cRPG
cRPG => General Discussion => Topic started by: Vicious666 on January 06, 2011, 09:53:28 pm
-
Since talk is useless, whine is useless, cry is useless.
since i was a scripter for ultima online for 5 year, and balanced a lot of pvp for many servers.
here are EVIDENCE, MATHEMATICS, not questionable, not passible by interpretation or opinions.
TEST ON 15 ROUNDS:
when i have time i will post a test based on 100 rounds, since win or lose, or get on the winning side is lucky, and more high are the numbers more precise is the statistic.
but even considering a high round average lest say 3x, so 150g for average round of 4 min, is 600g x 15 = 9k gold, (and we are talking about 15x round at 3x so 150gx ) where even the upkeep for a 9k worth of equip is 6k, so only 3k gain, that means if you go at 15k worth of equip, even at sooooooo generous winning strike of 15x rounds at 3x, you lose money.
EQUIPMENT : total cost 9145
scimitar (simple one) cost : 3380
sarranid padded vest cost : 975
leather gloves cost : 202
rabati (a helm ) cost : 1219
norman shield cost : 3226
khergit leather boots cost : 143
ROUNDS X 15 MONEY GAINED :
ROUND 1 : 50G X 5 MIN = 250 G
ROUND 2 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 3 : 100G X 5MIN = 500 G
ROUND 4 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 5 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 6 : 50G X 6 MIN = 300 G
ROUND 7 : 100 G X 5 MIN = 500 G
ROUND 8 : 150G X 4 MIN = 600 G
ROUND 9 : 50 G X 6 MIN = 300 G
ROUND 10 : 100G X 4 MIN = 400 G
ROUND 11 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 12 : 50G X 5 MIN = 250 G
ROUND 13 : 100G X 4 MIN = 400 G
ROUND 14 150G X 3 MIN = 450G
ROUND 15 200G X 5 MIN = 1000 G
TOTAL G EARNED IN 15 ROUNDS : 5750 G
TOTAL G LOOSED IN 15 ROUNDS 5933
SCIMITAR repair cost 676 X4
NORMAN SHIELD repair cost 645 X3
SARRANID PADDED VEST repair cost 195 X3
LEATHER BOOTS repair cost 28 X2
LEATHER GLOVES repair cost 57 X4
RABATI (HELM ) repair cost 24 x 2
this is proofed and tested
cant even upkeep a 9k equip lol
with average lucky on team winning.
another things to balance that is not an opinion but is mathematic.
upkeep between 1h and 2h are not even.
2 hander top sword (rarely used, cost 15450, but most used are cookies and tear 11,6 and 12k, i now name are changed ... )
1 hander top sword (most used cost 8/9k , long espada eslavona. side sword ) point is 1h not cost 50% of 2h, but almost 85% of the cost of a 2h, if you add to this the shield, most common = huscarl is another 6k, upping the cost for the average 1h+shield to 15k+.
if you wanna use top vs top equip,
is 15450 flamberge vs 8922 (side sword) + 10422 (steel shield) 19344 THAT SEAMS EVEN, (that is not for sure since 90% of 2hnaders use 11k-12k sword so difference is 7K+, if you consider that more items means more % to pay upkeep. is again uneven )
the new formula, add more % to have a broken item even at winning side, that make shielders upkeep more than 2handers. withouth consider that changing from 3 to 4% is a 33% increase, upkeep from 20 to 5 is a -75% but with upkeep every round is a +100% so upkeep now is the same of previous at 66%
-
They won't understand it cuz they're kings. It's only made by complexes against tincans.
ITS NOT HARD TO SEE. CHECK REPAIR POLL AND %50+ SAYS "REPAIR SUX"
-
In one or two weeks, one (perhaps myself) will make a second Repair poll. LETS SEE WHAT THEY WILL VOTE THEN!
-
What is this supposed to be?
Tell me, what is the average gold you can upkeep with 0.201, assuming you have a multiplicator of 1 all the time? No examples, mathematics. I know the value, do you?
(keep it short)
-
I can upkeep 25k no problem and still make lots of money.
Increase upkeep!
edit: oh.. 30+ eq and no problem making upkeep.
