cRPG

cRPG => Suggestions Corner => Topic started by: Noctivagant on November 28, 2011, 05:03:17 pm

Title: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Noctivagant on November 28, 2011, 05:03:17 pm
This is a rough idea to save archers from getting nerfed constantly without upsetting the melee players.

I thought of two modes for archers,

Primary mode : Fast mode with shorter range deals less damage (1/3) cut mode

Archer draws the bow a lot quicker but it reduces the missile speed and range, it also deals less damage and if the draw is longer than a second, reticule gets wider.

Secondary mode : Slow mode with long range deals total damage (3/3) pierce mode

Archer draws the bow slower but deals the real damage, curved shots are still required archer can hold the draw a lot longer but cannot move

The skill value also effects the secondary mode, any value lower than PD 6 cannot use the secondary mode. Horse archery is excluded from the secondary mode.

I'm doing archery as hobby and the idea came up to me when I was fooling around in the archery range while ago. Fast shooting is called instinctive nocking or shooting.

exaggerated example of fast shooting http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wcIZ9ZxliA#t=4s (I know this is a game)

exaggerated secondary mode http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7203B8xbAM

over exaggerated third mode http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqFcTpmMCJU#t=50s
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: B3RS3RK on November 28, 2011, 05:07:01 pm
YES OH MY GAWD YES
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Ylca on November 28, 2011, 05:08:59 pm
2Hers would cry themselves to sleep over this change. Most archers would be fine doing 1/3 damage and machinegunning anyone who doesn't have a shield that's charging them, i sure as hell would.

This change will most likely never see the light of day, as i honestly think it would give archers an unfair advantage.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: B3RS3RK on November 28, 2011, 05:11:45 pm
1/3 of cut damage will do shit to anyone with over 50 Body armor, which would be most 2hs and such.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Ylca on November 28, 2011, 05:36:32 pm
Quote from: B3RS3RK on November 28, 2011, 05:11:45 pm
1/3 of cut damage will do shit to anyone with over 50 Body armor, which would be most 2hs and such.

I don't care about the damage, i care about the stun. Hit-stun-run-shoot, rinse wash and repeat. I'm a patient man and i guarantee you i would cause people to GTX if this change were ever implemented. It'd be great for me personally, and archers everywhere but very bad for the mod in general, thus i'd have to vote no.

The only alternative to fix it would be to take the stun off the 1/3 damage shots but if there's no stun there's really not much point in taking 3 shots on a swiftly approaching target rather than one well aimed shot that will cause the same damage and give you time to escape.

e: Also bodkins are pierce still, once they're fixed.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Kajia on November 28, 2011, 06:10:52 pm
I love this idea.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Governor on November 28, 2011, 07:29:32 pm
This is an interesting idea, but my main concern is about the whole "cannot move" while firing in secondary mode.  Who doesn't move a little bit while drawing in every situation?  I don't mean you should be able to run like mad, but when another archer is firing on you with a horn bow and you have a long bow, you are dead 100% of the time if you had to stand still.  Even though I have a bigger and badder bow that is [arguable] intended to be used at long range, I would have to switch into the first mode just to be able to avoid being an easy target for other archers.  This is perhaps even a bigger issue when I'm against a crossbowman; it is already tough enough that they can wait as long as they want to fire while I need to be ready to dodge at any moment.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Noctivagant on November 28, 2011, 09:11:43 pm
Quote from: Governor on November 28, 2011, 07:29:32 pm
This is an interesting idea, but my main concern is about the whole "cannot move" while firing in secondary mode.  Who doesn't move a little bit while drawing in every situation?  I don't mean you should be able to run like mad, but when another archer is firing on you with a horn bow and you have a long bow, you are dead 100% of the time if you had to stand still.  Even though I have a bigger and badder bow that is [arguable] intended to be used at long range, I would have to switch into the first mode just to be able to avoid being an easy target for other archers.  This is perhaps even a bigger issue when I'm against a crossbowman; it is already tough enough that they can wait as long as they want to fire while I need to be ready to dodge at any moment.

Well he won't be able to shoot you without secondary mode, basically if he is in primary mode his arrows wouldn't reach you and if he is close enough you'd switch to primary mode and move.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Segd on November 28, 2011, 09:27:16 pm
Quote from: Ylca on November 28, 2011, 05:36:32 pm
I don't care about the damage, i care about the stun.
1/3 cut + 50 body armor = no stub, cause no damage even with mw bow & arrows.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Everkistus on November 29, 2011, 12:47:05 am
Quote from: Noctivagant on November 28, 2011, 05:03:17 pm
over exaggerated third mode http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqFcTpmMCJU#t=50s
Read you thread carefully then watched this.

IMPLEMENT IT I WANT TO SHOOT WITH MY FEET SO MUCH WANT!!!111!1!
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Jarlek on November 29, 2011, 03:29:56 am
Quote from: Kajia on November 28, 2011, 06:10:52 pm
I love this idea.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: OttomanSniper on November 29, 2011, 12:23:11 pm
If you add this option to the game pls give free respec. I'm tired.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Ylca on November 29, 2011, 03:36:31 pm
Quote from: Segd on November 28, 2011, 09:27:16 pm
1/3 cut + 50 body armor = no stub, cause no damage even with mw bow & arrows.

I'm not sure if you're purposefully ignoring this because this would be a massive boon for archers, but let me point this out again.

"Also bodkins are pierce still, once they're fixed."
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Gnjus on November 29, 2011, 04:14:14 pm
Quote from: Noctivagant on November 28, 2011, 05:03:17 pm
I'm doing archery as hobby

(click to show/hide)

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Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Arrowblood on November 29, 2011, 08:41:46 pm
I like this idea. The secondary is something nice for me and my longbow.           
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: ToxicKilla on November 29, 2011, 09:45:18 pm
This is actually a pretty neat idea. Would be great for my longbow alt, I'd actually be able to longshot like the longbow was made for.
Would be nice if there was a small damage bonus based on how far away the enemy is, although this would be unrealistic it would encourage people to not shotgun.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Steelbird on November 30, 2011, 01:32:32 am
you would also have to give you accuracy for this to so it would be escentually useless also archers judt deal with it and run away or stand and fight with real weapon like man! :twisted:
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Noctivagant on November 30, 2011, 02:17:19 am
Quote from: Gnjus on November 29, 2011, 04:14:14 pm
(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

Well I developed that hobby when I realized that there is an archery range at my girl friends's job, there is also a golf course but I had to make a choice.

Quote from: ToxicKilla on November 29, 2011, 09:45:18 pm
This is actually a pretty neat idea. Would be great for my longbow alt, I'd actually be able to longshot like the longbow was made for.
Would be nice if there was a small damage bonus based on how far away the enemy is, although this would be unrealistic it would encourage people to not shotgun.

That damage bonus over range is just an ego boost, something like getting hp bonus for every projectile you dodge.
Quote from: Steelbird on November 30, 2011, 01:32:32 am
you would also have to give you accuracy for this to so it would be escentually useless also archers judt deal with it and run away or stand and fight with real weapon like man! :twisted:

You are a member of this community since August 2nd 2011, yet melee players successfully converted you to a mindless zombie. Well lad I'm here since its very early days and prolly I've played more melee than you ever did, so I'm playing as an archer to save the community from my manliness.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Ylca on November 30, 2011, 11:20:26 am
"I like this" is not the same as "this will be balanced".

It's like a high school popularity contest in here sometimes where everyone wants the crown for their own special niche.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: karasu on November 30, 2011, 11:26:16 am
This would be interesting taking in account everything is getting secondary modes (check the new polearm secondary stuff).
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Vibe on November 30, 2011, 11:53:02 am
Great idea, hope it gets implemented.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Tennenoth on November 30, 2011, 01:21:05 pm
Divided, I personally wouldn't use the machine gun mode of firing and it would be one more hassle to press x, switch weapon, press x in order to go into secondary mode for both weapons (Langes Messer & Longbow).

Secondly, archers have to stand and shoot over long distances in order to get reasonable accuracy anyway, if they're running and shooting they're going to be inaccurate and likely to miss their shots while running from the enemy, the main point where you'd use the fast drawing.

All this would do would be to make bows more like crossbows with the stand and shoot, only xbows can reload behind cover, can move while drawn back and are more accurate and higher damage etc etc.

It would mean that killing archers for melee would be easier I suppose, since they wouldn't be able to move quite as well but I honestly don't like this.

It'll make the game a bunch of stationary turrets or running machine guns with guys with swords running around in the middle.

In theory I guess with some tweaks it would be quite nice but the thing I have the biggest bugbear is the "standing still", I know where you're coming from but in terms of gameplay it would severely detract from it, i'm still annoyed that I can't walk down stairs in some cases without unknocking my bow.
Title: Re: Primary and Secondary modes for Archery
Post by: Bulzur on November 30, 2011, 04:14:04 pm
Well, i guess this would mean the end of the 15 str foot archer, since this secondary mode seems pretty awesome. But well, if i need to retire to get it, i'd probably do just that.

Nice idea.