeth on October 01, 2013, 09:43:46 pm
You must be one helluva kickabuser to call complaints about kick arc and kick duration whining, with an obnoxious gif even. They are pretty clearly and blatantly borked and very easy to use because of it.

LET'S FACE FACTS,  PROS LIKE ME WILL STILL BE KICKING THE SHIT OUT OF SCRUBS LIKE YOU NO MATTER HOW MANY NERFS YOU PILE ON.

GIT GUD AND LERN2DODGE INSTEAD OF BLAMING THE GAME FOR YOUR OWN FAILURES.

IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE THAT GO PLAY CALL OF DUTY OR SOME OTHER SHITTY GAME THAT PANDERS TO CASUAL GAMING SCUMS.

P.S. UR A my old friendET
Bragging about ability to use kicks, wow.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on October 01, 2013, 10:20:07 pm
LET'S FACE FACTS,  PROS LIKE ME WILL STILL BE KICKING THE SHIT OUT OF SCRUBS LIKE YOU NO MATTER HOW MANY NERFS YOU PILE ON.

GIT GUD AND LERN2DODGE INSTEAD OF BLAMING THE GAME FOR YOUR OWN FAILURES.

IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE THAT GO PLAY CALL OF DUTY OR SOME OTHER SHITTY GAME THAT PANDERS TO CASUAL GAMING SCUMS.

P.S. UR A my old friendET

Awww how cute I got a fan.

Thanks for -1'ing my recent posts, it shows you care, and for that, I am grateful. 
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Falka on October 01, 2013, 10:28:14 pm
Kicks are fine.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on October 01, 2013, 10:58:38 pm
No kicks are not fine, they were fine when you could block while kicking (except down, unless you held down block before kicking).  Their area of effect was fine, and their active time was fine.  There wasn't a large arc in front of your foot (and extending off to the sides of the person's leg), and you couldn't be kicked once the animation stopped raising your leg.  both of those are a problem now.

I made an extremely crude graphic to depict what I'm talking about:

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Until the foot is dropped back to the ground, there's a force field around the leg and foot.  If you try to approach someone from the front (but off to the side) you still get kicked.  This wasn't' a problem with the previous version of kicks (when you could block while kicking).

If the arc and length of time the kick is active was to compensate for not being able to block, you failed miserably.  I'd rather people be able to block than have the bastardized version of kick we have today.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 01, 2013, 11:17:41 pm
LET'S FACE FACTS,  PROS LIKE ME WILL STILL BE KICKING THE SHIT OUT OF SCRUBS LIKE YOU NO MATTER HOW MANY NERFS YOU PILE ON.

GIT GUD AND LERN2DODGE INSTEAD OF BLAMING THE GAME FOR YOUR OWN FAILURES.

IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE THAT GO PLAY CALL OF DUTY OR SOME OTHER SHITTY GAME THAT PANDERS TO CASUAL GAMING SCUMS.

P.S. UR A my old friendET

player base shouldnt suffer because some people have star gates or some shit tied to their legs that allow them to roflport kick. i want to see kicks being a fair opportunity to get past the defense and score a hit, not as abusable piece of crap buggy feature that scrubs rely upon as an area-of-effect-super-fk-your-block move.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Ragni_Bross on October 01, 2013, 11:23:04 pm
I might've said this once or twice before ... remove the kicks ... they're beyond ridiculous.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 01, 2013, 11:24:10 pm
I might've said this once or twice before ... remove the kicks ... they're beyond ridiculous.

i wish man, i wish.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Ragni_Bross on October 01, 2013, 11:33:55 pm
i wish man, i wish.

Been wishing for years now. It's a stupid feature that makes no sense at all. Its existence can't be justified in any way.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 01, 2013, 11:45:42 pm
Been wishing for years now. It's a stupid feature that makes no sense at all. Its existence can't be justified in any way.

yeah, the last thing i would do in a fight is to try to kick a guy armed with a sword. thats just nonsense.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Malaclypse on October 01, 2013, 11:45:59 pm
Working as intended?
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Falka on October 01, 2013, 11:58:58 pm
yeah, the last thing i would do in a fight is to try to kick a guy armed with a sword. thats just nonsense.

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Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: MURDERTRON on October 02, 2013, 12:34:40 am
Its pretty awesome beating the shit out of STR nerds by combining kicks and knockdowns...  Of course, if I miss, I might get 1 hit killed.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Prpavi on October 02, 2013, 12:51:15 am
You must be one helluva kickabuser to call complaints about kick arc and kick duration whining, with an obnoxious gif even. They are pretty clearly and blatantly borked and very easy to use because of it.


