Modifying cRPG

[Nehvar]

I really don't want to get involved with the ongoing argument but I do feel the need to drop my opinion here.

Any third-party modification designed to give you an advantage over other players is cheating.  You don't need the developers to tell you this because it is common-sense.  I mean, seriously, we aren't little kids here...right?

[McKli_PL]

2H who was camping in a ->bush<-

its called 'banner trick' dont hide in a bush or unsolid cover, if pewpew is smart he will hs player veriiii fast

[Nightingale]

Its cheating. I'd rather have all modified textures gone (including heirloom pack) than have people running around with neon weapons and armor, transparent walls/bushes etc.

[Dupre]

Wtf

[Leshma]

Must admit I've done some modifying myself in recent years. Only to force daytime (doesn't work perfectly every time but helps). Not sure how to remove fog so I was stuck with it. Never was interested in seeing through walls, trees, bushes or glowing weapons. Did my "hack" because of health reasons, because cmp is stubborn mofo who won't listen even when something makes perfect sense for many, many people (such as option to remove horrible weather effect from Warband). Not that he is the only stubborn gamedev, those Star Citizen guys think smudge that simulates g forces is way to go. Another battle to be fought I guess

[Grumbs]

If there is a rule for it , its cheating. If there isnt any rule for it, anything goes.  Simple concept Oberyn.
If there isnt law, you cannot commit crime. If there isnt a rule, you cannot break them.

You don't need someone to tell you when something is morally wrong. Modifying game files that result in an ingame advantage is morally/ethically scummy. It doesn't need someone to tell you that and have it written in the rules. Not having it in the rules sucks, but "common sense" rule should be enough. There are unwritten rules everywhere in life. You can break them, but you don't because you know its not right.

If everyone is on the same page more or less though game mods are fine. If we agree X is fine and people adopt it as the norm, I don't see a problem with that

[Leshma]

About hiding in bushes. If I recall right (haven't played for some time), you can turn banners on both enemies and friendlies. WSE2 allows you to make friendly banners glow, which helps tell them apart. If you are capable of getting used to play like this, you'll always spot someone hiding in bushes and being hidden somewhere far away sniping. And that is not a cheat, just an option in cRPG ingame settings.

[Nightingale]

About hiding in bushes. If I recall right (haven't played for some time), you can turn banners on both enemies and friendlies. WSE2 allows you to make friendly banners glow, which helps tell them apart. If you are capable of getting used to play like this, you'll always spot someone hiding in bushes and being hidden somewhere far away sniping. And that is not a cheat, just an option in cRPG ingame settings.

I've always hated that change.

[Jambi]

I think modifying your game is also cheating but not all. Removing bushes, transparent walls, removing weather effects, in my oppinion is.
But i can see how modifying colours / crosshairs or boosting up sounds would help visual / hearing  impaired users, in acceptable proportions. Or simply to compensate and old game, by adding newer graphics for those that care about cosmetics. But this is my opinion based on thinking further then just myself.

By presenting the extremes in the poll it ends up being very misleading.

The opposite:
In example http://forum.melee.org/beginner's-help-and-guides/mods-compatible-with-crpg-%28updated-sticky%29/  complete with making horses sound louder etc.
A dedicated thread updated hardly a year ago for compatible mods for crpg. Upvoted many times, and been given good reviews by a couple of admins... not a single complaint. And even stickied the post.

Either make a very straight forward list, of what is and what is not "cheating" and present it to the donkey for a thumbs up. Or stop accusing/blaming people for "cheating" since they have modified files.

You don't need someone to tell you when something is morally wrong. Modifying game files that result in an ingame advantage is morally/ethically scummy. It doesn't need someone to tell you that and have it written in the rules. Not having it in the rules sucks, but "common sense" rule should be enough. There are unwritten rules everywhere in life. You can break them, but you don't because you know its not right.

