Flags in battle?

[Ronin]

The first round thingy is a bit weird, but the system is really, really great!

In fact, I'm beginning to like this first round insta flag thingy. Maybe I shouldn't but it spices things up a bit more

[Johammeth]

I like the flags a lot.

With a couple of tweaks and fixes, it will be fantastic.

[CrazyCracka420]

There has been a push since the inception of the mod to deal with HA/HX at end of rounds, and always a push to reduce the effectiveness of ranged. MOTF handles both complaints handily.

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MOTF lets infantry do what it does best, fight and hold territory.  It should help decrease the amount of whining about ranged.  Ranged can sit and pew pew from a distance all they want, but they won't be able to stop the flags from going up unless they get in there to stop it.

Instead of infantry doing what they have in the past (one of two options when it's mainly ranged left camping a good position on the enemy team):
*camp behind a building
*charge up a hill/easily defensible position and get shot to shit by archers
Now they can force the ranged classes to come to them, instead of the other way around.

Revamping/improving MotF is one of the best things the devs can do at this point.

[JackieChan]

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MOTF lets infantry do what it does best, fight and hold territory.  It should help decrease the amount of whining about ranged.  Ranged can sit and pew pew from a distance all they want, but they won't be able to stop the flags from going up unless they get in there to stop it.

Instead of infantry doing what they have in the past (one of two options when it's mainly ranged left camping a good position on the enemy team):
*camp behind a building
*charge up a hill/easily defensible position and get shot to shit by archers
Now they can force the ranged classes to come to them, instead of the other way around.

Revamping/improving MotF is one of the best things the devs can do at this point.

I completly agree with you, but as i melee player when you find yourself as the last 5 men alive vs for example 10-15 people you have praticly no chance of winning, because  you are forced to rush to the flag, and flags spawn at the same position every round on a map (most of the time in the open), range still kite you while the enemy infantry holds the flag. I just find the current flag system unfair to the remaining infantry that had previously a chance of winning, now they are just force to charge brainlessly in an antempt to capture some flag spawning and die while getting shot by the archers around.
Before there was a way to lure some enemy infantry out and kill your enemies one by one even if you were vastly outnumbered.

The original idea is great, but they need to seriously tweak it.

[Akynos]

The changes to flag spawn sprouted from a good idea, but I think it has been badly implemented.

I do not endorse the fact that flags spawn at the first round. Nor do I like them to spawn when there are just 5 players left in a team, as it favorises certain classes and therefore ruins teamplay and individual skill.

I see flags as a way to get rid of delayers and guerilla warriors, but right now it simply gives one team an unfair edge over the other.

Firstly I would get rid of the first round flag spawn system. Then I would endorse a system where the flags spawn when one team has more than 4x (the number is variable ofc) the number of players than the enemy. This would prevent the 'guerilla' tactics and so quicken the end of rounds where defeat for the losing team is certain. It would nonetheless prevent a team to have an edge over the other should the number of players drop below the current threshold.

[JackieChan]

The changes to flag spawn sprouted from a good idea, but I think it has been badly implemented.

I do not endorse the fact that flags spawn at the first round. Nor do I like them to spawn when there are just 5 players left in a team, as it favorises certain classes and therefore ruins teamplay and individual skill.

I see flags as a way to get rid of delayers and guerilla warriors, but right now it simply gives one team an unfair edge over the other.

Firstly I would get rid of the first round flag spawn system. Then I would endorse a system where the flags spawn when one team has more than 4x (the number is variable ofc) the number of players than the enemy. This would prevent the 'guerilla' tactics and so quicken the end of rounds where defeat for the losing team is certain. It would nonetheless prevent a team to have an edge over the other should the number of players drop below the current threshold.

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(sry i had to steal that from you CrazyCracka420, i just had to!)

