cRPG
Strategus => Strategus General Discussion => Topic started by: mandible/splinteryourjaw on November 12, 2011, 07:35:30 pm
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I read the post saying all are free to enter and trade in DRZ lands, and only ayn assaudi had a 5% tax...Well I sent my toon to Sekhtem last night to spend the night and continue to Tamnuh today.
When I sign on today I see all of my gold is gone...its seems the "free land" charges 100 gold an hour to stay and a 5% tax. Thats cool, I should have stayed up all night to check what the fee was when I entered or checked earlier this morning. Lesson learned, DRZ enjoy your (my) gold.
I have no hard feelings against DRZ, but I do want to warn everybody that they charge 100 gold to stay in a fief and more than one fief charges 5% tax (usually 2-3 gold per good or more.) This is not trader friendly and I wonder just how much gold they have made off with without the trader noticing or how many small independent traders like me they have broke.
I would recommend avoiding this area as it is not only expensive but also attract bandits just outside the boundaries.
p.s. DRZ change your post to reflect the truth!!! Thank you
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come back and trade with the FCC mandible we are the truth
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its seems the "free land" charges 100 gold an hour to stay
:shock:
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free only from bandits, isn't it? lol
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Free trading zone means you can sell in our lands, doesn't mean we going to let you craft in our lands, we can't set up low stay fee in fiefs, so we don't ruin our production by hordes of randomers that want to stay in village.
Don't stay in occupied fiefs. If you want to spend a night somewhere use a castle or town, or stay outside fief. If u going to get attacked outside fief, the person who attacked you will be outlawed and attacked by us.
Seriously, we don't care if you come and trade in our land or not, makes no difference to us. Yes all fiefs will have 5% Tax too.
Again: Free trade - means you can sell in our lands, pass through our lands without being attacked by us, and yes we attack bandits who dare to attack caravans in our lands.
Unlike with FCC, you don't have to warn us when you entering out territory, so you wouldn't get attacked by the owners.
Income from 5% tax isn't worth even bothering with keeping bandits off our lands and in comparison to the money we make on our caravans, its practicly 0
How much money did u lose mandible?
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Well. mandible, you were just inattentive that lost all your gold on the hourly fee. There are still some villages with very little fee. For example in Aun Assuadi there is only 20 gold per hour. And in Hawaha only 1 (!) gold per hour. And that I suppose temporary.
You just shouldn.t stay in our industrial center and won't lose your gold.
And your review is very unfriendly. Everything can be solved amicably.
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Updated rules for FREE trading in my main post.
I hope no one will confuse free trade with free crafting anymore.
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Guys understand 1 thing first...I haven't blamed anybody for this, but myself, thus this is not meant to be an "unfriendly" post. I'm simply informing others my experience before they waste time or gold. I will recover. I decided to give DRZ a try, but IMHO there are better, cheaper places to trade. 2nd thing I didn't confuse anything. It was clearly stated free trading zone...come one come all??? Right??? 3rd I was not crafting I was just hanging out so that I knew where my toon was when I got back.
Fact is the post was misleading and the pm I received before entering your lands reads in part "...Druzhina's locations, where prices are high and where you can produce something cheap.
We do not raise taxes, only in 1 village we have 5% tax, and we have low hourly visiting fee." "produce something cheap" implies crafters welcome, again I wasn't crafting. "low hourly visiting fee" sure glad you didn't charge me the high hourly visiting fee (the dancing girls weren't that cute.)
Again I BLAME myself, but I do believe the post should reflect the "truth."
By the way, have I mentioned yet that I wasn't crafting, I can't craft because I have a load of goods already. I was just spending the night (and I mean spending.) I don't disagree that your have a free trade zone...you did afterall "free" me of my purse (shouldn't I get a speed bonus now that I'm lighter?) Naw loosing my troops has slowed me down.
