Refugees "flooding" Europe !NEW POLL!

[Beauchamp]

Ok so there are many refugees coming to Europe at the moment. It is a big topic in our media, however I heard completely different stories about other countries (like people in lets say Sweden don't give a fuck and its not a topic there or completely opposite etc.).

I'd like to know what is the opinion of the people in other countries and what the real situation according to their "common sense" is?
I'll start with my country:


CZECH REPUBLIC

MEDIA
A huge topic in media, every day there is something (starting from some refugees going mental in Spain ending with woman from Sweden that comes to see his husband from Syria temporarily arrested in the Czech republic), its every day something.

GOVERNMENT
Does not agree with the quotas for accepting refugees set by European Union, but agreed to accept the number very close to the quota. But Czech government wants to choose the refugees themselves (preferably whole families, those that will more likely integrate - so probably rather Christians, rather higher educated people etc.)

PUBLIC OPINION
Bigger majority of people strongly disagrees with accepting any refugees, though there are people that would like to accept newcomers (the argument usually is - when we needed help in western Europe, we got it so we should help now. Argument against is - Czech immigrants were 1000times better than any terrorist muslim niggah coming to Europe ). Overall I'd say its 3:1 in favor of those against further integration. General feeling also is that the one on the EU borders or the one that fucked up (France bombing Lybia etc.) should solve their problems by themselves and our money won't be any part of it.

REAL SITUATION - MY OPINION
Almost nobody from refuges never ever heard about Czech Republic, we are in 99% just a transit country for those going to Germany or to Scandinavia. The best deal for us is just to let those immigrants through to Germany as easily as possible because they won't stay here anyways. Compared to France, Germany, Scandinavia, UK - nobody really wants to ask for visa here, there is NO refugee crisis in the Czech republic and there never will be unless we have 10 more Pavel Nedveds and we become extremely famous in Africa (which won't happen ^^)

Personally I'm not against accepting refugees, but I really prefer rather those that are able to integrate - in the case of late events I'd rather welcome people from Ukraine or lets say Syrian Christians than anybody else - and even in bigger numbers than our government wants if needed. So I'm kinda somewhere in the middle of those above mentioned opinions.

But the biggest problem I see are political parties that try to get influence on this topic, they are total morons without any exception and it is very probably, that their influence will grow significantly since there are many retards in my country that vote for them and that are afraid.

if you are total imbecile (like vovka), please ignore this thread, ty

POLL 01 - Refugees "flooding" Europe are

(click to show/hide)

Huge problem in my eurocountry 26 (15.6%)
Small problem in my eurocountry 18 (10.8%)
Not relevant problem in my eurocountry 8 (4.8%)

Help as many of them as possible 31 (18.6%)
Help only a few of them (aka "non muslims" only etc.) 15 (9%)
Send them all home 26 (15.6%)

I'm from Murica 20 (12%)
I just want to click somewhere 23 (13.8%)

POLL02 - What are you afraid of the most

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Aggressive Russian politics 6 (10%)
Breaking of the EU 6 (10%)
Economic crisis, lowering wages etc. 5 (8.3%)
Refugees flooding Europe 13 (21.7%)
Extremism and xenophobia leading to loosing my civil rights 13 (21.7%)
That I click wrong and I will fuck up this awesome poll 17 (28.3%)

POLL03 - Is there a good solution?

(click to show/hide)

Has no good solution, people are to many - 33 (43.4%)
Has a reasonable solution for both sides (if we try to find it) - 29 (38.2%)
I'm from Murica, I don't give a shit - 14 (18.4%)

POLL04 - Will the refugee crisis and related problems cause the end of EU?

(click to show/hide)

Yes - 6 (35.3%)
No - 5 (29.4%)
Don't know - 4 (23.5%)
I don't give a fuck - 2 (11.8%)

POLL05 - The biggest retard in this tread (aside of Vovka of course ) is:

(click to show/hide)

  Overdriven - 9 (12.2%)
Leshma - 8 (10.8%)
Beauchamp - 2 (2.7%)
Oberyn - 23 (31.1%)
One of the Americans - 21 (28.4%)
chadz - 11 (14.9%)

POLL06 - Have Paris attacks influenced your opinion towards refugees in a bad way?:

(click to show/hide)

No 32 (47.8%)
Yes, but very little 10 (14.9%)
Yes by a bit 6 (9%)
Yes quite a lot 6 (9%)
Yes it totally turned over my opinion 5 (7.5%)
I'm not from Europe so I won't fuck this poll 8 (11.9%)
Total Members Voted: 67

[Leshma]

Considering that huge portion of those refugees are coming through Serbia (Greece-Macedonia-Serbia-Hungary is the route they take), I can tell a thing or two based on what I saw with my own eyes.

