Why Polearms stab so much faster than 2h swords???

[mulas]

This is completely bullcrap. Why did they nerf 2h stab speed so much, my close range stab bounce, at longer range, people saw it coming a mile away and block easy. And people with pikes can just stab the ground at close range and hit me, even stab through wall. They stab so fast that I can't even block after the 1st stab, and my ping is usually less than 35.

Now polearms are not only longer but stab faster and works at close range too.

The whole point of having a long weapon is for its reach, hence stabbing, the 2h swords stab speed nerf was completely unnecessary. If the devs going to keep it, might as well nerf polearms stab speed too.

I demand changes!!! (raises fist)

edit: Oh, I forgot to mention the huge stab damage NERF for 2h swords as well, WTF!!! I swear the devs are a bunch of 2h haters...

[Renay]

I think 2h stab is fair as it is, but polearm should be slightly slower, but still faster than 2h

[BlackMilk]

You are so right!
A poleaxe does 31p stab damage and the stab of it is way faster than a slash of a GS its so ridiculous.

[Blueberry Muffin]

Polearms and 2handers are balanced imo. Although polearm has a longer list of good points, 2h is still just as good. Polearms are sod easy to block. If you cant block a stab, its your own fault. Polearms are very obvious as to their dierction of an attack due to their length etc. If you boil it down 2h is good because you can manage to distort your avatars body into impossible shapes, while attacking. I switched onto 2h on my alt and i have less problems with tough opponents because I found how to throw a few spins and mislead them into blocking the wrong direction. Swinging though walls doesnt happen exclusively with polearms so that point is invalid.

After spamming a LHB like a pro for a long time(and you eu guys know how profficient i was with that) and now trying 2h, I personally find them equal. No nerfs needed imo. Its not an opinion with much support and I think most people will agree with you mulas, but hey, its just my 2 cents.

[Kung Fu Jesus]

I'm trying to understand pike stab. You'd think it would be so simple to downblock constantly but for some reason, they seem to get me before I can complete the block. It almost looks like the damage registers before the pike visually hits me. And they are so damn long, I can't even close the distance to hit the enemy.

[Renay]

i think pike is easy to block, just poleaxe has an unfair stab

[zagibu]

Polearms having the better stab than 2h is not ridiculous, it's realistic and also good for balance.

[mulas]

Polearms having the better stab than 2h is not ridiculous, it's realistic and also good for balance.

HAHA, you call that a rebuttal? lame

[Cyclopsided]

The animations take the same time for both pole arm and 2h.

2h has more reach on a thrust, but less damage. Animation is less fluid and all at once but with a delay. This means you can get the first hit in a fight by having the longer range.
Pole arms have less effective reach but more damage. Animation is more fluid but cuts a lot of effective length off the weapon due to the way it is held.

When a thrust is blocked, the attacker's weapon and himself is stunned for a very long time in which they can not attack or block again for a split second. This duration is increased when weapon speeds are slower. In the case of a pike (the thrust only ultra slow one), the stun is so long that you can actually overhead them before their character is un-stunned and get a free hit on them.

Thrusts glance close range for everyone. The longer the duration you thrust in the animation before it hits, the more damage and therefor less likelihood of glancing. Pointblank thrusts always glance with both types. Turn into your stabs and you'll never glance with your 2h. Higher base damage and shorter weapon length lessen glance likelihood.

Have fun!
P.S. It is balanced.

[Dezilagel]

The animations take the same time for both pole arm and 2h.

2h has more reach on a thrust, but less damage. Animation is less fluid and all at once but with a delay. This means you can get the first hit in a fight by having the longer range.
Pole arms have less effective reach but more damage. Animation is more fluid but cuts a lot of effective length off the weapon due to the way it is held.

When a thrust is blocked, the attacker's weapon and himself is stunned for a very long time in which they can not attack or block again for a split second. This duration is increased when weapon speeds are slower. In the case of a pike (the thrust only ultra slow one), the stun is so long that you can actually overhead them before their character is un-stunned and get a free hit on them.

Thrusts glance close range for everyone. The longer the duration you thrust in the animation before it hits, the more damage and therefor less likelihood of glancing. Pointblank thrusts always glance with both types. Turn into your stabs and you'll never glance with your 2h. Higher base damage and shorter weapon length lessen glance likelihood.

Have fun!
P.S. It is balanced.

This really.
Although I would like to see someone soften up the 2h stab animation abit, I do think it is balanced atm. Used correctly, the massive length of the 2h stab really allows you to control the fight (esp. in duels), combine that with the ability to turn your stabs (and feinting) and you can confuse the heck out of people aswell.

And it makes sense really, the superior range of the 2h stab is superior in 1v1 combat while the higher damage of the pole stab makes it better for group combat.

Reposted a thousand times, these are the effective ranges for all the weapon types while using the different attacks (A German Poleaxe overhead, for example, would have an effective reach of 131-15=116)

1h
Overhead = +0
Left-to-right = +0
Right-to-left = +19
Thrust = +61

2h
Overhead = +15
Left-to-right = +17
Right-to-left = +13
Thrust = +80

2h Polearms
Overhead = -15
Left-to-right = -7
Right-to-left = -2
Thrust = +19

1h Polearms
Thrust = +50


(+as a sidenote, remove the stupid polestun already  )

[Camaris]

I am playing with a MW Greatsword atm and i have to admit that i kill horrendous amounts of enemys with the stab.
I guess that is ok because it is (together with the GGS) the best 2-Hand stabber.
The stab is perfect if you fight in a group to help your mates and hit enemys not seeing you. In 1on1 you are better
with sideswings and only occasional use of your stab ;)

I dont think polearmstab is too fast or to strong either. I have no problem with it and only very few players handle it very good
so you cant see it coming from miles.

[mulas]

The stab speed of 2h was nerfed, it is much slower than before patch. That's a given. The stab speed of pole arm remain the same.
The stab speed of polearms currently are faster than 2h, the stab damage of polearm are higher than 2h, those are facts.

You cannot argue facts. Thanks.
Now please come up with something better.

[Dezilagel]

The stab speed of 2h was nerfed, it is much slower than before patch. That's a given. The stab speed of pole arm remain the same.
The stab speed of polearms currently are faster than 2h, the stab damage of polearm are higher than 2h, those are facts.

You cannot argue facts. Thanks.
Now please come up with something better.

Oh cmon, if you didn't want a discussion then you should have never started a thread in the first place.

If you had read actually read the thread you would have seen that no, polearm stab is not faster than 2h (there was a REASON for the nerf), and that there are REASONS for polestab having higher damage. (Length!)

READ what people have written ffs! Some of these guys have WAY more experience with this game than both you and I, and blatantly just ignoring everyones' opinion in favour of whining cause you can't do ridiculus lolstabs anymore is not going to lead to anyone listening to you but the most devoted lobbyists (even if your opinion might be valid!).

Now: I agree that 2h stab animation should be smoother, I agree that pikes stabbing from facehug distance is abit stupid, but I do not agree to some senseless "waah-waah op polestab" unless you are willing to lead a discussion (which is what an op should do!) to prove your point.

(click to show/hide)

@renay; @blackmilk: I see I have managed to piss some ppl off  Excellent...

[Renay]

Well, you gotta admit, poleaxe stab is a little bit fast, Dezi

[Dezilagel]

Well, you gotta admit, poleaxe stab is a little bit fast, Dezi

Well, as marathon posted the actual animations are equal in time, but I think what makes the poles seem faster is the fact that their animation is smooth, while the 2h one is more of a small delay then fast stab. (allowing poles to hit with force earlier in the animation).

Therefore I proposed the 2h stab to be smoothened instead of poles slowed, since slowing down stabs even more would make them riskier than they already are (stabbing nets you a nice stun if blocked), and slowing down gamespeed is not what I would like to see atleast :p