Nah man, I barely ever use them, no harm meant just some random lolz with the gif (*´ー`)/

Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 02, 2013, 03:23:45 am
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thats not a real deal, you call me dumb and then you show me a video of a training session.

in any real combat situation, you would get your leg cut off if you were dumb enough to try shit like that.

Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Apsod on October 03, 2013, 02:54:33 pm
thats not a real deal, you call me dumb and then you show me a video of a training session.

in any real combat situation, you would get your leg cut off if you were dumb enough to try shit like that.
Yeah, maybe if you're fighting without proper armor. If you were fighting with the type of armor that is in that video you wouldn't even get a tiny cut if someone hit you with a sword in the foot as you were about to kick someone. A kick on the other hand could make someone lose their balance and fall to the ground which gave the kicker the ability to pull out his knife and stab him through the small crack in the helmet, the armpits or in the groin.


Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 03, 2013, 03:07:38 pm
Yeah, maybe if you're fighting without proper armor. If you were fighting with the type of armor that is in that video you wouldn't even get a tiny cut if someone hit you with a sword in the foot as you were about to kick someone. A kick on the other hand could make someone lose their balance and fall to the ground which gave the kicker the ability to pull out his knife and stab him through the small crack in the helmet, the armpits or in the groin.

kick someone with his shield raised? HELLO? also it depends on weapon. trying to kick a guy with mace would be the last thing you do. also, a proper shieldbash can send the kicker flying to ground. i just fail to see how would any sane person try to kick a guy with a sword or mace and shield in his hand.

sword and shield stance usually has user positioning his dominant leg back, so he can perform surprise lunges and quick advances. this also gives considerable impact resistance from front. a swordsman with proper stance would fuck you up the second you extended your leg. that is why nobody ever tried to kick in sword fight [unless we are talking about fencing, where were attacks like kicks, punches and grapples pretty common].
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Erzengel on October 03, 2013, 03:10:20 pm
Its pretty awesome beating the shit out of STR nerds by combining kicks and knockdowns...  Of course, if I miss, I might get 1 hit killed.

Or the "STR NERD" with the much longer weapon just kicks you once and then you are dead...  :rolleyes:  :P
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Butan on October 03, 2013, 04:14:44 pm
If you want kicks to be "realist" (no area of effect and only kicks when the foot has reached a target), kickers need to be able to modify the course of their kicks mid-air (like IRL too) to represent flexibility of the legs and to add the skill to touch a moving target.

If you have a realist kick but you are still "frozen" in a kick animation everytime you press E, the kick will become completely useless. cRPG need more gameplay mechanics not less.



So +1 for fixing the kick and going toward more realism, but -1 for adding only handicaps and no advantages; thus removing every incentive to actually use the kick.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Adamar on October 03, 2013, 04:19:24 pm
Solution: use kick urself.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Matey on October 03, 2013, 04:37:11 pm
how many threads need to be made before cmp actually changes something? It seems that he has no intention to change it... Clearly everyone just needs to send him forum messages asking him Politely and respectfully to adjust the kicking.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Canuck on October 03, 2013, 04:45:46 pm
I don't think cmp has looked at this one yet, if he had it'd probably be in the chamber of tears by now  :lol:

I agree that kicks should probably be adjusted again. Get rid of the invisible hitbox bullshit and turning and it's much easier for somebody who knows how to sidestep to gain the advantage on the kicker while still maintaining that skillful/deserved free shot on somebody when a kick does land.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on October 03, 2013, 06:04:09 pm
how many threads need to be made before cmp actually changes something? It seems that he has no intention to change it... Clearly everyone just needs to send him forum messages asking him Politely and respectfully to adjust the kicking.

Well I don't think (and I don't think you meant it that way) that the amount of tears or complaints warrant something to be fixed.  I think it's clearly borked by any common sense standards (compared to what kicks used to be anyways), and being able to block while kicking was much better than having a huge area of effect, longer kick duration than the animation and even the length/reach of the kick (not positive about the last one). 

All risk no reward Butan?  The reward is that you are able to get a hit on someone who was blocking your every swing up until that point.  The risk is that you miss or they hit you before you get your kick off.  Seems like a valid risk/reward to me.  I just don't see the justification for area of effect, or the duration the kick is active for.

