the deve wipe?

[zottlmarsch]

I appreciate all your work Prof, but this is a shitty milketoast fence-sitting solution that fixes nothing. I agree with Kratos, if you're serious about a wipe it's all or nothing imo.

Pretty much this.

[Jona]

One of the (many) problems with a full wipe at this point is (NA) strat is still somehow going decently strong, and the quickest way to remove that small incentive to play is to give everyone playing strat a level 1 character. Sure, you'll inevitably have some nerds grind up to a high level again in no time, but you'll have plenty of others who only participate in strat battles remain stuck at a low level for far longer, living off strat xp only (and they're far more likely to just leave once they have to grind again).

[//saxon]

make a Royale server

[RD_Professor]

let me go into a bit more depth on my hesitancy to wipe and why i'm proposing this fence-fuckin' idea.

first off, i have deleted all my characters and progress before and restarted from scratch, on several occasions. the reasons why are irrelevant, but i don't have very close ties to the stuff i've got from grinding. however, there are some who do have close ties, and a wipe would destroy their desire to play the game. and as far as i can tell, this is a significant portion of the population. i recall that polls put wipe/no wipe fair dead even in terms of popularity. wiping runs the risk of completely alienating this portion of the population. right now, losing a couple players isn't good, and losing a large chunk is definitely bad. even if you are a person who is pro-wipe, you gotta understand that others out there attribute lots of sentimental value to their hard-grinded equipment. i wouldn't really care if my equipment got reset, but i know that there are quite a few players who would. that's why i don't want to take the path of a full wipe. also chadz said there would be no wipes i can't go against his will, all praise chadz

so then why do this halfway idea if i don't like the idea of wiping? well, not wiping is a poor solution also. sadly, this game is almost a decade old, and a wipe could breathe life into it once more. right now, there just isn't much reason to grind, for most players, and wiping could restore that desire. others have gone into more detail, but that's some of the basic reasoning behind why a wipe is a good idea. and those reason are totally valid!

this is the issue, you have valid reasons on both sides, for wiping or against wiping. at the same time, you have reasons why doing one or the other would not be a good idea, and could seriously harm the mod population. fucked if you do, fucked if you don't. and that's why i'd proposed the solution that does both. before i explain why the player population split might not be too bad, i'm going to talk about my thoughts on testing out a wipe.

it's been proposed that we could do a test wipe, revert the database back if things go poorly. or we could massively increase the pace of grinding so that those with a lot of looms could get them back quickly. ideally, this should satisfy those against the wipe because they could get their equipment back quickly. however, i don't think this is the case. now, i could be entirely wrong, but to my understanding the opposition to wiping for most isn't born out of aversion to going through the grind again, it stems from not wanting to see all their hard work go to waste. and with this test wipe idea, even if it is reverted back, or even if rewards are high, these players will still lose all of their equipment, and see their hard work destroyed. there's no getting around this fact if a full wipe is implemented. as for reasons stated before, it's likely that losing this would be enough to lead them to quit.

given that there have been, what, 5 threads or so in the past week, this is a pretty heated topic to be sure. we've all sunk years into this game, and tend to have fairly entrenched opinions. if i were to choose one side and do it fully, there would be many, many upset players, some of which might leave. that's not a good course of action. and thus my fence fucking idea was born.

now, i don't think this idea would split player population. just because a player is anti-wipe does not necessarily mean that the player will be unwilling to play on a wiped server. i am having difficulty articulating this, so it would probably be best answered by someone who opposes wiping. (please someone anti-wipe let us know if you'd play on a wipe server)
essentially, even if this does split the population, with little influx of players, then these wipe servers can be shut down. (which is a argument for the test wipe) but, unlike the test wipe, no progress will be erased at all, players will just have the option of whether they want to experience the wipe or not

yes, it's not a perfect idea, there are issues with it, but i wholeheartedly believe that it's a better option than implementing a full wipe, or not wiping at all. the thing is, right now, we don't really know how many players would come back if a wipe happened. i think that this is a good way to test and see without causing any current players to quit

have fun reading that. it's very coherent


oh. besides the point, the wipe issue is the hot topic of the week, so i figured i'd actually reveal my plans and ideas for once to yall. implementation of this would be down the road a fair deal, and in the meantime i'll be looking into other options to spice up the mod. (that is once pseudonyms are fixed)

[Sniger]

i think this is a good idea. both camps sort of get their way and we can see what solution is best to gain player numbers.

[Jona]

now, i could be entirely wrong, but to my understanding the opposition to wiping for most isn't born out of aversion to going through the grind again, it stems from not wanting to see all their hard work go to waste.

Nah, at least in my case, I'm only against a wipe because I never want to have to grind again. Surely there are at least a couple others in the same boat. People have grown up, we don't all have nearly infinite free time anymore to waste on a grind and just want to hop in the servers and enjoy the crpg we've come to love, at a high (or at least competitive) level. Playing as a low level peasant is far from fun for plenty of people, especially when you play so infrequently that it'd take months for you just to get up close to the retirement level.

[Dalhi]

Nah, at least in my case, I'm only against a wipe because I never want to have to grind again. Surely there are at least a couple others in the same boat. People have grown up, we don't all have nearly infinite free time anymore to waste on a grind and just want to hop in the servers and enjoy the crpg we've come to love, at a high (or at least competitive) level. Playing as a low level peasant is far from fun for plenty of people, especially when you play so infrequently that it'd take months for you just to get up close to the retirement level.

That is why it is proposed to raise starting level to something playable (lvl 30 would be nice) from the start, it's 2018 I doubt if peasant wars are that much desired, and I doubt if there will be much looms around. Still some basic mechanics would need rethinking, starting from xp/gold gain system, to some other minor stuff like decreased looms rank, and some other annoying (at least for me and actually for quite a lot of guys judging by the comments in game chat) things like rain and fog occurance and night time. That would most likely some experienced with warband module system volunture to help Professor.
At the same time I don't think that future attempts to balance the game by playing around with item stats and other fancy functions are that much needed, if you look in past all what it did was leaving some directly touched with the changes leave the game.

Keeping two databases running alongside might be reasonable solution after all, at least for time, need some advertising and an announcemt before it happen and coupled with another strat reset (.

[Gnjus]

but if you don't wipe, you run the chance of game slowly dying out completely

It already died out. There's more life in your average Krem's brains than in cRPG right now and they're absolutely brain-dead.

[Gnjus]

however, there are some who do have close ties, and a wipe would destroy their desire to play the game. and as far as i can tell, this is a significant portion of the population.

So why aren't they playing their precious characters ? You surely don't mean its those 20 or so oddballs playing DTV ? They shouldn't even count as "population". 

Your logic is all fine but it doesn't work on empty realm. 

I hate to repeat myself but: http://forum.melee.org/the-chamber-of-tears/c-rpg-pro-database-wipe-assembly-(no-polls-written-opinions-)/msg1260318/#msg1260318

 

[emirso2]

NA has been gaining players, only EU is dead. Why wipe everything because EU players are crybabies that refuse to play?

NA is used to dead/near-dead player activity. I would really like to know the statistics regarding this "gaining players" "so much alive lel" attitude.

This situation is closely similar to the fate of progressive struggles in underdeveloped countries with near-half of the population(sadly, as the EU is dead, NA opinions suddenly started to matter as 'half') is against the progressive idea, as they are used to shitty standards and they saw nothing more than their shitty standards all their lives, so they are unable to/unwilling to understand the need for such measures which would probably result in a better future for all parts of the community. (e.g. mod being alive again.)


anyways thats just what i see

-written by Anani

[Panos_]

Whatever you do, do it fast please.

Today I installed Mercs mod, which is total shit....

[the real god emperor]

You have to consider the fact that many people that were anti wipe are now pro wipe since the polls we held because they have seen the progress of the mod. I am aware of the fact that some people are against it and I can surely see why, but the seperate server IMHO isnt the common denominator we are looking for. I am uncertain on whether if it would work or not, but can't understand dividing the community while fearing to lose the community by doing a full wipe. 2 servers with 10 people is as bad as one server with 10 people imo.
Of course the aim is to make everyone happy, but if the wipe server becomes are grand success, will we consider wiping ot altogether or have the same dilemma over and over?

Imo Oberyn's idea is the best we can do in this case, which was pretty basic. Just backup everything and wipe, if it turns out to be a disaster, say oops and roll back, if it doesn't which it  most probably won't, it's a win.

[Asheram]

Jeez you give an option to have a server for wipe chars only and it still isnt good enough for some and people still just want to nuke other peoples stuff. what a bunch of lobsters, one trys to escape and others pull it back in.

[Blackbow]

Sound like a good idea to make everybody happy, but that will just split a dead community...

but imo make a full wipe try/test, see if people come back and if not just roll back our old chars
or just let the mod die... i see the mod like an old woman you try to reanimate with defibrilator but she lived enough and just want to pass out...

atleast thx for trying

[Grytviken]

New wipe characters should have exclusive access to new clans, strat, new market, events, lp sales, exchanges, tournaments etc, but you should still allow stubborn people who don't agree with the wipe to old friend around on their old characters on the same server if they want, they just won't be able to interact with the new market, banner stack, trade with new characters, inflate or ruin the economy etc.

(click to show/hide)

Also you should invert stats to have the same values but not the same requirements so old chars can't drop a bunch of weapons on the ground  to sabotage the game.