-
Actually me being an electrical engineer with a masters focus on statistics for manufacturing I.E LEAN SIX SIGMA, probability your equation on 2h vs 1h leaves out very simple fact. It is highly improbable that the shield and sword both break each time simultaneously. On the other hand the 2h sword or for that matter any twice as expensive item will tend to cost u more upkeep because there is no such thing as a half repair or half break
I also contend that mathematics is a very debatable science what form of statistical test are you using I.e one sided z etc
Also to what degree of accuracy do you expect to attain with such a small sample size
Unfortunately to really judge this we need a large sample size and also we will need you to establish controls
Example we need to determine if in those rounds u lost were u trying to actually win or were u so full of rageQQ that u contributed to ur team losing, only after we establish this and more can we truly understand ..statistically what the repair and upkeep really does and get closer to finding out the average upkeepable equipment
-
Upkeep is fine atm imo.
-
What is this supposed to be?
Tell me, what is the average gold you can upkeep with 0.201, assuming you have a multiplicator of 1 all the time? No examples, mathematics. I know the value, do you?
(keep it short)
sorry chadz what you not get in this? that a 9k user is losing money instead making anything? is only based on the lucky of the teams even .
potentially you cant upkeep even a 5k equipment if you get all bad rounds.
and what you means with average gold you can upkeep ? if i have 200k and wear 9k of stuff, i am losing slowly gold, what matters how much i have in bank ?
over 50% of player of your mod say that this system sux, what you wanna elsE? the mathematic proof that is not sustainable, also IS BORING, tedious mechanic, i never remember something like this in all crpg story, where majority of ppl clearly not wanna one thing .
-
Are you people still seriously whining about this ? You can easily upkeep light gear even if you lose most of the time now.
If you go on a win streak you can upkeep plate and still make money.
What do you want ? 10k gold for free at the begining of each round ?
-
I must've been insanely lucky for earning 60000.
With equipment worth 14 000 about.
-
Actually me being an electrical engineer with a masters focus on statistics for manufacturing I.E LEAN SIX SIGMA, probability your equation on 2h vs 1h leaves out very simple fact. It is highly improbable that the shield and sword both break each time simultaneously. On the other hand the 2h sword or for that matter any twice as expensive item will tend to cost u more upkeep because there is no such thing as a half repair or half break
I also contend that mathematics is a very debatable science what form of statistical test are you using I.e one sided z etc
Also to what degree of accuracy do you expect to attain with such a small sample size
Unfortunately to really judge this we need a large sample size and also we will need you to establish controls
Example we need to determine if in those rounds u lost were u trying to actually win or were u so full of rageQQ that u contributed to ur team losing, only after we establish this and more can we truly understand ..statistically what the repair and upkeep really does and get closer to finding out the average upkeepable equipment
becouse even considering all rounds at 3x (HIGHLY IMPROBABLE ) you cant upkeep anything over 15k-20k total worth of equipment
-
Vicious, you obviously missed the update to 0.201.
Get it, do the math, that fix was done just because of the reason many people disliked the 0.200 version.
(if you don't want to do the math, play for some hours, then report the result)
-
Since chadz has the possibility to log every damaged item as well as the amount of gold a player earns and since I'm sure that he does log these values, I'm also very confident that he knows very well how long an average 9000G char can maintain his equipment.
Also, this mod is beta! We're all testers, don't forget that. chadz can test as many values and numbers with us as he wants.
-
You're doing it wrong.
-
I must've been insanely lucky for earning 60000.
With equipment worth 14 000 about.
thats the point, is all what crpg reduced ? get lucky on random team balance?
no skill
no lev difference
no equip
as i say i gonna repost this with 100 or 200 rounds. for define what is max you can upkeep and still gaining gold. at average. but already evaluating all rounds at 3x, you cant upkeep more than a 20k worth of equip. and hardly you will get a 15x win strik of rounds all at 3x
-
I am easily upkeeping equipment with a value of 22k gold, even making more slowly. Buff upkeep!
-
Vicious, you obviously missed the update to 0.201.
Get it, do the math, that fix was done just because of the reason many people disliked the 0.200 version.