Those people are predominantly young (around our age), many have families (women with babies or small children). They seem friendly, mostly coming from Syria and Kurdistan. They are fleeing their countries under pressure ISIS and Turkish bombings are putting on them. They are most likely muslim but not muslim enough, if you get my drift.

Now considering the fact I went through the same ordeal as a kid, I have nothing but empathy for them. Not expecting to see that among this community (mostly consisting of right wing nationalist lovers).

Serbia might be a shithole but has experience with refugees so they aren't treated bad while staying in here. My opinion is government is seeing this situation as an opportunity to get some EU money out of it, also to earn some extra points that will help their/our chances to become part of EU one day. On the other hand I'm seeing revolt in other slavic, eastern European countries but that is understandable, because last time they had to deal with homeless, fleeing people was during WWII.

[Beauchamp]

Are there actually more refugees coming now?

Or is it just bigger news when it happens?

about 800.000 refugees will get to germany in 2015 (prediction), which is 4 times more than in 2014

[Tibe]

I woundered how long it takes til a thread about it pops up.

Personally I feel empathy and resentment towards them. If i was in their shoes I would do the same. War has ripped their homes to sheds. But considering that I am not in their shoes, I consider them a threat. The fact is that there is nothing wrong with taking some immigrants in, who appear like good and useful people. If you take a bunch of them, they will end up in our streets and create massive social problems. Also as not much of a patriot, I think it would be wise to make certain they completely forget their own culture and entirely adapt to the culture of the country they will live in. Cause inevitably otherwise a massive conflict will ensue. I would ditch my culture for some other places where I have chosen to live. Call me a traitor if you must, but none of that will inevitably last forever anyway. Theres more important things to hold dear than culture and past heritage.

[Leshma]

Around 2000 refugees per day come to Serbia. FYROM (Macedonia) tried to hold them off but they had to back off after EU officials intervened. It is very noble of EU for trying to help those poor people, considering they are least at fault for what is happening. USA, oil-rich middle eastern kingdoms and Turkey are fully responsible for this situation, because they helped create ISIS. Russia and China aren't shy of selling  ISIS weapons. It is lucrative business for many parties around the world and at last it will fell on the back of those least involved in the conflict (Scandinavian countries).

If you take a bunch of them, they will end up in our streets and create massive social problems.

No, they will not. Very timid people, scared beyond belief but not panicking. They remind me cattle before slaughter... very few crimes recorded considering the volume of refugees. Your fears are completely unfounded and based on prejudice, which just means they haven't yet reached your country in bigger numbers.

[Daunt_Flockula]

Official figures say we have around 1 million of them in Turkey now. It is estimated, however, that the population is above 3 million. Especially in İstanbul, and I am not exaggerating, you will see one mother with a few kids around her every 10 meters you walk wherever you go. You will see the family covered in dirt and helplessly sitting in a corner. Some extending their hands for a few coins. Some obviously succumbed to despair and not even trying anymore.

Our snackbar population welcomed them once, calling them "our Muslim brothers in need". They were probably thinking just like Tardogan that we would eventually annex Syria and everything would be fine. Needless to say, that didn't happen. The well-off ones rented themselves fine homes in extremely conservative neighborhoods and have become businessmen favored by Islamic nepotism. The poor ones (the huge majority) have been dwelling in refugee camps. Most escaped and keep escaping, living miserable lives on the street. When it became totally obvious that they were here to stay, those former kind-hearted Muslims went nuts. They were the first ones to start openly resenting Syrians.

News which don't make it to the mainstream media include the women and young girls being forced into prostitution. There were also some cases where public lynches almost happened. One time it was because a Syrian guy was being accused of thievery and "putting the neighborhood's reputation to shame". Most people don't like seeing them around, because they believe they caused an inflation in rents. And that is also actually true, but not their fault. Opportunistic hyenas have indeed almost tripled rents, because Syrians come in big families with every member working at a low paying job. They have no choice but pay whatever is asked from them. In tourism venues, they are also not welcome due to obvious reasons (tourists don't like to see poverty explicitly displayed on the street).

Well, I don't want to go on and on. You get the idea. The lives of these people are fucked and they are not so welcome in the only place they thought they would be fine. The situation is way out of control and it was only a matter of time they would start flooding towards Europe.