Nebun...you asked what I lost. It was substantial, but I would rather not say because I am not asking for nor do I want a refund or reparations...again it was my fault for not checking after I entered late last night, I was actually already asleep when I entered and didn't sign on until a a couple of hours ago to move. Your 5% tax would have netted you far more gold in the long run than this cutt-throat visiting fee. As stated you do not need me, as my trade value is unimportant, so no hard feelings as I now move to other lands.
p.s. I believe every clan offers all neutral traders the opportuntiy to enter their lands for free; to trade. I believe asking someone to verify who they are is not asking too much. I am more comfortable asking so that there is no confusion, and I have secured rights across the map this way. In essence what DRZ has is some derivative of that and not a truly free trade zone. Free trade zone implies land without tariffs or excise taxes of any sort.
To Naduril; yes i was inattentive, I never said I wasn't. I doubt I was in an industrial center though :D you have 2 people crafting there. Thanks for the costs of some of the other areas...I will choose to move elsewhere to avoid any further surprises though.
The worst of this deal is that I am loosing troops now because I can't pay them, and every troop amounts to 1 hour of my time and a speed nerf.
Bale I will be in your lands shortly...I believe I will have to return to dancing in Huey and Kesh's gay bar to put food on the table for my troops. :D
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if you removing visiting price - ur let neutrals guys use your fiefs as they want. if u'll kick them they will enter again, if u'll attack them - it never can be free trade area
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As I said before.
visitors can't see pics , please register or login
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we will welcome you back whenever you come up this way again.
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I don't remember it saying anywhere in that post that fiefs would not have fees for staying in them.
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I think "Be aware" would be better than "Beware."
"Beware" has negative connotations, implying treachery or banditry. This is neither, simply something which traders should know about and plan for.
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I don't remember it saying anywhere in that post that fiefs would not have fees for staying in them.
lol
WWWEEELLLLLLLLL this is strat, not Cuba...so consider my post full disclosure for the masses. what are you charging in your fiefs...sounds like us traders may want to avoid them also??????????
I will say this one more time for you though...I am not complaining, whining, or demanding my gold/soldiers back. Those fiefs belong to DRZ, they can charge whatever they want. I, myself, went there expecting a reasonable charge (normal is 5 gold), 100 gold is not reasonable and in this strat it can kill an independent.
I, believing in fair and honest trade, have a right/duty to post my experience for others to view. This post can serve two purposes; First, and foremost, it warns all of my friends and trading partners (without me having to spend the next week sending pms to each) as well as other independent traders, who may think DRZ lands are the holy land of trading, of what to expect. Second maybe it will put pressure on DRZ to charge a reasonable rate.
Maybe chadz can add some script to show the dynamics of a fief by mousing over it to include sell price, fab, tax, and rent so that we don't have to send 500 pms.
I think "Be aware" would be better than "Beware."
No: I used the right term, BEWARE, for my situation and for the others who have plans and are currently heading that way based on previous information. I was led to believe something. Because I believed the information I had, I entered and stayed in this fief without a second thought to the welfare of my gold or soldiers. I was also apologized to for the "misunderstanding" (and I believe it was just that.) As such,I accepted and have NO hard feelings. Now that it is common knowledge all others should BE AWARE of the policies before planning a trip.
Why do so many of you guys like to pretend you are smarter or more important that the next. None of you know me and I know none of you. While you work on your degrees, I won't tell you how many are hanging on my wall. Because you are pursuing or have earned that piece of paper, it doesn't mean shit in life. Common sense is king...remember that, and again; COMMON SENSE IS KING. To each his own. I'll post what I want so my friends are informed, and AWARE. Thanks for the input.
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Forgive me, but the tone and the way you wrote your message came off as a bit of a complaint.(BEWARE, etc)
When I sign on today I see all of my gold is gone...its seems the "free land" charges 100 gold an hour to stay and a 5% tax. Thats cool, I should have stayed up all night to check what the fee was when I entered or checked earlier this morning. Lesson learned, DRZ enjoy your (my) gold.
As far as our lands are concerned, that's the business of CHAOS and the people we are currently doing business with. You're more than welcome to come and see for yourself and you're just as welcome to avoid our lands entirely. In any case, here's wishing you safe travels and better trade experiences in the future.
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Lord linden of vajayjay town aka tuna town would like to disclose my fiefs is 8 gold an hour to stay and 15 percent trade tax and has a -5 prosperity so crafting is cheap. Also Would like to check with my higher ups in Brd to see if we can loan you a bit o cash mandible to help you get rolling again if it would help yeh.
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Greziz: Thanks man thats pretty cool of you, but I'll be ok as soon as I get to my new destination and sell this load or goods.
Darkkarma: no prob, I can see where it would also read that way. I'm not happy about it, but I'm even more pissed at myself. I have a hard time sleeping and wake up constantly (not because of strat lol...just can't stay asleep.) Because of that, I was up several times last night, but feeling comfortable with the location I never bothered to check my toon...my fault, my responsibility.
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Just boycott all fiefs with exorbitant fees.
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100 gold? That's just an insult to any merchant that wants to be safe overnight if need be.
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Lord linden of vajayjay town aka tuna town would like to disclose my fiefs is 8 gold an hour to stay and 15 percent trade tax and has a -5 prosperity so crafting is cheap. Also Would like to check with my higher ups in Brd to see if we can loan you a bit o cash mandible to help you get rolling again if it would help yeh.
its 10% at Fenada and Kwynn, both at max selling price (which means 22.5 after tax plus distance bonus), 5 gold staying rate in jelbegi, with only 3 gold to craft
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Free trading zone means you can sell in our lands, doesn't mean we going to let you craft in our lands.
Then you should have added that to your Free Traiding Area post because it's easly missunderstandabe as strat uses term you are trading when you are crafting also. Tricking people with similar words and getting away with it is what you do.
Also getting advantage of one's moment of unawareness by setting 100g/hour is good way to show people who is the true bandit.
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What's up with all the people bitching about a high tax? Damn, I wanna raise the taxes of my own village. Matter of fact, I just did!
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It's not about tax. It's about hourly fee poster paid which was 100g fee per hour.
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It's not about tax. It's about hourly fee poster paid which was 100g fee per hour.
Which is the tax to stay in the village...
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Which is the tax to stay in the village...
Not realy. The term tax and fee is different (both in strat and irl).
So in strat
Paying for staying somewhere = Fee
Paying a percent of your trade income = Tax
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There goes the independent trader, squeezed to death by the greedy robber barons. The end result will be fiefs with no occupants other than the clans that own them. Then they can just charge themselves high taxes. That's a good zero sum game.
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Then you should have added that to your Free Traiding Area post because it's easly missunderstandabe as strat uses term you are trading when you are crafting also. Tricking people with similar words and getting away with it is what you do
Also getting advantage of one's moment of unawareness by setting 100g/hour is good way to show people who is the true bandit.
You missed one important thing: Nebun wanted to refund Mandible's losses, but he refused.
No one in DRZ is going to get an "advantage of one's moment of unawareness by setting 100g/hour". We simply do not need such "advantage".
Also it was already added to our trading post, immediately after this accident. Nebun mentioned it some posts above.
Once again: no one is trying to "Trick people with similar words and get away with it".
Please stop posting bullshit.
Thanks.
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I still don't get why these clans need 100 gold, even 20 gold more than compensates them for having someone craft in their village of having a slightly lower rate and it doesn't screw over traders staying an hour or two. Its not like strat 1, 20 gold is a whole lot of money but isnt the dick move that 100 gold an hour is.
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100 gold is set only to avoid random ppl doing nothing\something in villages. I really don't know why Vovka and Nebun don't want other ppl to craft anything in our lands, I guess they have reasons for it.
Obviously tax 100 is not for profit, it's senseless.
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You missed one important thing: Nebun wanted to refund Mandible's losses, but he refused.
No one in DRZ is going to get an "advantage of one's moment of unawareness by setting 100g/hour". We simply do not need such "advantage".
Also it was already added to our trading post, immediately after this accident. Nebun mentioned it some posts above.
Once again: no one is trying to "Trick people with similar words and get away with it".
Please stop posting bullshit.
Thanks.
Bullshit you say?
You offered him to refund and had to edit your clan post because you realized your mistake.
Good thing you did that indeed but don't try to act as if you haven't done the mistake at all.
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There goes the independent trader, squeezed to death by the greedy robber barons. The end result will be fiefs with no occupants other than the clans that own them. Then they can just charge themselves high taxes. That's a good zero sum game.
Yes this is my fear, I considered locking this post, but I left it open for discussions like this. But, can we put enough pressure on them (them not being DRZ alone) to make change.
An invite to one's house generally means you will not be unjustly charged upon entering, leaving, or your pocketbook will not be picked while there. In this case traders were welcomed with; FREE, FREE, FREE nothing has changed but one village and then it is only the tax. Deceitful??? Misleading??? or Just business???
This being a free market, I warned my friends and the strat world of the charges. This now, hopefully, pressures others who choose to charge such a high fee to reconsider their trade plans. If you don't want people in your fiefs crafting, state that or don't welcome them. I chose to go elsewhere because why should I trade and give my tax money to a trader that truly doesn't wish to welcome me. I am a cash cow and I choose where I get slaughtered (generally :D.) Remember, the trader's fees and taxes paid help the landowner wage war somewhere, so in the end the trader must support those that are trade friendly or risk losing his/her livelihood..
Nebun was very polite, as always, and hinted in the post that he may have refunded my gold if I had responded that I wanted such. I immedialtly closed that line of communication, the refund does not concern me. The long term vitality/viability of independent trading does. A refund is selling out and it leaves all other traders vulnerable.
For those that really want to know, I lost $1400 gold, 16 troops, and had to sell some, now unused/unneeded, armor to empty that crate (for the speed advantage.) I had seriously upgraded, buying a lot of new supplies, shortly before sending my toon to the fief or it could have been worse.
In my travels I have found FCC to be the most friendly towards traders followed by mercs (but be careful Merc land is bandit heavy; both north and south) , many clans I have contacted and found them to be very friendly, I have yet to visit their lands to confirm thier fees as I have been very happy with FCC. This statement does not include those with Ai owned claims so please don't get upset...just lands that are actively held.
I hold no grudges, it was clearly posted in screen if I had looked, I should have checked and didn't, granted I trusted and even though I never dreamed it would be something like 100 gold/hr it was still my responsibility. I'm not accusing DRZ of scamming or anything similar to that, I do accuse them of price gouging and I will boycott them as i will all who choose to destroy free trade.
Let this thread become an attack on high fees and not DRZ alone!!! If I wanted this to simply be a he lied to me, wahwahwah!!!!!!, post I would have taken the refund and ran. These type of gouging practices have to stop.
5-10 gold visiting fee is reasonable, 1 gold is very reasonable :D 100 gold...well........................
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Bullshit you say?
Tricking people with similar words and getting away with it is what you do.
who is the true bandit.
Yes, I say bullshit. :wink:
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Yes, I say bullshit. :wink:
Do something, deny after and say it bullshit when someone tell what you have done.
gj :wink:
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oh my... DRZ are a bunch of neo-liberal free market capitalists!
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OMG, SI love youong you are mad
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Nah i'm just happy i stayed only in cities in your area :twisted:
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lol, people should check themselves when entering a fief that is owned by clans, thats just old common knowledge ^^
count yourself damn lucky, that DRZ wants to refund your loss, not everyone would be willing to do this.
hopefully when all fiefs have been taken, there will be enough clans that will open their villages for a doable fee and tax.
i'm sure that DRZ will also do this on a couple of their fiefs, once they have arranged things for their own people first and have an overview of things, with this many fiefs, it's only logical for extra profit 8-)
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The problem is also if you travel for a far distant village, you may arrive there during night. So you wont be able to check the fee until next morning, where you already lost a lot of money. Kinda sad. :|
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u can always ask a clan about the fee's and taxes beforehand, if it dosn't suit you, u just move to the fief without hitting the enter link or just enter a clanless fief nearby.
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It was not clear in DRZ's Free area trade post, but that was implied, they didn't try to lure or scam ppl.
Only problem i see, is when you travel at night, so if you want to trade in DRZ area just make your stop only in towns.
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Nah i'm just happy i stayed only in cities in your area :twisted:
:Dlol :D
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In soviet trading zone, DRZ tax u!
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u can always ask a clan about the fee's and taxes beforehand, if it dosn't suit you, u just move to the fief without hitting the enter link or just enter a clanless fief nearby.
With puny neutral fief defenses there won't be many clan-less fiefs very soon.
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With puny neutral fief defenses there won't be many clan-less fiefs very soon.
castles, cities :wink:
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mandible, come to mazigh village please i will refund your money/troops (sorry for delay, its all Skyrim :))) ) (mazigh fee is set to 1 at the moment, so you won't lose anytying there)
1. You don't have to stay in castles in towns if you don't want to. Because in our lands no one will attack you if u outside the fief. If they do, we'll attack them.
2. No one can pressure a faction in lowering visiting fee really, specially if Faction make very little ammount of money on trading tax. We not really bothered if someone sell in our lands right now.
Enjoy whatever we offer now because this may end at some point. If it will have a lot of problems having a free trading area, we may close borders. :)
PS: Unlike FCC we haven't attacked any caravans, who didn't ask for permission to enter our lands. )) We even see one FCC member in middle of our territories doing nothing but spying, and we didn't attack him -- yet-- after all the trolling they been doing here :)
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Baldric is akf due to skyrim......... No evil plot there.... Just the demise of strat as we know it.
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Damn, I was wondering where he went. Hasn't played cRPG in weeks from looking at his strategus godl count.
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hehe, he got teleported to us, moved a bit and stopped for some reason :) so not total afk...
we'll see, should kick him again in a week
for now we'll bring him some food a blankets
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hehe, he got teleported to us, moved a bit and stopped for some reason :) so not total afk...
we'll see, should kick him again in a week
for now we'll bring him some food a blankets
Seems strange he wouldn't get teleported to NA side of map, like how we originally spawned when strategus first came out. His moving just at the start was probably because he had a movement set when he was attacked and it completed once he was no longer under attack (i.e. 3000 meters to the left) as if he had been active he would have set it back for our lands. Oh well, Skyrim claims another victim.
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We do not send spies across the EU/NA invisawall. Not worth the effort.. We are tyring to pretend your side does not exist.
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:)) it was more of a joke about spy, he just not doing anything and not in great position, not going into fiefs
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_trade_zone
Your "zone" is tariff heavy, protectionist racket. Not even a handful are open markets.
Its a joke. Its not a "free trade zone" that's more spin than Warney!
If you want a real free trade zone you need to drop some of your fiefs taxes and what not down to the lvl of NPC controlled fiefs, and reap the benefit of people then moving to your other fiefs to sell the goods on. You've got it all arse backwards.
Make money of the boost in productivity in the region. If you are relying on people trekking in then its a bad long term, and short term plan.
Remove all the tariffs and taxes from Mit Nun, Tamnuh and Mawiti. You will gain a huge amount in revenue from all the internal trade in region. Its what china did and look at how they are going!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Economic_Zones_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_trade_zone
Your "zone" is tariff heavy, protectionist racket. Not even a handful are open markets.
Its a joke. Its not a "free trade zone" that's more spin than Warney!
If you want a real free trade zone you need to drop some of your fiefs taxes and what not down to the lvl of NPC controlled fiefs, and reap the benefit of people then moving to your other fiefs to sell the goods on. You've got it all arse backwards.
Make money of the boost in productivity in the region. If you are relying on people trekking in then its a bad long term, and short term plan.
Remove all the tariffs and taxes from Mit Nun, Tamnuh and Mawiti. You will gain a huge amount in revenue from all the internal trade in region. Its what china did and look at how they are going!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Economic_Zones_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China
You missed something in fief management, there is absolutely no interest for DRZ to have tons of players in their fief, that will drop down the productivity, meaning they will make less profit. So in the long term it's a better tactic as you can regulate the number of player in fief.
It's a free trade area because anyone can come and be protected by DRZ, which is different from FCC land (for example), you have to warn them or you are attacked.