(if you don't want to do the math, play for some hours, then report the result)
chadz i am playng only for the statistics with my 9k worth of equip and still now at round 26, losing gold instead making.
but more important is frustrating losing gold even when you win and do 10:1
-
I am easily upkeeping equipment with a value of 22k gold, even making more slowly. Buff upkeep!
that the limit possible. fact is you are a good player you do first rounds good.
means dunno 7 kill 10 ? 1 death ?
when balance it will transfer all good player on other team
(autobalance is rotten as hell tbh )
that means majority of good player than will be stuck at one side, thats why you upkeep 22k worth of stuff, cause bad autobalance.
but for other 70% of player. is not possible.
thats why i not make kills i only spawn whit equip AND DIE. if i kill i end on winning side all time. and statistic is fucked, you cant base upkeep statistic together with autobalance, becouse autobalance fuck all. i am doing worst scenario where all is random i die 0:1 i sometimes get win team sometime lose team.
that not applicable for good player who do many kills and 75% get on winning team due to autobalance
since this method exited i see majority of games, go 5:0 4:1 etc
-
thats the point, is all what crpg reduced ? get lucky on random team balance?
no skill
no lev difference
no equip
as i say i gonna repost this with 100 or 200 rounds. for define what is max you can upkeep and still gaining gold. at average. but already evaluating all rounds at 3x, you cant upkeep more than a 20k worth of equip. and hardly you will get a 15x win strik of rounds all at 3x
This is the worst formatted post I have ever seen posted on a forum. If you are trying to breakdown complicated mathematical systems you need to make it at least readable.
-
I am doing that on my as of yet not exactly high level archer. I am not doing well, in fact i am losing most rounds. Yet i make gold. I even made gold, when there was still 20% upkeep.
-
I have a feeling there are several words missing in Vicious' every post. I tried filling the gaps, but failed.
-
Can we see the math behind these upkeep settings ? A guy did the math earlier and it turned out it was wrong, i'd like to see it and check if there's the same mistake.
-
I have a feeling there are several words missing in Vicious' every post. I tried filling the gaps, but failed.
in have feeling that instead concentrate on a fucking rotten autobalance+upkeep system you prefer troll my english.
archers means nothing for upkeep you wear shit and majority of your gold is on the bow, who is only 1 item. so less chance to pay upkeep than sword+shield
your upkeep in arrow is also low.
consider a poor shield+weapon user with 2x THROWING you now he pay upkeep for 4x items? and throwing cost a fuckload of gold?
cmon dont make me fight the wind mill, even a monkey can do calc for see that unless you get some kill on first round and get autobalance stuck with many others good, you cant upkeep more than 15k of stuff , if you a bad player? and have 0,5 kd? not more than 10k
-
Since talk is useless, whine is useless, cry is useless.
since i was a scripter for ultima online for 5 year, and balanced a lot of pvp for many servers.
here are EVIDENCE, MATHEMATICS, not questionable, not passible by interpretation or opinions.
TEST ON 15 ROUNDS:
when i have time i will post a test based on 100 rounds, since win or lose, or get on the winning side is lucky, and more high are the numbers more precise is the statistic.
but even considering a high round average lest say 3x, so 150g for average round of 4 min, is 600g x 15 = 9k gold, (and we are talking about 15x round at 3x so 150gx ) where even the upkeep for a 9k worth of equip is 6k, so only 3k gain, that means if you go at 15k worth of equip, even at sooooooo generous winning strike of 15x rounds at 3x, you lose money.
EQUIPMENT : total cost 9145
scimitar (simple one) cost : 3380
sarranid padded vest cost : 975
leather gloves cost : 202
rabati (a helm ) cost : 1219
norman shield cost : 3226
khergit leather boots cost : 143
ROUNDS X 15 MONEY GAINED :
ROUND 1 : 50G X 5 MIN = 250 G
ROUND 2 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 3 : 100G X 5MIN = 500 G
ROUND 4 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 5 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 6 : 50G X 6 MIN = 300 G
ROUND 7 : 100 G X 5 MIN = 500 G
ROUND 8 : 150G X 4 MIN = 600 G
ROUND 9 : 50 G X 6 MIN = 300 G
ROUND 10 : 100G X 4 MIN = 400 G
ROUND 11 : 50G X 4 MIN = 200 G
ROUND 12 : 50G X 5 MIN = 250 G
ROUND 13 : 100G X 4 MIN = 400 G
ROUND 14 150G X 3 MIN = 450G
ROUND 15 200G X 5 MIN = 1000 G
TOTAL G EARNED IN 15 ROUNDS : 5750 G
TOTAL G LOOSED IN 15 ROUNDS 5933
SCIMITAR repair cost 676 X4
NORMAN SHIELD repair cost 645 X3
SARRANID PADDED VEST repair cost 195 X3
LEATHER BOOTS repair cost 28 X2
LEATHER GLOVES repair cost 57 X4
RABATI (HELM ) repair cost 24 x 2
this is proofed and tested
cant even upkeep a 9k equip lol
with average lucky on team winning.