I think the old kick mechanic was best of both worlds.  In theory being able to turn while kicking (even slightly) would be a possible trade off as well, I just think that it will be quite overpowered, and people with longer weapons obviously don't have to worry about it as much as other classes (basically only 1h's).
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Matey on October 04, 2013, 02:09:03 am
love dem kicks. get into a fight with a guy who spamming them... i have 9 athletics, light armour and one of the longest 1hers in the game and switched to only using stabs and right swings to maximize my reach so as to avoid his kick range... he kicks, i shank him in the gut... he staggers.. and i get kicked while on his side and him staggering after getting stabbed. seems legit.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Phantasmal on October 04, 2013, 05:19:17 pm
The majority of my fights against strength, two hand, armor crutch, kick abusers seem to follow this general format:

Get roughly 5 hits on him. Starts panicking and begins to s key. Start closing in for the kill, throws out a kick that I dodge ninety degrees to his side. Get staggered anyways and killed in one hit to the face. I get two letters sent to me: "gf".

Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Matey on October 04, 2013, 07:07:17 pm
The majority of my fights against strength, two hand, armor crutch, kick abusers seem to follow this general format:

Get roughly 5 hits on him. Starts panicking and begins to s key. Start closing in for the kill, throws out a kick that I dodge 90 ninety degrees to his side. Get staggered anyways and killed in one hit to the face. I get two letters sent to me: "gf".

2handhero: Oh shit... I'm going to lose to a lame 1her... I beseech thee God of 2Hs... Please imbue my foot with the power of the hurricane! Let my foot be propelled forward with such momentum that the air around my foot become a force for Good and 2hness so that I might one shot this foul enemy who has bested me in skill!
*2handhero Oooo||============> Superior 1h Player*
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Rebelyell on October 04, 2013, 07:10:03 pm
The majority of my fights against strength, two hand, armor crutch, kick abusers seem to follow this general format:

Get roughly 5 hits on him. Starts panicking and begins to s key. Start closing in for the kill, throws out a kick that I dodge 90 ninety degrees to his side. Get staggered anyways and killed in one hit to the face. I get two letters sent to me: "gf".
It is that hard to fight with full str armored superslowe enemy? it is so hard to avoid that kick?
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: San on October 04, 2013, 07:21:05 pm
From what I understand from his post, he means that you can't close in and punish a missed kick because of the area of effect + extra long lasting hitbox covers most angles. It's not really about how hard it is. It's like if you have a lost packet and the block on your screen doesn't match what the server sees and you get hit. There's a loss of control with inaccurate feedback (where is safe to move when a guy kicks and misses).

Instead of avoiding, the best option is to just hang back and gauge how far the kick is, even though what you see isn't the exact position.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: BlueKnight on October 04, 2013, 07:48:10 pm
2handhero: Oh shit... I'm going to lose to a lame 1her... I beseech thee God of 2Hs... Please imbue my foot with the power of the hurricane! Let my foot be propelled forward with such momentum that the air around my foot become a force for Good and 2hness so that I might one shot this foul enemy who has bested me in skill!
*2handhero Oooo||============> Superior 1h Player*

*yawn*

While other players seem to at least try to create a sensible posts, you just seem to be crying constantly.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Rebelyell on October 04, 2013, 07:56:17 pm
From what I understand from his post, he means that you can't close in and punish a missed kick because of the area of effect + extra long lasting hitbox covers most angles. It's not really about how hard it is. It's like if you have a lost packet and the block on your screen doesn't match what the server sees and you get hit. There's a loss of control with inaccurate feedback (where is safe to move when a guy kicks and misses).

Instead of avoiding, the best option is to just hang back and gauge how far the kick is, even though what you see isn't the exact position.
When you can find reasonable answer/explanation, others just cry or whine,
after all  agree kick now is retarded.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Matey on October 04, 2013, 08:09:47 pm
*yawn*

While other players seem to at least try to create a sensible posts, you just seem to be crying constantly.

i was just re-enacting the scene phantasmal described. happens all the time though. many players will start throwing kicks if they are struggling with you because with the goofy reach, radius and active timer on it... its not hard to get lucky and land it. thus they can reverse a losing fight and turn it into an easy win... not through skill but through hitting the kick button out of desperation... its just not a good mechanic.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: San on October 04, 2013, 08:20:14 pm
I think that kick's original purpose was to impede facehuggers, get yourself out of enclosed areas with enemies, and get past an opponent's defense.

I believe that nudge does all of these much better in a more balanced way.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: BlueKnight on October 04, 2013, 08:30:03 pm
Chambering before the guy kicks will get him hit. If the guy is so careless and just tries spamming kicks, you should predict that and maybe try to chamber?