If everyone is on the same page more or less though game mods are fine. If we agree X is fine and people adopt it as the norm, I don't see a problem with that

So why wasnt the "common sense" rule applied to the thread i linked, when it created and updated several times? Instead it was praised by many players /admins and stickied. If it was against the "common sense" rule, then i believe action would have been taken back then. You think the admins/devs totally missed out on "morally/ehtically scummy wrong" about this, or simply didnt think it was?
Its easy to use you're interpetation of the "common sense" rule in attempt to give you're statement more leverage, and ontop of that, it is only conflicting with the current fact presented.

*edit* nor does excessive typing in some fancy colour, for whatever reason.

[Havelle]

But i can see how modifying colours / crosshairs or boosting up sounds would help visual / hearing  impaired users, in acceptable proportions. Or simply to compensate and old game, by adding newer graphics for those that care about cosmetics. But this is my opinion based on thinking further then just myself.

I'm learning impaired, can I get an autoblock?

[Jambi]

I'm learning impaired, can I get an autoblock?

No, not in my opinion. You'l simply have to learn to play.. even if it takes a little longer

[Havelle]

No, not in my opinion. You'l simply have to learn to play.. even if it takes a little longer

But it would really help me enjoy the game as a gamer with a disability.

[Jambi]

I'm learning impaired, can I get an autoblock?

But it would really help me enjoy the game as a gamer with a disability.

Well, autoblockers have been banned in the past. I cannot tell you what you can and cannot do.
If you want to use an autoblock , its up to you. But i warned you

I suggest you ask around, we have alot of players that are learning impaired. Ask them how they deal with it.

Alas, i cannot help you here.


P.S. Things that automates gameplay functions is something entrirely diffrent then modifications. 

[Jambi]

I did recall a strange instance on a village map of you immediately running around a corner and headshotting a 2H who was camping in a bush, there's no way you would have been able to see him to aim that shot since he was completely covered by the bush texture.

It happened agian recently. I was chasing two players around the corner, one wearing a green tunic, and the other some matellic colored armor. When i went around the corner, i only noticed the one armored person still running. So i figured the guy in green must have been hiding somehwere. The bush in the corner of the two buildings was the most obvious hiding spot.
These hiding tactics happen alot in CRPG, you get used to them... almost automated to shoot at bushes when you seen someone gone missing. Or as such shooting at bushes when you just received a xbow bolt, and cant spot him, chances are they be hiding there.

Some good xbowers swap their armor around, according to the map they playing on. If you know someone wearing blue tunic on a water map, or green tunic on a bushy map, you will know most liekly where they are taking advantage of, and where they could be hiding.

[Leshma]

I think modifying your game is also cheating but not all. Removing bushes, transparent walls, removing weather effects, in my oppinion is.
But i can see how modifying colours / crosshairs or boosting up sounds would help visual / hearing  impaired users, in acceptable proportions.

Technically, that is the same. Walls, bushes, weather effects are visual clutter. They make it harder for you to see what you actually need to see. Same goes for hearing things.

This is very sensitive subject because it ultimately comes down to people. Different players do this for different reasons. For example, you might not be bothered by night time or weather effects but change weapon/projectile colours solely to gain an advantage because you are competitive player and that is only thing that matters to you. If you really don't mind weather effects in Warband that means few things: you play in very moderate sessions, not long enough to bother you, you have excellent sight/hearing which isn't bothered by low contrast and visual clutter. All things considered players like this are either rare or young. Very few older folks get to enjoy that perfect vision/hearing.

I'm not that old but my vision is moderately impaired. When you aren't able to see without aids, low contrast is a bitch. Which is exactly how night time in Warband works. There is no real night, it is just like someone drops contrast to low levels and lowers brightness also. You can try it on your monitor while on your desktop, same effect. Took me three years to get rid of that and I'm glad someone told me how to fix that bullshit.

People who change files to get advantage should be punished in some way. But not people who are trying to make their gaming experience bearable for longer periods than 20 minutes. Problem is, it is virtually impossible to know that.