[Tibe]

No, they will not. Very timid people, scared beyond belief but not panicking. They remind me cattle before slaughter... very few crimes recorded considering the volume of refugees. Your fears are completely unfounded and based on prejudice, which just means they haven't yet reached your country in bigger numbers.

Im not talking about crimes only. Im talking about things like homelessness, completely stuffed soupkitchens, no jobs, people freezing to death. Things like that. If a country is not prepared to take a bunch of people in at once(which most arent) all that will inevitably happen. Dont tell me before the immigrants you had food, jobs and shelter for all your people. Conqrats! Now you have even less to spare. And ofcourse they wont result to crimes the first years they are there. When they stop being shocked and inevitably discover that they cant make ends still, after years of trying, they will result to crime out of desperation.

Its not like if i lose everything, im instantly going to join a gang and do crimes. But if im living in total poverty for years and find that i have absolutely no other options, I will turn to it. Most people would aswell.

[Casul]

Austria:

MEDIA
Media is mainly "controlled" by the social-democratic SPÖ and the economy-christian-democratic-social (whatever) oriented ÖVP. (it should be balanced actually but the ÖVP and SPÖ are trying to exclude the right winged FPÖ)
Refugees are a big topic, biggest problems are the emergency accommodations such as unused sport halls, churches or tent camps anywhere in the middle of the city. They get dissolved after a few weeks and politicans cant arrange new (permanent) solutions.
Also the right winged party becomes more and more active in the media with protests against those refugee hostels.


GOVERNMENT
I think Austria is the best example of a not working government because they cant make agreement on anything...
Also, Austria brought forward a motion of 5,4 million Euro from the EU to support the incoming refugee. Looks like they run out of money aswell.
I am not really updated but I think there are a lot of good ideas which just cant get through because of either other parties who simply disagree (before even talking about it), or  ideas which actually get through but then are blocked by the >targets<, e.g. a SPÖ politican made the suggestion to open closed barracks and 4 unused sport halls but the borough didnt agree on this and nothing happened again


PUBLIC OPINION
I think the people get more and more angry, making the right winged party stronger and stronger (pretty sure they win the next elections), people blame the currently leading politicans as liars and DONT WANT to see that Strache is 10x worse. He is an incompetent politican, his party is full of corrupt morons and he is using the dumpness of the people to get his votes. There are like 100 different evidences that he and many others of his party (FPÖ) had and still have contact to Neo-chocolate chip cookies and known extremists, there has been audiovisual material published of him beeing part of a duelling fraternity in his youth etc etc.  BUT he actually claims its not true and they were just good friends and they were just playing in the woods (kek). And most important, the left winged parties are trying to accuse them of beeing a chocolate chip cookie party, newspapers only write against his party, qq more pls cunt.


PERSONAL OPINION
I think the current government is trash, lazy cunts who dont give a fuck about anything, seriously there is not even 1 politician I could recall who says exactly what he wants and does not pussyfoot around. Ok, Strache does, but everyone knows he cant even fulfill his promises and and his ideology is the worst anyway.
Also, I think WWII gets more and more forgotten, or at least people are less afraid of what happened and that it could happen again, you can really feel it when you talk to the people that they would have no problem with Strache if he would admit to be a chocolate chip cookie, I think thats a major problem we have esp in the younger generation...

In the end I think every refugee reaching Austria should be allowed to stay and the government is obliged to help them.
I guess my personal opinion is basically pretty far left, idc if we get lower life standards within more refugees or immigrants overall, its our duty to help those people in any case.


also, I am no politics expert but I simply realised that I HAVE to inform myself if I want to state a comment

[Beauchamp]

poll added

[Tibe]

(click to show/hide)

Our snackbar population welcomed them once, calling them "our Muslim brothers in need". They were probably thinking just like Tardogan that we would eventually annex Syria and everything would be fine. Needless to say, that didn't happen. The well-off ones rented themselves fine homes in extremely conservative neighborhoods and have become businessmen favored by Islamic nepotism. The poor ones (the huge majority) have been dwelling in refugee camps. Most escaped and keep escaping, living miserable lives on the street. When it became totally obvious that they were here to stay, those former kind-hearted Muslims went nuts. They were the first ones to start openly resenting Syrians.

News which don't make it to the mainstream media include the women and young girls being forced into prostitution. There were also some cases where public lynches almost happened. One time it was because a Syrian guy was being accused of thievery and "putting the neighborhood's reputation to shame". Most people don't like seeing them around, because they believe they caused an inflation in rents. And that is also actually true, but not their fault. Opportunistic hyenas have indeed almost tripled rents, because Syrians come in big families with every member working at a low paying job. They have no choice but pay whatever is asked from them. In tourism venues, they are also not welcome due to obvious reasons (tourists don't like to see poverty explicitly displayed on the street).

