cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Joker86 on April 23, 2012, 09:42:51 pm

Title: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 23, 2012, 09:42:51 pm
Hi there!

Short version:

- Remove upkeep
- Introduce "wealth", a value of equipment you are allowed to wear, similar to the native system
- Introduce some kind of "prosperity" skill, which allows you to raise your wealth above the minimum level

-> if you want to use better gear, you have to spend skill points on it, creating a certain balance between skills and equipment in the game.


(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Elmokki on April 23, 2012, 09:59:57 pm
- it's luck based. I don't like random chances.

This argument is retarded.

Yes, it's based on luck if you get repairs on a particular round, but the amount of ticks you get playing cRPG for let's say, 10 hours, is high enough to essentially make it a thing you can consider to be non-random and static.

Sadly people don't understand this, which is no surprise when these forums are full of people failing at basic math things.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Dezilagel on April 23, 2012, 10:07:15 pm
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Seriously though, I doubt this'd work.

1. Heirlooms. So you heirloomed an expensive item but don't want to be a whimp? Sucks to be you!

2. It'd KILL versatility. No fake peasants, no ridiculous shit/builds. Boring. Besides, the absolutely most expensive stuff (super-heavy cav) isn't even that good.

3. Lots of work to solve a problem that doesn't really exist imho. The upkeep system isn't perfect, but it works alright. It could be a bit less random for all I care, but if you have a solid buffer it'll even out anyway.

Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Tzar on April 23, 2012, 10:22:37 pm
cRPG have upkeep :?: didn't even notice tbh...

Must suck to fail at the market i guess  :lol:
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kafein on April 23, 2012, 10:31:14 pm
The upkeep system precisely works now because it stopped working.

Upkeep was introduced mid January 2011 and was horrible at that time, but sort of a necessity for some people that tought expensive equipment was giving unfair advantages. It got a lot better when you could actually mitigate it using the marketplace.


My point is, the less upkeep the better as equipment price stopped being seriously taken into account by the balancing team. Probably due to this :
Quote
you can't balance things by the time (=gold) needed to achieve them, because time is an endless ressource
Expensive equipment already wasn't that much better, but now it has been nerfed over and over again, down to roughly the same levels as cheap and medium equipment.

The current balance sort of works because it slowly kicked upkeep out of the scheme, replacing it by a (more or less) consistent balancing of all items based on ingame stats, so that choosing whatever is costlier isn't a good idea.

It is this development that actually killed variety and character development (you can call it grind for all I care, I don't see anything wrong with it). Everybody can buy and use every item. Items completely lost their value, which was something very important. Being attached to your character is just as valuable as the gameplay or the social interactions in MP games.

I support Joker's suggestion as it would IMO increase the effective variety of characters, add a very welcome rpg element and get rid of a very flawed mechanic that lost both it's reason to exist and it's effectivity, except for new players (great).
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 23, 2012, 10:36:28 pm
This argument is retarded.

Yes, it's based on luck if you get repairs on a particular round, but the amount of ticks you get playing cRPG for let's say, 10 hours, is high enough to essentially make it a thing you can consider to be non-random and static.

Sadly people don't understand this, which is no surprise when these forums are full of people failing at basic math things.

The "luck based" was more aimed at the particular round instead on long term. Random "loot" is for MMORPGs. But, to set things clear, this point was never meant as a "real", an objective argument, just my feeling about it.

Seriously though, I doubt this'd work.

1. Heirlooms. So you heirloomed an expensive item but don't want to be a whimp? Sucks to be you!

Plan your builds. You can't have everything. That's the point of limitations.

2. It'd KILL versatility. No fake peasants, no ridiculous shit/builds. Boring. Besides, the absolutely most expensive stuff (super-heavy cav) isn't even that good.

It would INCREASE versatility. Why would there be no more fake peasants? If anything, it would increase their amount, because people who want to maximize their skills would be limited on cheap equipment. And you can still create shit builds, why shouldn't you be able to any more? Yes, we can argue about the actual value of the best items, the heavy horses, plate armours or the flamberge are such candidates, but why do 90% of all two handed infantry use either a Danish or a German great sword? (Felt value  :wink: ). Those few most expensive but crappy items were actually nerfed down because the upkeep system didn't do the job. Now, as good items cost you skills, there is again "room" to buff those items.

