Why are held strikes so good?

[Macropus]

So recently I thought a bit about that and found it quite interesting, although maybe it's just me being stupid.
Anyway, basically it's about the delayed strikes: when someone aims a blow and holds it like that, and when you somehow release your block, it hits you right then. Especially if you are a shielder, this is what people most often use against you.
So the question is, why does it work, well, not always, but so often? Why does it hit you exactly when you drop your block? What are the odds that in the time frame where you hold you block and your enemy holds his swing, your block-dropping and his attack are so simultaneous?

One might say "Well, that's easy. Your enemy just sees when you drop your block and hits you right there". But actually, and it's most noticeable with shielders, your enemy often strikes before he could even see your block dropped. Sometimes, visually, the hit goes straight through the shield because the shielder released his block a moment ago and the animation of shieldblock just didn't start fading, yet the hit is already coming.

So, what do you guys think, why does that happen?

My guess would be that it could be because a blocking player reacts when his enemy releases the hit, not the other way around. Like, you hold your block and enemy holds his attack, he waits for you and you wait for him, then at some point he just releases his attack, and in a kinda unconcious way you want to do something about it, so you release your block just to take some action when you actially should've just kept it.

[Jona]

Cuz humans are creatures of habit. We're too used to blocking the ever-present spam that we forget that all attacks don't come instantly.

[Senni__Ti]

Timing;

People expect an attack to take a certain amount of time, they expect to block it, then start their own attack.
Most of this is reflex/muscle memory based, as quite often it's incredibly quick.

The problem arises when someone holds for about the same amount of time it takes for the attack to release and hit. The opponent then proceeds to lower their block and attempt to swing; it's generally after they begin to swing the average response time kicks in, where they quickly try to cancel the attack and block (assuming they haven't been hit already).

Particularly effective against shields, as the time taken to go from an attack to a block is delayed; allowing a larger window for the holding swing to hit.

[Macropus]

Yep, what you guys say is totally true, but it only explains the small tiny holds.
What I was mostly referring to is a long-ass 1+ seconds held strikes though, when both parties realize it is a held strike and it's going to release at some point and they wait, yet it still hits right when the block is released.

[BlackxBird]

Erm, I do it like I move my body like I was going to swing, but I dont imo swing, like a bit afterwards, so ppl can't actually see if Im already swinging my weapon or if I was simply turning my body. I do ordinary not do it right from the beginning, like I move 2 times the same way, then the third I do it again, but release the hit later ;) And actually against shielders I have no idea what Im doing, but most fall for holdings pretty fast Oh and what Ive seen from other players that they do like a gay holding, look like retards while doing, then in the moment when they seem to be attackable they release their hits. Well, I tried that too and failed hard lol.

[Teeth]

Regarding the "especially if you are a shielder". Shieldblocks are not instant blocks, that is what shield speed is all about. So if you release your block for a single 1 ms, your vulnerable window is actually much longer when you have a slow shield.

Apart from that I think that you just remember it more if it happens, especially if you are starting to pay attention to it. A hit you block is instantly forgotten because it is normal, every time this happens you get frustrated and make a mental note of it.

[Macropus]

Regarding the "especially if you are a shielder". Shieldblocks are not instant blocks, that is what shield speed is all about. So if you release your block for a single 1 ms, your vulnerable window is actually much longer when you have a slow shield.

Yeah I know that, my point was just that you notice it more when you play as a shielder because people use such held strikes more often against you since normal feinting is close to useless anyway then.

Apart from that I think that you just remember it more if it happens, especially if you are starting to pay attention to it. A hit you block is instantly forgotten because it is normal, every time this happens you get frustrated and make a mental note of it.

That's probably the answer for me, although I did try to take that into consideration when I thought about how often is works and how often it doesn't. 

[ecorcheur_brokar]

I think it's the same mechanism than for archer support or horoscope. You never realize when you have a good archer support, an inacurrate horscope or a hit blocked, but when the archer th, your horscope is accurate or the timing of the hit was perfect, you notice it and remember it.

[Turkhammer]

Shielders should be able to stab under the shield without dropping it.  That's how the Roman legions worked.  And it worked well against barbarian wildmen.

[Macropus]

Shielders should be able to stab under the shield without dropping it.  That's how the Roman legions worked.  And it worked well against barbarian wildmen.

No, thanks.

[BlackxBird]

And my flamberge should cut through every shield, my longsword used from horse should allways onehit and my two handed warhammer should break everyones bones immediately.

Go reallife if u want realism.

[Grumbs]

How fast you hit depends on how much you move your character too, both the mouse side movement when you release and where you position your character. I find if I hold my attack I naturally put more effort into the swing phase since its 1 mouse action rather than 2 and there is less to think about and you know exactly when to do the other movements.

I think held attacks are a bit faster too anyway but that might be subjective

[Zeus_]

I just get bored when people hold their attack for 5+ seconds, then i let go and they attack as i try to swing on their attack-holding-ass, it works sometimes (on the people who are intensely holding) but it usually ends up in my head getting chopped off. 

[BlackxBird]

nah those who are long holding are mostly easy to spam/outreach within less than a second. Those who do yolo faints in the ground are the worst. Its like they dont see u at all, some of them even turn around and are like "let's go helicopter for 5 seconds" (RAS for example) and then u try to spam them and unfortunately they hit in the exact right moment without even seeing u and THEN Im like wtf.

[Tristan_of_Erzoth]

if someone is holding on you for that long just nudge them lmao