Weapon Difficulty and PS

[The Wicked Reach]

For bows, the max PD is determined by +4 skill points above the difficulty of the bow you're using.  For example, my bow is lvl 4 difficulty, so the most PD I should bother getting is 8 pts.

Does this translate to 1h or 2h?  I have a lvl 7 difficulty mace, is there a PS skill point amount at which the damage doesn't increase?

Another question: is PS limited by wpf?  Will 10 PS work if I have 0 wpf?

[Screaming Idiot]

Don't quote me on this, but I believe the mechanics for PS are different from PD. First off, melee weapons are only restricted by the amount of STR required to use them, which contributes to the weapon's attack power in of itself. As a result of having a non-skill-based requirement, PS is just a statistical increase of the damage weapons do. Something of note is that PS is especially effective when used with bladed weapons who otherwise struggle to not glance against armor stronger than light mail. There's a breaking point for PS as there is for PD, but I believe it depends more on the weight and damage type of the weapon rather than a variable related to it's STR requirement, altering the weapons effect much more (or less) compared to bows. For instance: increasing PS above 8 or so will not benefit smaller weapons (1h, small 2h/pole) but larger weapons will have more rewarding returns in comparison (large 2h/large poles).
As I stated above, I have no specific statistics to back this up, but generally speaking having PS at 7 or above is good for any melee class, with ranged classes affording to go to around 5 plus or minus two depending on their WPF, skill/attribute min/max and weapon of choice (1h mace vs. small 1h vs. large 1h).

EDIT: Regarding your 2nd question, I believe that PS does work regardless of WPF, but its effects are diminished due to WPF's damage and speed increasing properties (if the equation for calculating damage were to be [base weapon damage X STR variable X WPF variable X PS variable = actual weapon damage])

[Utrakil]

efective PS is not limited by weapondifficulty.

About the WPF this might help you.

Melee damage
Damage before armor is calculated by:
Code: [Select]

hold_bonus * (WPF*0.01*0.15+0.85)*(power_strike*0.08+1.0)+strength/5.0


Implications:
- Each power strike point is 8% extra damage
- 10 wpf is equal to 1.5% damage. You have a 15% damage penalty at 0 wpf compared to base weapon damage. At 100 wpf there is no penalty or bonus to damage.
- 5 strength gives 1 damage that isn't affected by modifiers.
- Holding your melee strike before releasing it gives you a damage bonus.
--> Holding for less than 0.5 seconds gives you a damage bonus of 5% per 0.1 seconds.
--> Holding for 0.5 to 0.6 seconds gives you a 25% damage bonus
--> After 0.6 seconds the damage bonus will diminish 3% per 0.1 seconds until it's 10% after 1.1 seconds of holding weapon down.
- If you use polearm with a shield or from horseback, you get -27.75% damage penalty
- If you use twohander with a shield or from horesback, you get -23.5% damage penalty if that twohander can be used with a shield (ie has onehander animations). If not, the penalty is -15%.
- Both cases above also have some sort of a speed penalty.

(Thanks to Tydeus for the exact mechanics of hold bonus and CaptainQuantum for the melee mechanics. They can be found also at http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,168722.msg4090900.html#msg4090900)

Quote comes from the splendit http://forum.melee.org/beginner's-help-and-guides/game-mechanic-megathread!/.

[Krave]

About 2hs on horseback, do longsword ( without shield ) have bigger penalty than, for example, two handed sword?

[Rhekimos]

About 2hs on horseback, do longsword ( without shield ) have bigger penalty than, for example, two handed sword?

The longsword and 2h weapons that you are able to also use with shield should get the least penalty to damage on horseback. It's less or equal.

[McKli_PL]

it depends on couple of factors: 1)its how u swing- with full animation and good footwork with good attack release on head u will do sick damage (kill or Ko)
2)how u spin- if u spinning like a whore wpf is not so important coz damage output is made from spin/attack release
3)how u abuse- if u have 0/7wpf with 'fast held attack'(0.30 sec max) every swing is a pure raw damage hit, it looks like normal spam attack but its bit slower and much harder to chamber

[BlueKnight]

For bows, the max PD is determined by +4 skill points above the difficulty of the bow you're using.  For example, my bow is lvl 4 difficulty, so the most PD I should bother getting is 8 pts
YES

Does this translate to 1h or 2h?  I have a lvl 7 difficulty mace, is there a PS skill point amount at which the damage doesn't increase?
I don't think so

Another question: is PS limited by wpf?  Will 10 PS work if I have 0 wpf?
PS is not limited by WPF, 10PS will work even with 1wpf, though it's super sub-optimal

About 2hs on horseback, do longsword ( without shield ) have bigger penalty than, for example, two handed sword?

Afaik, longsword has a penalty but two handed sword has a bigger penalty (on a horseback). It comes from the fact that longsword can be wielded with shield and two handed sword cannot, which classifies it under different 2h cathegory and different penalties are applied. I MAY BE TOTALLY WRONG THOUGH. (And yes, I'm considering here both weapons used without a shield from horseback).

[The Wicked Reach]

Thank you for your quick and punctilious responses guys, yet another reason to + this community.  This helps to confirm my presumptions.  Couple of comments:

- 10 wpf is equal to 1.5% damage. You have a 15% damage penalty at 0 wpf compared to base weapon damage. At 100 wpf there is no penalty or bonus to damage.

I think I can live with a 15% penalty as an archer, I'll just get another shot in or hold til the cavalry shows.

2)how u spin- if u spinning like a whore wpf is not so important coz damage output is made from spin/attack release

It makes sense that it would have an effect, but I don't see the spin factor in the formula Utrakil offered:

hold_bonus * (WPF*0.01*0.15+0.85)*(power_strike*0.08+1.0)+strength/5.0

[McKli_PL]

coz this game is crpg things on site/weapon stats are way different in real combat on server

[Utrakil]

coz this game is crpg things on site/weapon stats are way different in real combat on server

:
NO

[McKli_PL]

what No, like hand pavise shield with same stats (on site)than other shield while in game 'force field' on those shields were different or classic ghost range or animation breaking on unbalanced weapons, do u have it in formulas?(yea i know San's forumals quite good )

[BlueKnight]

Spinning doesn't affect the melee damage afaik (even though I used to believe that, but it's just not true). Speed bonus comes from horizontal movement towards or away from the enemy. ...also angles matter.

Don't spend too much thought on the formulas though. Experiment, and do things that seem to work best for you.

[Utrakil]

what No, like hand pavise shield with same stats (on site)than other shield while in game 'force field' on those shields were different or classic ghost range or animation breaking on unbalanced weapons, do u have it in formulas?(yea i know San's forumals quite good )

I think the problem is more on the animation side than on the stats side. Stats are numbers that are used for the calculations during combat. how could your calculation device mess that up? but sometimes the graphic or animation doesn't represent the stats propperly. like curved blades look curved but act straight. or shields look smaler/bigger than their stats are.
So for my understanding numbers can be trusted.

[McKli_PL]

hmmm im not saying that site stats are bad, im trying to explain to other player that things on 'paper' in this game are bit different, there are tons small little things in crpg that u can  expierience just by playing this game and its hard to find it on site or crpg forum or other formulas, crpg is crpg and the best way of learning something in this game is just by playing it not spending tons of time checking weaponor/armor stats on site.