Can any Russian people present their opinions on this?

[Macropus]

Non-human homosexual animals exist.

Yeah but they don't fight for their rights and don't adopt children! 

[LEKIS]

Does anyone have any evidence to prove that homosexuality is a natural thing that isn't just psychological?

Do you have proof of it being psychological and not just natural for some?


#Rekt

[Torben]

Yeah but they don't fight for their rights and don't adopt children! 

ya they just get their jigg on,  but then again the other animals dont care (not even their children).  we have a lot to learn from them.

[Xant]

Do you have proof of it being psychological and not just natural for some?


#Rekt

Again, how does psychological equal unnatural?

[Macropus]

Again, how does psychological equal unnatural?

Not everyone here has a perfect English.
Do you really not get what did he mean?

[LEKIS]

Again, how does psychological equal unnatural?

I don't know if you are understanding me.

Do you have proof of it being psychological and not just natural for some?

I've not said its psychological, I especially asked him if he had proof for it to NOT BE natural for the gays, which I refered to as: "some" in that counter argument.

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough for you.

Regards, Lekis

XOXO


EDIT: I don't think you have much of a choice regarding your sexuality, it will be what it is.(and it might change over time, or stay hidden. dunno)
#SOCKS

[Xant]

I did not say you thought it's psychological, but you used those two as opposites, hence implying that psychological means unnatural.

[KingBread]

Yes homosexuality is psychological thing! What a suprise. Big plot twist coming ==> heterosexuality is also a psychological thing! hence its not natural !

Now some explanation but point is above

 Actually if you go this way you will reach impulses, instinct levels that have at least some bilogical part (scientists have big problems in making strickt rules from what comes from bilogical formed body and what from enviroment and our own adaptation choices classy nature vs nurture problem). But lets claim that some basic impusles have mainly nature component. Then we can find that unformed human have both heterosexual and homosexual impulses. So in this case both are natural but !!! My point now !!! People measure their own impulses within time and they DECIDE to be one or another. So its a matter of choice not a concious one, with some biological background but its a choice. Many people have problems in measuring their own impulses and have problems with establishing their sexual orientation which prooves that its not 100% to be hetero, homo, asexual or sth but in this process there is nothing that promote one orientation over another.

[Torben]

(click to show/hide)

Yes homosexuality is psychological thing! What a suprise. Big plot twist coming ==> heterosexuality is also a psychological thing! hence its not natural !

Now some explanation but point is above

 Actually if you go this way you will reach impulses, instinct levels that have at least some bilogical part (scientists have big problems in making strickt rules from what comes from bilogical formed body and what from enviroment and our own adaptation choices classy nature vs nurture problem). But lets claim that some basic impusles have mainly nature component. Then we can find that unformed human have both heterosexual and homosexual impulses. So in this case both are natural but !!! My point now !!! People measure their own impulses within time and they DECIDE to be one or another. So its a matter of choice not a concious one, with some biological background but its a choice. Many people have problems in measuring their own impulses and have problems with establishing their sexual orientation which prooves that its not 100% to be hetero, homo, asexual or sth but in this process there is nothing that promote one orientation over another.

so you are suggesting that the amplitude of impulses of sexual orientation vary,  and the amount of giving in to one or the other impulse is a subconscious choice?

[Grumbs]

I put Stephen Fry in youtube thinking he might have something intelligent to say about it, scrolled down and found this:

(click to show/hide)

Actually think it is part of this documentary, might as well link the whole thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCp_5-CsYuM

I think its natural but its possibly natural for people to feel repelled/repulsed by it at the same time. People are naturally going to develop sexual attraction one way or another, and people are possibly programmed to think that it is simply wrong as well for evolutionary reasons. People should get over that though. You don't want kids to grow up in a society where they will be shunned for reasons beyond their control, beaten, jailed or treated as lower class citizens. You can't force someone to be gay too and shouldn't, so its not like it makes any negative impact on kids for them to understand the reality life as adults

All the religious side of it is utter bollocks though. Its just an excuse for people to use religion to support their views.

[KingBread]

Not entirelly subconcious. Level of conciousnes also vary from individual to individual but basically yes amplitude vary and hence people choose individually which one is being felt stronger within them(or none of them ==> asexualism).


Which also brings us to conclusion that so called "homophobic" behaviorurs are motivated by fear of own homosexual impulses(it doesnt mean that "homophobic" people are hidden homosexuals thought).

[Torben]

Not entirelly subconcious. Level of conciousnes also vary from individual to individual but basically yes amplitude vary and hence people choose individually which one is being felt stronger within them(or none of them ==> asexualism).


Which also brings us to conclusion that so called "homophobic" behaviorurs are motivated by fear of own homosexual impulses(it doesnt mean that "homophobic" people are hidden homosexuals thought).

that seems to imply that a person with "high homosexual tendencies/impulses" still has the choice to not be homosexual....  does it?  because I dont concur...

[KingBread]

I would rather say "still have a chance to have sex with other gender" but its super unlikely to deny high homosexual impulses at level that minior heterosexual impulses will prevail whole life withouth damaging psycho social functioning.

Yes super unlikely but possible imo there are some examples (highly overused by right wing antigay movements) of people that change from homosexual choice to hetero. And there are examples for other way around. But it is impossible to measure how high was their impulses in a obiective way. So that we can say this guy have 45 homosexual impulses per day and only 10 heterosexual yet after 30 years of living as homo he confess and convert to christianity and changed to hetero "Prais LOAD"< this is bullshet he can have strong heterosexual impulses denied whole life and while growing up and recieving support for them in local church society he felt secure enought to show them>. In other words its a very complex problem with no simple answers like "God can change you" or "Orientation is fully natural nothing can be done".

[Kafein]

Sexual impulses are not something you can change (easily), but you do choose with whom you have sexual relations with, to some extent.

[Dezilagel]

Sexual impulses are not something you can change (easily), but you do choose with whom you have sexual relations with, to some extent.

I don't