Who uses a Two Handed War Axe?


(click to show/hide)


No one, because no one needs the "special ability" of the war axe being a compromise between price and effectivity. People don't decide for "mediocre" items, except in the case of armour perhaps, because there are not enough backhits in using the top tier items.

3. Lots of work to solve a problem that doesn't really exist imho. The upkeep system isn't perfect, but it works alright. It could be a bit less random for all I care, but if you have a solid buffer it'll even out anyway.

I think it limits only the biggest "equipment excesses"... everyone else is constantly close to his "optimal" equipment. Just think about how many infantry you see with Kuyak armour, closed helmet and two handed sword (as already said, German or Danish, sometimes SOW). There is no greater variety, and there are no big choices concerning your equipment. Most classes share the same pool of equipment used, there is just no reason to use any item of the first two thirds of the weapon list once you reach lvl 30. 
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Rebelyell on April 24, 2012, 12:20:25 am
really no,
there is no problem some peps have gold some haven't
hevy armors never make you soooo much slower and weaker, joker you clearly have no idea about that
hevy horses suck becuse you can 1hit them

upkeap is best thing what happened to that game and you want take back stupid old system with some restrictions

its bad idea
it sounds like socialism

Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 24, 2012, 12:24:33 am
really no,
there is no problem some peps have gold some haven't
hevy armors never make you soooo much slower and weaker, joker you clearly have no idea about that
hevy horses suck becuse you can 1hit them

upkeap is best thing what happened to that game and you want take back stupid old system with some restrictions

its bad idea
it sounds like socialism

Those last two sentences give me the hope this was only a troll post, because otherwise you didn't get a single point of what I wrote...  :?
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Lichen on April 24, 2012, 12:49:57 am
As you all know, the purpose of the upkeep system was to limit people to a certain level of equipment, instead of having everyone running around with the best item of one type or working on it.
The 'best' isn't so best since their stats are usually adjusted to not be 'best' in everything but maybe one thing only.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 24, 2012, 02:19:16 am
The 'best' isn't so best since their stats are usually adjusted to not be 'best' in everything but maybe one thing only.

The developers tried to create some kind of "artificial" variety by moving all items closer together (concerning their effectivity) and to make the disadvantages of the most expensive items that severe, that they are not used widely on the servers. Which means the most expensive items are not necessarily the most expensive ones. If you want, replace "expensive" with "cost-effective", and there you go.

The effect of it is, that most players use the weapons which are in the upper third, resulting in some kind of artificial variety. The difference to a real variety is, that the decision is not based on balancing a character somehow (e.g. choosing between equipment and skills, like in my suggestion), but only basing on the item balance within an item category. The best compromise between speed and protection are the armours in the 40-50 armour area. The best allrounder swords are the German and the Danish greatswords. The most effective horses are between rouncey and destrier, because right now speed and mobility grant a higher survivability of the horse than armour. The changes to bow damage on hitboxes made fast shooting bows with less damage more effective than slow bows with additional damage, because of the increased headshot damage the additional damage of the big bows is not worth the slower speed.

You understand what I mean? The choice of items is not basing on different character build philosophies, it's only basing on the viability of an item. Which is the best (not most expensive) armour/sword/bow?

I think they didn't do it deliberately, it's just how Kafein noticed, they actually stopped balancing items by price. Which is perfectly reasonable, because prices change nothing. They just saw that the "extreme" items need to get nerfed, and so flamberges, plated chargers and longbows are fairly seldom on the servers. If you changed to my wealth system, you would need to buff those items, again, of course.  :wink:
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Beauchamp on April 24, 2012, 03:17:18 am
the only problem with upkeep i see is the items are to cheap

- horses are extremely cheap
- xbows are very cheap
- body armors are cheap
- high tier weapons are cheap

like how the fuck can i afford to pay upkeep for bec de corbin, vaegir elite armor, crossbow, scale gauntlets and steel bolts at the same time?
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Thomek on April 24, 2012, 03:45:05 am
to rewrite your post Joker. (You still write walls of text very few care to read through)

1. You want to remove upkeep
2. In stead you have an amount of money to spend based on a. Level   AND   b. richness skill/attribute

So if you want to have expensive gear, you must pay for it in skillpoints in stead, sacrificing your build in other areas.