Well, I don't want to go on and on. You get the idea. The lives of these people are fucked and they are not so welcome in the only place they thought they would be fine. The situation is way out of control and it was only a matter of time they would start flooding towards Europe.

See Leshma. This is the kind of social problems I was talking about. Our own native populations cant even get employed these days. How the hell do you suppose a fuckton of poor people, entire strangers to the modern world, from the other side of the world will find jobs? Its nice and humane that you think of these people, but for majority of them there is nothing here. The best they get is safety and stability from the West. But thats it. Majority will not escape from poverty and that all will be also our problem.

[LordBerenger]

Imagine if a billionaire came up with the idea of building mega gigantic cruise ships and placing em right between Africa/Middle East and Europe and have all the refugees go there instead. Then all the UN countries would also fund a little bit for the sake of food etc...

Then they could all in the meanwhile be getting jobs to maintain the ship or what not whilst being on the ship.

[Leshma]

Or USA could grow a par and take responsibility for their actions. Wishful thinking, I know. Especially when majority of their population see firearms as religious artifacts...

entire strangers to the modern world

 

Dude, every family has a tablet and each of them have smartphones...

They speak decent english, had a chat with few of them.

One dude who is sleeping in a park nearby is actually British citizen who worked in Uk for years before he got an offer two years ago from international company in northern Iraq (read: big salary). War started, he and his family became refugees. Now he's trying to find a way to get back in UK but there are issues because of fucked up general rules towards refugees. Even if he is their citizen they won't let him come back, bureaucracy...

Majority will not escape from poverty and that all will be also our problem.

They can always work on construction sites in Wien, with many Turks who already work there. Haven't seen an Austrian willing to get his hands dirty for a week, it is not like they will be stealing their jobs. Problem with western Europe is that "poverty" isn't result of being jobless like in developing countries but rather of not being able to earn enough to sustain decent lifestyle. But with money anyone can earn in the West, one could live for months in their countries.

[Tibe]

Theres fucktons of people with their own story. The fact that you had a chat with some of them is hardly facts.

They can always work on construction sites in Wien, with many Turks who already work there. Haven't seen an Austrian willing to get his hands dirty for a week, it is not like they will be stealing their jobs. Problem with western Europe is that "poverty" isn't result of being jobless like in developing countries but rather of not being able to earn enough to sustain decent lifestyle. But with money anyone can earn in the West, one could live for months in their countries.

Its not about stealing jeubs. Its the fact that there IS no jobs.

[Leshma]

I'll take your arguments into account when you analyze some real facts and not just throw general opinion around like those hold any value. Just because thousands of people who never seen Syrian think he lives in a cave without electricity, god forbid internet, doesn't make it indisputable fact.

As I said, only young are fleeing, old aren't in big numbers in middle eastern countries (think that average age in Iraq is mid 30ies) and aren't capable surviving trip to EU. they seem more "normal" than second gen Turks in Wien. Less burkas, less religious bullshit. Second gen immigrants are way bigger issue, because children of immigrants tend to idealize their parents homeland and turn in nationalists. Exactly the reason why many of them left Europe to fight for ISIS.

Its not about stealing jeubs. Its the fact that there IS no jobs.

In Latvia, maybe. In Serbia there is none. But in Austria there are plenty. Anyone willing to work can find a job there.

[the real god emperor]

Approximately 1000 refugees each day are passing to Greek islands from Turkey. You get 20 years if you get caught while human smuggling, so smugglers only buy them small boats, put 16 people in a 2 people usage boats, take 500 euros per person , and send them to get drowned in Aegean. And no one can held those people responsible cause there is no proof. And because of recently increasing terrorist activities and re-elections going on government is not paying too much attention I think.

And yes, they live in terrible conditions here in İstanbul. If you call that living.

So;

Turkey
Media:No one gives a shit cus terrorist activities are at peak(guess who controls em) and we will have elections soon.
Government: I think they re planning to give most of them citizenship cus their votes will be in the pocket for em, IF they get elected ofc. CHP says I will send them home as soon as war ends, but I really like to see how they re gonna manage to do that.
Public Opinion:Most thinks they are shit, and treat them that way.If it was up to them they would terminate them all(well they act Kurds the same way too). I guess the rest thinks like me.
Personal Opinion: Those people have no homes, so its a humanity duty to accept them I think.I can live with Syrians, I am OK with that. But I think they should go back as war ends, most will stay obviously, but they should go.