[mrrdhardy]

this flag thing is horrible it just makes battle into some sort of objective based game like siege I suggest keeping first round flag system in but take out this new less than 5 players flag spawn, It is killing low populated servers

[CrazyCracka420]

The changes to flag spawn sprouted from a good idea, but I think it has been badly implemented.

I do not endorse the fact that flags spawn at the first round. Nor do I like them to spawn when there are just 5 players left in a team, as it favorises certain classes and therefore ruins teamplay and individual skill.

I see flags as a way to get rid of delayers and guerilla warriors, but right now it simply gives one team an unfair edge over the other.

Firstly I would get rid of the first round flag spawn system. Then I would endorse a system where the flags spawn when one team has more than 4x (the number is variable ofc) the number of players than the enemy. This would prevent the 'guerilla' tactics and so quicken the end of rounds where defeat for the losing team is certain. It would nonetheless prevent a team to have an edge over the other should the number of players drop below the current threshold.

That doesn't do anything to address the concerns with ranged being so dominant on the battlefield (especially the numbers of ranged).  MOTF allows infantry to shine and once again be the "main force" on the battlefield (as it should be). 

I get your point, and I get Jackie's point about no longer being able to methodically take out the enemy team if they are all camping the flag (it forces you to go balls to the wall and head on charge them).  You both have valid concerns, but I don't see any way to address your concerns, along with doing what MOTF change does (making infantry the dominant force on the battlefield).  I think revamping MOTF is going to be overall better for the mod than leaving it the way it is currently. 

[JackieChan]

That doesn't do anything to address the concerns with ranged being so dominant on the battlefield (especially the numbers of ranged).  MOTF allows infantry to shine and once again be the "main force" on the battlefield (as it should be). 

Just a few minutes on eu1: Our team was winning, but the flag spawned at the center of the village (in the open), all our infantry amasted at the flag, we were totally butchered: all the enemy archers and horse archers were circling around us and shooting us while their cav lanced us.. so yeah, i dont think the current MOTF or any resembling form will resolve the issue (at least on eu1)

[Adamar]

this flag thing is horrible it just makes battle into some sort of objective based game like siege I suggest keeping first round flag system in but take out this new less than 5 players flag spawn, It is killing low populated servers

Point me at these low populated servers plz.

[Akynos]

That doesn't do anything to address the concerns with ranged being so dominant on the battlefield (especially the numbers of ranged).  MOTF allows infantry to shine and once again be the "main force" on the battlefield (as it should be). 

I get your point, and I get Jackie's point about no longer being able to methodically take out the enemy team if they are all camping the flag (it forces you to go balls to the wall and head on charge them).  You both have valid concerns, but I don't see any way to address your concerns, along with doing what MOTF change does (making infantry the dominant force on the battlefield).  I think revamping MOTF is going to be overall better for the mod than leaving it the way it is currently.

As Jackie kinda said, I do not see this MOTF as a pro-infantry patch : Sure, it prevents ranged from eternal kiting or long range sniping, however it is compensated by the fact that:
1- If ranged team is first on flag, melee are forced to charge them
2- The shieldless melee will have no cover
3- All melee will be concentrated in one single spot, allowing for fish-in-barrel shots

Therefore I do not really see how this patch is advantageous to melee, it simply gets rid of the last traces of kiting in my opinion.

[owens]

The maps have to be modified so that the flags are somewhat defended from archers but open to infantry attacks.

[rustyspoon]

The maps have to be modified so that the flags are somewhat defended from archers but open to infantry attacks.

This is a good point. If the flags are supposed to represent an army holding a position, why would they be trying to hold an open field?

[Paul]

There could also be a routine that spawns cover along with the flag when no other props are around.

[no_rules_just_play]

There could also be a routine that spawns cover along with the flag when no other props are around.

Sounds amazing! Maybe something like a few carriages (flipped on it's side with the goods thrown on the ground as if people tried to quickly build a mini fortification as last hope?).

And I know you can do it so Ill just ask: a defenceless virgin to defend please!