another things to balance that is not an opinion but is mathematic.
upkeep between 1h and 2h are not even.
2 hander top sword (rarely used, cost 15450, but most used are cookies and tear 11,6 and 12k, i now name are changed ... )
1 hander top sword (most used cost 8/9k , long espada eslavona. side sword ) point is 1h not cost 50% of 2h, but almost 85% of the cost of a 2h, if you add to this the shield, most common = huscarl is another 6k, upping the cost for the average 1h+shield to 15k+.
if you wanna use top vs top equip,
is 15450 flamberge vs 8922 (side sword) + 10422 (steel shield) 19344 THAT SEAMS EVEN, (that is not for sure since 90% of 2hnaders use 11k-12k sword so difference is 7K+, if you consider that more items means more % to pay upkeep. is again uneven )
the new formula, add more % to have a broken item even at winning side, that make shielders upkeep more than 2handers. withouth consider that changing from 3 to 4% is a 33% increase, upkeep from 20 to 5 is a -75% but with upkeep every round is a +100% so upkeep now is the same of previous at 66%
Im not gonna bother pointing out all the fail in ur post, ill just state the obvious instead;
Your a fucking idiot.
-
in have feeling that instead concentrate on a fucking rotten autobalance+upkeep system you prefer troll my english.
your english is not the main problem, its the strange paragraphs and gaps u make are most confusing.
-
So wait your doing a worst case test, but see the problem is players that purposely lose help their team lose and therefore you skew the result towards the answer u wanted
I.E that you can't upkeep alot if u lose all the time
But you're missing the point
Play to win for a week and analyze those results
-
Vicious, you obviously missed the update to 0.201.
Get it, do the math, that fix was done just because of the reason many people disliked the 0.200 version.
(if you don't want to do the math, play for some hours, then report the result)
i am doing this on 2.01.
and from 3 to 4% is a 33% increase
upkeep 5% from 20% is a -75%
but with +100% since happens all rounds
so overall upkeep is 66% of old one. with difference that now happens much more often, previously on winning you where payng nothiung even for 5 rounds, now you pay even if winning 66% of old one, so upkeep is increased not decreased. sure when you pay you pay less, but yoy pay much more often. previously you payed only for losing now always.
so if yesterday you made dunno 10 rounds, and win 7 and lose 3. you got check for payment only in 3 rounds, lets say 10k x round = 30k
now, sure you pay 6,6k but you do that in all 10 rounds win or losing. so 66k and the % to pay is even more. (the % not augmented only by 33% it augmented of 33% x number of rounds )
so overall upkeep is higher.
was decreased for real if system remained the same, you lose? you pay
-
So wait your doing a worst case test, but see the problem is players that purposely lose help their team lose and therefore you skew the result towards the answer u wanted
I.E that you can't upkeep alot if u lose all the time
But you're missing the point
Play to win for a week and analyze those results
you not get win or lose not matters anything with this system, since you get upkeep check anyway. is merely a question of not killing much first round
worst case = you die first round and autobalance keep you on loosing time while all good player who made a nice killing streak, are team stucked on the other.
worst case in this sence becouse even if you on 2nd round do 10:1 you keep remain on losing side :)
point here is that wrong autobalance+ upkeep = total fail on upkeep for someone who not kill much
imho we need a balance every round, yes you heard me, every round so we have better division of good players. or minimum once every 2 round or at round 1 3 and 5
-
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
-
i am doing this on 2.01.
and from 3 to 4% is a 33% increase
upkeep 5% from 20% is a -75%
but with +100% since happens all rounds
so overall upkeep is 66% of old one. with difference that now happens much more often, previously on winning you where payng nothiung even for 5 rounds, now you pay even if winning 66% of old one, so upkeep is increased not decreased. sure when you pay you pay less, but yoy pay much more often. previously you payed only for losing now always.
so if yesterday you made dunno 10 rounds, and win 7 and lose 3. you got check for payment only in 3 rounds, lets say 10k x round = 30k
now, sure you pay 6,6k but you do that in all 10 rounds win or losing. so 66k and the % to pay is even more. (the % not augmented only by 33% it augmented of 33% x number of rounds )
so overall upkeep is higher.
was decreased for real if system remained the same, you lose? you pay
Maths ? really ? :rolleyes:
-
I have 21k worth of gear and I'm still able to make profit. No idea what I'm doing right and everyone is doing wrong.
nothing
thats the point
is merely lucky.
on a calculation based on a week (7 day) of play, at worst possible condition 50x g x round always, you should keep 25k of equip. but no chance to buy anything. and may you have day where you naked and cant repair and day when you barely handle it.
the fact is, is random, is not fun, not based on skill at all, only on autobalance + upkeep randomness
-
21k is affordable, with a 1x multiplier you can afford 25k worth of gear, now calculating the average multiplier is a little more tricky, i'll go by intuition and say it's 1.5 (don't ask me why, if you want to know the correct value go ahead and calculate it), so by playing normally you should be able to afford 37k worth of gear on average. You cannot possibly afford better unless you kill the half the opposing team all by yourself every round, which only a handful of players are able to do and only when autobalance fails. edit: obviously this is with 0 gold added to your account in the long run, if you want to buy better items you have to fight naked.
-
I'm going upward with my light-medium gear (~20k),
and sometimes I can ride my destrier in full plate few rounds in a row. (~85k)
absolutely okay, have to play a bit smarter
EDIT: in my 20k gear I have a tier1 sword, what else need to defend myself ?
-
EDIT: in my 20k gear I have a tier1 sword, what else need to defend myself ?
Skill.
-
Skill.
only skill you have mister ishar is troll skill you have 17 point can you wonder why?
-
Skill.
Skill is only for children and women and child-women !
-
What is this supposed to be?
Tell me, what is the average gold you can upkeep with 0.201, assuming you have a multiplicator of 1 all the time? No examples, mathematics. I know the value, do you?
(keep it short)
assuming x1 all time, 250g round so 5 mins max is 25k or 37 k (as say ganon)
point is this prospective is an average so you can have days where you cant afford to repair, and days where you have extra money or barely gaining it/manteining your equip.
we are playng on the edge of a razor btw.
-
Your calculations considers the law of large numbers ?
-
It's somewhat funny to see famous cav players running in some fur armor on palfeys :lol: I so get used to their old look, now you can see their "real" faces.
I like upkeep system but need to agree with Vicious on a matter that too much "luck" is involved into items degradation.
Played about 12 rounds in cheap gear as hobo cav and paid like 5 times, for my black hood - 9 gold :mrgreen: Accumulated some money and decided to use my "normal" gear, next round I'm getting teamswitched, our team is getting owned and I'm paying for repear of destrier and brigandin.... Sooo, how can I raise my luck? Go to church? Become buddist?
I'm not whining, it's fun in its own way, just would be nicer if system would be more predictable in terms of risk & gain. Higher the risk - more you can gain or loose.
-
Your calculations considers the law of large numbers ?
His english might be bad but i read his post as considering that law, some days you lose gold, others you gain, if you have 25-37k worth of equip you should be even given a large enough number of games.
-
You calculated in the law of large numbers ?
that based on 1k rounds
but is statistics, you can do more or less, if you repeat same test in 1k results.
is like throwing dice. 1000 times. sometimes you can do higher sometimes lower. fact is that if go low, you have days where you not make money only lose it, so cant repair armor, and day where you gain. or barely keep it, but due to the random nature of this things. is not playable -.- so maximum sustain based on looooong play is 25k. THEORICAL 37k
-
that based on 1k rounds
but is statistics, you can do more or less, if you repeat same test in 1k results.
is like throwing dice. 1000 times. sometimes you can do higher sometimes lower. fact is that if go low, you have days where you not make money only lose it, so cant repair armor, and day where you gain. or barely keep it, but due to the random nature of this things. is not playable -.- so maximum sustain based on looooong play is 25k. THEORICAL 37k
considering the law of large numbers, you say that gold ammount is going down over time ? Or going up ? I understand you as up.
EDIT: there is no real place to theoriciticiticitiing. if you have calculated 37k, then it must be 37k, or ask chadz what is the recommended gear value.
-
up and down. to that number
so should remain around such numbers problem is
you can have day where you have 15k, and day where you have 30
so if you use a 20-25k equip you can have day where you are not able to upkeep it until you got a lucky strike of wins
to say it more easy you cant base your gameplay on such variable up and down on an equip worth 25k
-
up and down. to that number
so should remain around such numbers problem is
you can have day where you have 15k, and day where you have 30
so if you use a 20-25k equip you can have day where you are not able to upkeep it until you got a lucky strike of wins
to say it more easy you cant base your gameplay on such variable up and down on an equip worth 25k
when you get that 'lucky strike of wins', then you have the money for the incoming bad luck, thats the point.
I will watch for what you speaking about, and I will report here if I find anomalies, of course.
EDIT: btw, considering that 4% decay probability per item, I have no fear.
-
I have circa 25k of equipment and I'm slowly gaining money.
-
what do you think, if the cRPG server would roll a dice 1000 times for you in random moments, how many heads would be there ? I bet 500. I "feel" that the upkeep system is not at 50-50 earn-loose, you are earning.
(I presume that random is random in cRPG, and why would not be [as random as it can in a computer])
-
Now that everyone is talking about their gear...
I have 26k worth of gear and I SLOWLY gain gold...
-
About you not being able to change the outcome of battles - The income does NOT depend on server size, *hint* *hint*
-
what do you think, if the cRPG server would roll a dice 1000 times for you in random moments, how many heads would be there ? I bet 500. I "feel" that the upkeep system is not at 50-50 earn-loose, you are earning.
(I presume that random is random in cRPG, and why would not be [as random as it can in a computer])
that why i posted the 9k equipment
if you are unlucky you can even play with that if you play only 1-2 hours day
is a stupid system not based on any ability of the player/team,
IS FUCKING RANDOM
-
in have feeling that instead concentrate on a fucking rotten autobalance+upkeep system you prefer troll my english.
I have no problem with people using a 2nd language not as well as their first. Your English is fine.
The way you put spaces and shit all throughout your posts make no sense in any fucking language unless your first language is Egyptian hieroglyphics or something.
-
About you not being able to change the outcome of battles - The income does NOT depend on server size, *hint* *hint*
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
I love you man. I always loved sieges of 5-15 people, exactly because I felt what I'm doing is making a huge difference. Now, you fixed both siege AND buffed small games. I'm speechless.
-
About you not being able to change the outcome of battles - The income does NOT depend on server size, *hint* *hint*
about you not being able to make an autobalance that work. *hint* *hint* maybe you should rewrite it
i am always on the winning side and have np make a 5:1 k/d ratio even dressed with a 20k equip, you are missing the point IS NOT FUN ANYMORE and random based. personal skill make no difference, you need only to do good first round than automaticly all good player are stucked on 1 side. * hint* *hint* i can just kill first round than go afk for other 4, for how much is uneven after balance
-
i havent seen eny small battles so far...
EDIT: nvm
-
it was fun until now because you had much better equipment than the average player ? or what ?
-
My EQ:
Sarranid Guard Armor 8529
Helmet with Neckguard 1480
Leather Boots 363
War Axe 1940
Pike 1589
TOTAL: 13 901
I am gaining gold very fast so I figure I'll buy some board shield for my back; By .200 I was using a Nomand Armor - the gold gain was stable and good too and frankly i preferred it that way. It is a sad thing to see claymores and horses being so common again.
-
I have no problem with people using a 2nd language not as well as their first. Your English is fine.
The way you put spaces and shit all throughout your posts make no sense in any fucking language unless your first language is Egyptian hieroglyphics or something.
have you ever thinked that i did that on purpose for ppl like you?
-
it was fun until now because you had much better equipment than the average player ? or what ?
no becouse have sense exp the char, not the equip, if i wanna play all at same level i play native, why i should play crpg? , i played and shitload of player here majority since poll vote for 60% +, that we played becouse here, invest time was worth, was the sense of the mod, mount e blade but "persistent" what you do with time reflect in part your char, skill remained essential, becouse i recon player like you in full plate that i owned 95% of time 1 vs 1. so why? becouse i am more skilled.
but now there is no more sense on grow a char, we are all same., 200k of equip is useless, why i should play dressed in a chain? for play random in a system where my ability is not receiving any bonus, whatever i do not change anything
1x
or 5x HAVE NO SENSE when there is a level limit, dont you get this ? CAN BE 50X, at best 2 months from now i will be 35 and you will be 32, and 3 point will make no difference.
i hate depends on random stuff, if i win and kill with a 10:/1 k/d ratio I DESERVE TO use a fucking plate, otherwise this mod is not ability based, it not incentive good player, punish them
-
have you ever thinked that i did that on purpose for ppl like you?
So you post in a confusing manner on purpose to annoy people. While posting trying to get people to agree with you.
Yes, you are clearly the pupper master and we are all dancing to your tune. That, or you are just a fucking idiot?
-
no becouse have sense exp the char, not the equip, if i wanna play all at same level i play native, why i should play crpg? , i played and shitload of player here majority since poll vote for 60% +, that we played becouse here, invest time was worth, was the sense of the mod, mount e blade but "persistent" what you do with time reflect in part your char, skill remained essential, becouse i recon player like you in full plate that i owned 95% of time 1 vs 1. so why? becouse i am more skilled.
but now there is no more sense on grow a char, we are all same., 200k of equip is useless, why i should play dressed in a chain? for play random in a system where my ability is not receiving any bonus, whatever i do not change anything
1x
or 5x HAVE NO SENSE when there is a level limit, dont you get this ? CAN BE 50X, at best 2 months from now i will be 35 and you will be 32, and 3 point will make no difference.
i hate depends on random stuff, if i win and kill with a 10:/1 k/d ratio I DESERVE TO use a fucking plate, otherwise this mod is not ability based, it not incentive good player, punish them
You are fucking hilarious and utterly retarded :rolleyes:
-
I have to say, that with my equip (which is around 25k) I still make gold. I have 50/50 lose/wins.
-
About you not being able to change the outcome of battles - The income does NOT depend on server size, *hint* *hint*
basically if you are a good player the smaller the server the better, if you are bad or a peasant join a full server cause then at least you average out :D
-
Today while using 25k worth of equipment I MADE an extra 20k. I then used that money to buy some tin can stuff that I always wanted. The OP may just be the unluckiest person on the planet, but so far I think the new system is a bit too generous.
-
Today while using 25k worth of equipment I MADE an extra 20k. I then used that money to buy some tin can stuff that I always wanted. The OP may just be the unluckiest person on the planet, but so far I think the new system is a bit too generous.
I think it's fine. If you want to be a tin can then be one. The change to retirement prevents tin-cans from having 300 WPF in 2 handers, which was the big problem.
-
I think it's fine. If you want to be a tin can then be one. The change to retirement prevents tin-cans from having 300 WPF in 2 handers, which was the big problem.
Never had any interest in being one. I just bought it 'cause I had way too much money laying around after the patch. I prefer my Heraldic Mail with Tabard for the look and speed. All I'm saying is I think you can get WAY too much money now.
-
Here's what I got.
import random
##Calculate mean multiplier, assuming even chance of win/loss
total = 0
value = 1
for i in range(1000000):
if random.randint(0, 1) == True:
value = min([value + 1, 5])
else:
value = 1
total = total + value
mmulti = float(total)/1000000
##Calculate stable equipment value using:
##mean multiplier * base gold - chance break * repair cost * equipment = 0
equipment = (mmulti * 50) / (.04 * .05)
print mmulti, equipment
This returns:
mean multiplier ~= 1.94
stable equipment ~= 48500
In fact, actual values are probably higher than this, since if you win one round, then you have a better than 50 percent chance of winning the next.
-
About you not being able to change the outcome of battles - The income does NOT depend on server size, *hint* *hint*
Small servers are much better and might even help going positive in gold with 40-50k worth of equipment. Cannot agree more with that. Make more small servers please (or split up one into a few smaller servers).
-
...What?
-
...What?
I'll translate that post for you and comment my observation:
With a 50% win ratio you have an average round bonus of 1.94 which gives a sustainable maximum equipment of 48500gold. In a small server, you can influence the outcome alot more so you could go over 50% win ratio, which means round bonus will be over 1.94, let's say you get an average of 3 (which is very high but we're talking about really good players being concerned) you can get the sustainable equipment value up to 75.000 gold. But only on small servers, with 180 players you would need to have an absurd k/d ratio to really influence the outcome enough to get the gold needed to sustain high end equipment.
The reason i like small servers with 40-60 players is because tonight we had that number playing and it was alot more fun. I'm not at the tincan point yet but still knowing that i could heavily influence the outcome made me play better and i had more fun.
So as a suggestion i'd say, give us more small servers, and everything will be fine. I also find the suggestion to base the entry on character level interesting, but i would keep it more open than that, with only a lower limit on some servers (like a 20+ server and a 25+ server).
-
So just for the record, if I use equipment which is worth less than 50.000 I will probably be able to make money?
Heraldic Transitional 19419
Nordic Champions Sword 7842
Sugarloaf Helmet 7930
Knightly Heater Shield 4328
Gauntlets 8534
Mailboots 3119
which makes: 51172
I used this equipment for several rounds today (an hour or two), just to face the fact that I loose money. I started with 17 k, and with some ups and downs I ended at 15something k
Also I got some questions, are heirloomed items more expensive in upkeep?
Why do I have to pay upkeep for things I pick up on the battlefield?
If I would use a horse, I'd run out of money pretty fast. (I mean I could go naked and without a weapon with a charger or something -_-)
So is this equipment is so overpowered, that it has to be punished with a loss of money? And also I'd like to know how anyone should use a horse better than a destrier, without going almost naked? You could simply have deleted them horses if they we're so OP.
Still the patch is fun to play, but xbows are still annoying as hell (and in comparison pretty cheap). Archery is fine as it is (they really make a shitload of gold due to cheap equipment). Being an infantrymen is too expensive if you don't use very cheap items. Decent cavalry is not affordable.
Thanks for reading
Greets
-
So you post in a confusing manner on purpose to annoy people. While posting trying to get people to agree with you.
Yes, you are clearly the pupper master and we are all dancing to your tune. That, or you are just a fucking idiot?
Let me point you in the direction of page 2 where I already came to this conclusion =D
-
Vicious, FFS stop randomly putting retarded shitload of spaces in your posts !
And something you should have understood ages ago :
Skill is NOT how many points you have on your char page ! It's how YOU, as a player, perform in the game, not depending on your char or your equipment !
-
I agree with Kafein.
-
So just for the record, if I use equipment which is worth less than 50.000 I will probably be able to make money?
Heraldic Transitional 19419
Nordic Champions Sword 7842
Sugarloaf Helmet 7930
Knightly Heater Shield 4328
Gauntlets 8534
Mailboots 3119
which makes: 51172
I used this equipment for several rounds today (an hour or two), just to face the fact that I loose money. I started with 17 k, and with some ups and downs I ended at 15something k
Also I got some questions, are heirloomed items more expensive in upkeep?
Why do I have to pay upkeep for things I pick up on the battlefield?
If I would use a horse, I'd run out of money pretty fast. (I mean I could go naked and without a weapon with a charger or something -_-)
So is this equipment is so overpowered, that it has to be punished with a loss of money? And also I'd like to know how anyone should use a horse better than a destrier, without going almost naked? You could simply have deleted them horses if they we're so OP.
Still the patch is fun to play, but xbows are still annoying as hell (and in comparison pretty cheap). Archery is fine as it is (they really make a shitload of gold due to cheap equipment). Being an infantrymen is too expensive if you don't use very cheap items. Decent cavalry is not affordable.
Thanks for reading
Greets
No, if you use 50k of equipment and win 50% of the time, you will be even, or to be more precise, you will slowly lose gold since you can afford 48500 max, but that's on the very long run. Last i heard heirloomed weapons are valued very high and people aren't using them because of the additional upkeep costs. If you want to make money with 50k equipment you need to win more than 50% of your rounds.