Right?

I immediately liked the idea, but now I'm not so sure.. Too many factors influence your gold gain, and the system really ain't THAT broken to begin with. It would remove the teamwork factor to gold, the personal factor (although autobalance probably removes most of that), the will to get X5!

Also it would include a huge rebalancing of everything job most likely..
On the other hand, leeching would loose the point (except for leveling).

Not a terrible idea, but I doubt it would happen. I also like the X5 system, (even though it's an illusion!)   :evil:

I have another crazy idea now.. :) Base the upkeep price on items based on their popularity! Would kickstart the marketplace too.. And would severy cut down the number of danish greatswords, too many cav etc etc..

That would be forced variety though.. I could like it.   (Discuss it here: http://forum.c-rpg.net/index.php/topic,30680.0.html)
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: POOPHAMMER on April 24, 2012, 03:49:23 am
Those last two sentences give me the hope this was only a troll post, because otherwise you didn't get a single point of what I wrote...  :?

To be quite honest in order to get a single point you write, we have to read it. Sorry dude, I am not reading 500 sentences about a suggestion in a videogame. Maybe if you didnt treat every post of your like an unban essay people would actually read it.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 24, 2012, 10:08:28 am
Too many factors influence your gold gain, and the system really ain't THAT broken to begin with. It would remove the teamwork factor to gold, the personal factor (although autobalance probably removes most of that), the will to get X5!

I think the will is only existing rudimentary among the server population, anyway, otherwise there would be much more teamplay.


I have another crazy idea now.. :) Base the upkeep price on items based on their popularity! Would kickstart the marketplace too.. And would severy cut down the number of danish greatswords, too many cav etc etc..

For a moment I thought about basing the item value on this, but I decided against it, because then others would influence your choice of equipment...  :?

To be quite honest in order to get a single point you write, we have to read it. Sorry dude, I am not reading 500 sentences about a suggestion in a videogame. Maybe if you didnt treat every post of your like an unban essay people would actually read it.

Well, I think that if you want to make a proper suggestion you need to explain it properly, and to explain which consequences it will have, because I don't want to start explaining what people understood wrong in 50% of all posts. And I think that if someone wants to participate in modifying such a sophisticated game like cRPG, he should bring the will and time to read a proper text and explanation, instead of "remove upkeep, it killed game, k thx". Nonetheless I edited my OP.

I think I failed, anyway, I have -4 already. I hope it's really related to the suggestion and not to my person or the extend of the OP...  :?
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kafein on April 24, 2012, 08:19:51 pm
the only problem with upkeep i see is the items are to cheap

- horses are extremely cheap
- xbows are very cheap
- body armors are cheap
- high tier weapons are cheap

like how the fuck can i afford to pay upkeep for bec de corbin, vaegir elite armor, crossbow, scale gauntlets and steel bolts at the same time?

Troll post much ?

Horses and heavy armor already have the worst value for money of all item types. I'm literally doing as good with light armor and a long spear or a medium tier 2h as I do fully armored on a horse. If anything, upkeep should be balanced to account for the real value of equipment on the battlefield, and not the fantasies of peasant enthusiasts.


If anything, the will to get x5 should be lowered. Before the upkeep patch people used to play for fun. That changed. And I'm sure there's more to it than just nostalgia glasses. Since that patch cRPG feels like LoL, except that when you lose it's even worse because you are actually punished for something you have very little do to with.

Of course this feeling is not shared equally among the community, as people have different tastes which ends up forcing some to pay more upkeep and depend on their team more than others. And that is fucked up. Ever wondered why cav people never delay at x1/x2 ? I think you guessed it.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Khalim on April 24, 2012, 08:58:43 pm
Sorry, I did not read all but I hope I can still give you a qualified opinion.