PS. I also think that kicking is broken. You can kick too early after your attack got blocked. You should go off balance and be unable to perform a kick so early after being blocked, not to mention the length and shiet... You may say whatever you want at the lack of blocking while kicking but I guess horizontal blocking could be kept just so it would force people to use planned overheads on the kicking players. Also the habit of kicking sometimes helps you a lot and sometimes you regret you have this habit and it gets you killed all the time, just like chambering habit, especially vs very good players that don't fall for easy tricks.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Kalam on October 04, 2013, 08:31:53 pm
My problem with kicks are the same issues we all have with ranged: it's only bad when you're forced to chase them. This is why the most common kick fanatics use longer weapons. Currently, the easiest way for me to counter kicks is to stand still when I sense a kick coming, and always work the angles. Still, it's not always enough when I'm using a one-hander or other short weapon. I imagine people like Phantasmal have no defense against punters besides backing up or surprise attacks.

At first, I experimented with chamber kicking reliably. I got to the point where I could do it about as well as I could normally chamber, but the problem is that it starts to dominate the fight. The only tell the kick has is the left foot twitch, and keeping your eye on that takes your attention from all the other tricks in any fighter's sleeve. The moment your opponent realizes what you're doing, he's going to focus on taking you down sans savate.

A return to the old kick, or some way to limit the area of effect/hang factor of the kick would prevent this muay thai menace, though this might turn one-handers into flavor of the month post Van Damme nerf.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 04, 2013, 08:49:21 pm
I think that kick's original purpose was to impede facehuggers, get yourself out of enclosed areas with enemies, and get past an opponent's defense.

I believe that nudge does all of these much better in a more balanced way.
nudge doesnt usually do jack in latter case because they block again nearly as soon as you finish the nudge.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: San on October 04, 2013, 08:50:43 pm
Not with a teammate. It can leave people disoriented, too. At least it did for me a few times.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Nightmare798 on October 04, 2013, 09:02:10 pm
Not with a teammate. It can leave people disoriented, too. At least it did for me a few times.

yeah, but you know you cant really rely on anyone else than yourself and your clan mates in this game, or mates at least.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Butan on October 04, 2013, 09:16:27 pm
There is a lot of exaggeration on the actual zone of effect of kicks.


Its very easy to miss, and everytime you do you give a free hit to your opponent.
When you dont, you have a free hit for yourself.
Seems fair.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Phantasmal on October 04, 2013, 09:34:52 pm
It is that hard to fight with full str armored superslowe enemy? it is so hard to avoid that kick?

You are almost forced into kick range with 70 length weapons.

I would like there to be more prediction involved in kicks (smart placement) rather then the current rotation/cone based method. It only seeks to reinforce the str and armor archetype that exists in cRPG because you take much less risk to throw a kick then any agility based build. I guess I can't blame them for spamming kicks (I would in their situation) but it is becoming ridiculously easy to do. The option of chamber kicking is much more risky in my opinion as well. If I read the situation incorrectly and kick, I will most likely be one shot or black barred.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Legs on October 04, 2013, 11:17:17 pm
To elaborate on the point that I was trying to make earlier in the thread:

The average skill level in cRPG rose to the point where kicking became fairly common.
As a result, people started complaining because they were getting kicked when they hadn't been previously.
So, kicks were nerfed and people stopped using them for a while.
Eventually the community adapted to the nerf and started using kicks again.
Naturally, the complaints also started coming in alongside.
Even if the AoE effect is removed, the community will adapt and continue kicking you in the nuts at every opportunity.

It seems like most of the anti-kicking crowd are 1-handers who just want kicks to be removed, or to be nerfed so hard that they're totally unusable.

I can understand being frustrated if you carefully time a dodge and avoid your opponent's kick only to move in and get hit by an afterimage, but that's really just anecdotal and doesn't necessarily speak to the core issue. For example - maybe the problem is with strength builds being too tanky. Someone with 70 armor and 10 iron flesh could just spam and try to get lucky chamber-blocks because he knows that even if they miss he can always just block with his face instead. So do you call that a problem with chamber blocking, or with armor, or with iron flesh/str hp passive?

So, I guess my point is that this isn't as simple as saying "KICKS OP NERF PLS."
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Matey on October 05, 2013, 05:37:04 am
To elaborate on the point that I was trying to make earlier in the thread:

The average skill level in cRPG rose to the point where kicking became fairly common.
As a result, people started complaining because they were getting kicked when they hadn't been previously.
So, kicks were nerfed and people stopped using them for a while.
Eventually the community adapted to the nerf and started using kicks again.
Naturally, the complaints also started coming in alongside.
Even if the AoE effect is removed, the community will adapt and continue kicking you in the nuts at every opportunity.

It seems like most of the anti-kicking crowd are 1-handers who just want kicks to be removed, or to be nerfed so hard that they're totally unusable.

I can understand being frustrated if you carefully time a dodge and avoid your opponent's kick only to move in and get hit by an afterimage, but that's really just anecdotal and doesn't necessarily speak to the core issue. For example - maybe the problem is with strength builds being too tanky. Someone with 70 armor and 10 iron flesh could just spam and try to get lucky chamber-blocks because he knows that even if they miss he can always just block with his face instead. So do you call that a problem with chamber blocking, or with armor, or with iron flesh/str hp passive?

So, I guess my point is that this isn't as simple as saying "KICKS OP NERF PLS."

but kicks are only OP cause they are broken. if they only hit where the foot was when it was extending... then it would be fine.. that would mean if you get kicked its your own fault. right now you can get kicked at no fault of your own and it is much too easy for 2hs to do.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: San on October 05, 2013, 06:08:11 am

The average skill level in cRPG rose to the point where kicking became fairly common.


This is where opinions differ, right from the beginning. I don't think average skill has reached Marcus/Rhaelys levels of pre-change kicking.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Scervo on October 06, 2013, 01:32:02 am
Well, as someone who is somewhat new to the game, kicks are too hard for me to land so I basically never use them.. Other people make it look OP. So I would probably agree with legs and say its not really OP in itself, people have just gotten really good at using them.

If you miss you're basically a sitting duck; you're risking a free hit on yourself for a free hit on the opponent, seems fair to me.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Jarold on October 06, 2013, 03:51:33 am
I'm ok with the kicks in game, and I barely use them! I've learned which players use kicks a lot and it's easy to avoid them. The real way to avoid all kicks is to not move in such a predictable line, which all of us do and it's hard to think about.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: MURDERTRON on October 06, 2013, 04:49:33 am
I'm ok with the kicks in game, and I barely use them! I've learned which players use kicks a lot and it's easy to avoid them. The real way to avoid all kicks is to not move in such a predictable line, which all of us do and it's hard to think about.

Yea, its pretty obvious.  If you're showing a left swing, you're probably going to move right.  If you're showing a right swing, you're probably going to move left.  Basically, kicks take advantage of the fact that most players try to increase their speed bonus.  But that's predictable.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Kafein on October 06, 2013, 12:06:17 pm
All kicks take advantage of the fact that players using short weapons are forced to move in very predictable fashion unless they don't want to hit. Stellar footwork isn't going to change that. Hell, a quick tap on the jump key helps a lot more.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: Simon_Templar on October 07, 2013, 01:13:37 am
For me it sounds like it goes into the right direction. You would have less prima ballerina kickers.
Title: Re: Whats up with the kicks? Going to be fixed ever?
Post by: CrazyCracka420 on October 07, 2013, 04:32:59 pm
There is a lot of exaggeration on the actual zone of effect of kicks.


Its very easy to miss, and everytime you do you give a free hit to your opponent.
When you dont, you have a free hit for yourself.
Seems fair.

That's not true if you're chasing someone.  I will strafe left and right as I try to close in on the guy.  In the past they would kick, and I could still come at them from a 45 degree angle and punish them for missing the kick.  Now I don't even bother trying because the area of effect is likely to snag you after the foot animation has even stopped moving (when it used to no longer be active).  If you're approaching someone from any part of their front when they have kicked, you're likely going to be kicked (even if you're basically off to their side). 

I've still yet to see anyone properly explain their justification for thinking that an area of effect is acceptable for a kick animation.  Legs argument is that I'd get kicked anyways.  That's some great argumentative skills you got there.

Legs
Quote
It seems like most of the anti-kicking crowd are 1-handers who just want kicks to be removed, or to be nerfed so hard that they're totally unusable

Umm..where did I say I want kicks removed, or totally unuseable?  I just don't want to be punished for trying to take advantage of someone missing a kick, and I walk into some magic whirlwind bullshit and get knocked back.  Are you that dense that you can't read what people's actual problems with the current kick are?  Instead of trying to tell us what our problems with the kick are, maybe you should like, I dunno, read what we're saying?   :rolleyes: