Author Topic: Other Worthy Games?  (Read 14684 times)

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Offline SalmonGod

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #30 on: January 14, 2011, 06:40:03 pm »
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(click to show/hide)

Also, The Tale of Baldedgilds (log of my current fortress).

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=71025.msg1730441#msg1730441
« Last Edit: January 14, 2011, 06:48:23 pm by SalmonGod »

Offline Gorath

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #31 on: January 14, 2011, 07:11:53 pm »
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I still feel pretty clueless about Dwarf Fortress, which everyone always raves about.

I mean I get that gameplay > graphics but:
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I still don't see the appeal.  I may have to give it a try but wtf is the game even about?

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Just hard to get sold on a game when the screenshots look like something I was playing back on the old T.I. cartridge based home computer in the mid-80's.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2011, 07:15:26 pm by Gorath »
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Offline Erika_Furudo

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #32 on: January 14, 2011, 07:20:19 pm »
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There is a mod that gives it color tiles instead

Offline Dunecat

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #33 on: January 14, 2011, 07:45:44 pm »
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I still feel pretty clueless about Dwarf Fortress, which everyone always raves about.

I mean I get that gameplay > graphics but:
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I still don't see the appeal.  I may have to give it a try but wtf is the game even about?

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


Just hard to get sold on a game when the screenshots look like something I was playing back on the old T.I. cartridge based home computer in the mid-80's.
Get a tileset from Dwarf Wiki.
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Offline Mamachew

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #34 on: January 14, 2011, 08:14:09 pm »
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I would add if you want to stick with the medieval theme and like/don't mind RTS:

Stronghold: Crusader

Yes it's an old game, but you have so much you can do! Look it up, it isn't a hard game to find.
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Offline Dunecat

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #35 on: January 14, 2011, 08:29:01 pm »
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I would add if you want to stick with the medieval theme and like/don't mind RTS:

Stronghold: Crusader

Yes it's an old game, but you have so much you can do! Look it up, it isn't a hard game to find.
The last time I played it, it congratulated me with a Christmass.
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Offline SalmonGod

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #36 on: January 14, 2011, 08:29:47 pm »
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Graphic tilesets help.  There are also a couple more advanced visualizers that are less for gameplay and more for viewing your fortress landscape in actual 3d, which is really nice.

The appeal in Dwarf Fortress is the vast range of possible game experiences -- near infinite -- due to procedural generation and limitless possible playstyles.  Advanced graphics for the game are nearly impossible or wouldn't do the game justice due to the detail in which randomly generated events are described.  I swear in one fight, I was told that an enemy axe swing severed the hair from a dwarf's left thumb.

Some people play it to build impressive architectural projects.  Some play it for the !!science!! exploration of its deeper game mechanics, such as the physics engine (things like building magma cannons or computational devices).  Others play it purely for the epic combat. 

Personally, I play it for the deep emergent narrative, as you can see from reading mine or any of the other famous LP's.  The events are so interesting and varied, and the game offers you an impressive amount of description of everything that happens while leaving you enough blank space to fill in on your own that you can take these building blocks and make them into a cohesive story.  Every creature has its own unique detailed personality and physique, which has actual consequences on gameplay, and its own psychological and physical needs which make for tons of interesting situations.  Not to mention every world is generated from scratch, from geological systems based on real life to the political interactions of civilizations built by intelligent creatures over time.

Just read the first few posts in The Tale of Baldedgilds.  Everything I describe actually happened in the game.  I cut out some unnecessary details and altered others slightly for cohesion.  The dialogue I completely made up, as there is none actually in the game.  Everything else actually happened in the game according to random generation.  There was an epic, bare-fisted battle with two gargoyles.  One of my dwarves did start a massive grass-fire that burned the entire landscape to ashes in the midst of this battle.  One of those gargoyles really woke up suddenly from unconsciousness and ripped the guts out of one of my dwarves with its teeth before succumbing to death.  That dwarf happened to be Pillarmarket's only friend, and she flew into a berserker rage from the grief and beat two of her injured companions to death.  Even the means of death are accurately translated from the game.  Pillarmarket's two victims actually died of suffocation as one had his lungs ripped apart as his rib cage shattered into them, and the other had her throat punched in.  Dwarf Fortress has no HP system, as it actually simulates the bodily functions of its creatures, including every layer of tissue, blood flow, breathing, etc.  The only ways a creature dies are from blood loss, suffocation, starvation, dehydration, disease, or brain damage.

Edit:

I admit, though, it's really hard to get into at first.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2011, 08:35:14 pm by SalmonGod »

Offline Ishar

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #37 on: January 14, 2011, 09:02:04 pm »
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I once tried Dwarf Fortress, but couldn't even control it. OK, the game is so complex, no graphics could handle the depth. Still, we're talking about '80s controls. Surely there would be a BIT more user-friendly option.
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Offline SalmonGod

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #38 on: January 14, 2011, 09:08:07 pm »
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I once tried Dwarf Fortress, but couldn't even control it. OK, the game is so complex, no graphics could handle the depth. Still, we're talking about '80s controls. Surely there would be a BIT more user-friendly option.

Yeah, the interface is pretty bad.  It's the main obstacle, not the graphics.  The game is still technically in alpha.  The developer is focusing on adding features, and doesn't want to overhaul interface or related things until the game is more complete.  It's understandable, considering the needs of the interface and such will change with the feature set.  It doesn't make much sense to put too much effort into them at this point.

There are some tools that make things much easier.  Dwarf Therapist is a must have, for instance.  It takes all of the dwarf labor management into a separate app and allows you to view most things about them also.

Offline Food

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #39 on: January 14, 2011, 10:54:06 pm »
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Stop trolling and/or ignore poorly written walkthrough labeled as "novel". If you to know what's it about, experience the original, play the game.
i have 'played' it plenty of times, its more like reading a novel than actually playing a game though.  a really good interactive novel.

X3 best game ever still, I wish I could describe it well enough without sperging out for ten thousand words


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNkeC8aWk8s&feature=fvst     this might help.  this is just the combat.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2011, 11:02:19 pm by Food »
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Offline Ishar

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #40 on: January 14, 2011, 11:14:47 pm »
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Also, The Tale of Baldedgilds (log of my current fortress).

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=71025.msg1730441#msg1730441

I enjoy reading Dwarf Fortress stories like this far more than the actual game. The controls could sure use a hug... the developer can add literally limitless features to it (honestly, there's no reason to stop at space travel), but it's still a pain in the ass to play. With even a little basic post-1990 interface, it could be the world's best game ever. Keep the descriptions: that worked well for Fallout 1-2 for example, but lose the fuckin ASCII interface, give me some 2D pixels and a mouse pointer!

As it is now, it's too frustrating for me to try again.
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Offline SalmonGod

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #41 on: January 14, 2011, 11:30:48 pm »
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but lose the fuckin ASCII interface, give me some 2D pixels and a mouse pointer!

This much can be done.  There's a mod that attempts to make more of the interface interactive with the mouse, and there are plenty of 2d graphic tilesets.  Of course that doesn't make the interface better organized and the visuals are still pretty abstract.  It's definitely not a game for anybody.

Improvements will be made, though.  In about a month, he claims he's going to dedicate a release just to big-fixes and playability.  And he does have a limited set of features planned that will eventually be finished.

Offline Ishar

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #42 on: January 15, 2011, 12:40:20 am »
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I don't care much for graphics (Warband isn't exactly COD Black Ops either), so if the GUI becomes actually better than my worst nightmare, I'll give it another shot.

Yeah, I tried it with a tileset, but that's just a graphic improvement, doesn't change the way you control the game, and that's what's messed up.
"Also, thank you for reporting your own post." Mylet

Offline Guduk

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #43 on: January 15, 2011, 11:52:14 pm »
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All the other computer games bow before Planescape: Torment.

This guy knows what he's talking about.

Offline Michael

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Re: Other Worthy Games?
« Reply #44 on: January 16, 2011, 12:02:48 am »
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How could i forget that game >_<

No idea. How did you dare? The developers are semi-gods for me.

If I had the money I would make a movie with that stuff - that would rock!

All those NPCs, Nines, Beckett, LaCroix, they are so awesome, its a shame really that Troika is no more.

But this is only another proof that quality alone is not enough. =(
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