The upkeep is fine as it is. To improve the system I would take out the randomness, but this is fairly easy by just make a fixed upkeep cost per round.
Instead of 50% chance of 1000 cost just change it to 100% of 500.


What I think is, that it is really bad to put the player into the choice between "wealth" and "skill". Its just very unfun to play.
You can either wear good gear and have no money or you can wear bad gear, but have better stats.
I dont see the advantage in this system, because as I said the player has to decided between two devils.


The only way to balance upceep and the worth of gold is tweaking the >Viability of Armor<. Personally I dont wear good armor because it slows me down and costs me more gold and I would rather spend the saved gold on heirloom items.
Ok, its not nice either to get 1 or 2 hitted, but it is acceptable.

To buff the value of gold the armor needs to get buffed to but maybe thats the wrong topic.


What the game maybe needs is a cool idea of a viable goldsink so that player really enjoy wasting their money ;)
Recently I read the idea of someone who said that there should be introduced Tier 4 items and the upgrade from 3 to 4 is not with Heirlooming but with gold(maybee 1-2 Mio)

I dont think that Items are too cheap generally. Ok I am still gen 1(but this is due to the sucky altchar-system, so i started from new) but whenever I have to pay for my warspear(~500) it hurts :D
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Beauchamp on April 24, 2012, 09:13:08 pm
Horses and heavy armor already have the worst value for money of all item types.

the biggest joke ever
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Vexus on April 24, 2012, 09:33:17 pm
Yes, horses are extremely cheap compared to the rest of the other things.
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kafein on April 24, 2012, 09:37:44 pm
the biggest joke ever

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?visitors can't see pics , please register or login


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Saying or implying the contrary would be the biggest joke ever.

EDIT : pictures will be back at the end of the month. I pointed out that a destrier is the same price as a churburg cuirass, a palfrey the same as a GLA, and the sumpter horse is worth the same as the mace.

Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 24, 2012, 10:33:45 pm
The only way to balance upceep and the worth of gold is tweaking the >Viability of Armor<. Personally I dont wear good armor because it slows me down and costs me more gold and I would rather spend the saved gold on heirloom items.
Ok, its not nice either to get 1 or 2 hitted, but it is acceptable.

You can't balance things over the viability of items. You just implied that different items/armours should have different viability values. But if there are armours of lower and of higher viability, who would use the less viable ones? Everyone would stick to the same few armours, resulting in everyone running around with the same look and stats. Which is exactly what we have now. Most infantry is using the armours in the range of 40-50 protection. There are only very few tincans, and we also have only few light armoured, quick infantrymen, 60-75% are the typical heavy infantry with always the same weapons which can be found in the last two lines of the shop site. No one plays heavy cavalry any more. And the reason is NOT that the upkeep is too high. The reason is that the class is made unviable. And why is that? Because balancing it by upkeep didn't work.

Many of you wrote that you shouldn't fix what is not really broken. My point is, that you don't really feel that the upkeep system is broken, because you don't know it any other way.

I always thought it was fun if everyone could create his own char, using his own items. The point was not to outgrind other players, but to just spice the game up and give it some variety and persistance. Have your own char, live with it, with it's strength, but also with it's flaws.

This is what chadz once wrote about his motivation. He mentions variety. But there is no variety. If you want to play shield infantry, you know exactly which builds and which equipment is viable, which is not. Same goes for 2hd infs, pikemen, archers, cavalry and so on. Usually you use the items which are in the third quarter of the list, because that's the area where the developers decided to add the highest viability.

Yes, currently all classes are of about the same strength, but it's for the price of limiting them to a few viable items, making balancing easier. If the developers would allow people to respec and to rearrange loom points as they want, or at least way more often, for a limited period of time, they could balance things much faster than now.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Rainbow on April 24, 2012, 10:42:43 pm
I am already a multi multi multi millionair.  Leave it alone.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 24, 2012, 11:59:18 pm
I am already a multi multi multi millionair.  Leave it alone.

That's the problem. I don't want you to have ingame benefits from it.  :P
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Rainbow on April 25, 2012, 12:12:04 am
Why not?  I had to sacrafice a lot of time and energy to be able to afford the in game benefits.  People always want something for nothing. 
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kenouse on April 25, 2012, 12:54:09 am
So you dont want a guy that spends alot of time playing the game, to get benefits?
Thats the most selfish comment ive seen in a long time...

Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 25, 2012, 01:11:45 am
So you dont want a guy that spends alot of time playing the game, to get benefits?
Thats the most selfish comment ive seen in a long time...

I want implemented features to work properly, and not players who spend a lot of time ingame circumvent those. Dedication is a good thing, but it shouldn't grant massive gameplay advantages, the advantages should stop at some point. You need to limit it.

He can have advantages, but please not "unlimited" access to equipment that he shouldn't be supposed to have. The fact that this equipment is not really viable doesn't change much.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Rainbow on April 25, 2012, 01:25:23 am
The people who can afford all this top notch gear and lose money spend a lot of time playing the game which means they are probably better.  Everybody will quickly say they are good because they armor crutch or whatever but that isn't the real advantage.  As a general rule of thumb, more time played = better at the game and armor crutchers can be beat wearing 50,000 gold gear by a guy with a stick wearing gear that cost 5 gold.  The main advantage is experience.  Maybe we should nerf that to balance huh?  Nerfing or buffing repair is not a solve all.  It just appeases the broke people who claim someone better then them won because of gear.  That isn't always the case. 

P.S.  Sell your loom point and wear any armor you want for an entire gen.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: ArchonAlarion on April 25, 2012, 05:38:58 am
In the end, the idea is fail because it simplifies the game. Gold is good because it adds an additional context, which players can build strategies around. Further, it ties wealth into a multi-generational continuum. Wealth is then not simply part of a generation's build, but is part of a wider strategy that connects generation to generation. I'm probably not explaining this well.

For instance, a player would do well to start the first generation off with a cheap gear specialist build, then retire and sell the loom point. As the generations go on, the player can use more expensive gear and heirlooms to offset the cost of hybridization (especially in the case of riding). I think the game will only get better the more main to alt, gen to gen continuums are added.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Vkvkvk on April 25, 2012, 05:53:30 am
Why not?  I had to sacrafice a lot of time and energy to be able to afford the in game benefits.  People always want something for nothing.

Not to break your bubble, but how can sitting on your ass pressing mouse buttons repeatedly sacrifice your energy? Might want to get checked in real life.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kafein on April 25, 2012, 02:16:18 pm
In the end, the idea is fail because it simplifies the game. Gold is good because it adds an additional context, which players can build strategies around. Further, it ties wealth into a multi-generational continuum. Wealth is then not simply part of a generation's build, but is part of a wider strategy that connects generation to generation. I'm probably not explaining this well.

For instance, a player would do well to start the first generation off with a cheap gear specialist build, then retire and sell the loom point. As the generations go on, the player can use more expensive gear and heirlooms to offset the cost of hybridization (especially in the case of riding). I think the game will only get better the more main to alt, gen to gen continuums are added.

I think you are right about alt-main relations (alts need buffing anyway), but not on generation continuum. Generation continuum would be acheived too with these ideas implemented as gold would still exist. It would simply be separated from "upkeep". Back in pre-upkeep cRPG, simply buying regular items used to take a lot of time. To give an example, I think I needed 3 weeks to make enough cash to buy my destrier (which was more expensive than the first few generations). A single generation is shorter than that for an active player nowadays.

With upkeep out, the gold income could be lowered and regular items worth something again (of course implementing such a change would cause distorsions between players if not done right)
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: sF_Guardian on April 25, 2012, 02:21:13 pm
The current upkkep system is nice, leave it as it is.
Stop bein butthurt and post idiotic crap, just cuz ur IWANTPERMAMILANESEPLATEPLATETCHARGERAND2WEAPONS doesnt work...
I like the system cuz u cant plan exactly how much you will loose and u are forced to stay in mid-tier equip generally.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 25, 2012, 06:28:19 pm
The current upkkep system is nice, leave it as it is.
Stop bein butthurt and post idiotic crap, just cuz ur IWANTPERMAMILANESEPLATEPLATETCHARGERAND2WEAPONS doesnt work...
I like the system cuz u cant plan exactly how much you will loose and u are forced to stay in mid-tier equip generally.

Usually I try not to talk down to people and indicate that I think they were idiots, and therefore I'd like to be treated the same way.

First of all, I don't use expensive equipment at all, nor do I whish to increase its price. The suggestion is rather unrelated to my own character, it's just something I noticed and thought it could be changed.

You said currently you are forced to stay mid-tier generally, and we agree on that. But I ask you where this is a good thing? Shouldn't people be allowed to run around in heavy plate or even to ride around as heavy cavalry as long as they want? (Under the condition that their class is not OP compared to the others, of course!). Or people, who deliberately decide to use cheaper equipment, shouldn't they get rewarded somehow?

I don't say that upkeep is broken and the game doesn't work any more. I say the upkeep system doesn't provide all possibilities to create an RPG with really interesting options. In the current state there are too many inferior, and too few viable builds. I would like to increase variety in general.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Ronin on April 25, 2012, 06:46:25 pm
I like the idea of making heavy cavalry players to play as heavy cavalry all the time. But balancing them with stats seemed like a bad idea to me. There might be a better way.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 25, 2012, 11:15:29 pm
I like the idea of making heavy cavalry players to play as heavy cavalry all the time. But balancing them with stats seemed like a bad idea to me. There might be a better way.

Yes, it's a bit.. clumsy, but in the end, it's the only solution, besides nerfing horses and lances to pure shit and making plate armour as heavy as siege equipment.  :?

In the end you can only tell for sure when you have tested it...
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: oohillac on April 26, 2012, 04:00:24 pm
I think this is a great idea, Joker.  +1

But would the "skill" for increasing available gold limit be strength/agility based, or how?
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 26, 2012, 06:34:15 pm
I think this is a great idea, Joker.  +1

But would the "skill" for increasing available gold limit be strength/agility based, or how?

I think this is a question of fine tuning. But I think it would be the best to make it completely unrelated to attributes, because if you decided for one of the two available attributes, you would buff builds who either stack AGI or STR. If you chose the higher skill of both still balanced builds would be at a disadvantage.

The only alternative that comes to my mind is to make it a third attribute instead of a skill. But this is a question of balancing, and you always have to keep in mind that 1 attribute point equals 2 skill points, so actually no change there.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Gnjus on April 26, 2012, 06:44:59 pm
This is it, we have the winner. Joxer86 is the new Michael. Thomek will have to wait for some better chance.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: POOPHAMMER on April 26, 2012, 06:46:42 pm
This is it, we have the winner. Joxer86 is the new Michael. Thomek will have to wait for some better chance.

Heh, that guy
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kafein on April 26, 2012, 06:47:26 pm
This is it, we have the winner. Joxer86 is the new Michael. Thomek will have to wait for some better chance.

Wtf... I don't get it. Michael was a pure negative whining guy.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Gnjus on April 26, 2012, 06:50:12 pm
Wtf... I don't get it. Michael was a pure negative whining guy.

Michael was a pure "I'm gonna open yet another meaningless clueless suggestion just to raise my opened-threads count and to make myself look even more of an imbecile then i already am" type of guy.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Kafein on April 26, 2012, 06:52:44 pm
Michael was a pure "I'm gonna open yet another meaningless clueless suggestion just to raise my opened-threads count and to make myself look even more of an imbecile then i already am" type of guy.

His suggestions were totally unrealistic and only about buffing himself. I still don't see any link with joker.
Title: Re: Replace upkeep system with equipment limiting system that works!
Post by: Joker86 on April 26, 2012, 07:43:40 pm
Michael was a pure "I'm gonna open yet another meaningless clueless suggestion just to raise my opened-threads count and to make myself look even more of an imbecile then i already am" type of guy.

Then please, would you mind to point out at which part exactly I revealed that I am an imbecile?

Perhaps people don't like my suggestions, that's okay, everyone has his own taste. But I think my suggestions at least make some sense, and they should achieve the effects I want quite well, the only thing is that apparently there are only few to none people who want the same effects on gameplay like me.  :cry: