Avatar - Shit movie, only decent character with the best quote

[[ptx]]

That's how evolution works. We did need advanced enough intelligence to begin manipulating objects, but the physical ability to do so rewarded those with higher intelligence with better chances of survival, thus we evolved to be even more sophisticated?

Intelligence is evolutionary, it doesn't just appear out of nowhere.

[Rumblood]

There are a lot of things that we don't understand about intelligence, too many to make any absolute statements about our limitations. DNA in itself, even though we have mapped out the "genetic code", is still a very large mystery to us.
http://www.foxnews.com/science/2013/12/13/secret-second-code-found-hiding-within-human-dna/
We have found that DNA need not be passed directly from parent to child. It can be transducted from other sources.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transduction_%28genetics%29
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10779482

Extrapolating these findings to the 600,000 copies of L1 in the genome, we predict that the amount of DNA transduced by L1 represents approximately 1% of the genome, a fraction comparable with that occupied by exons.

So with humans living in close proximity as we do, it is possible that DNA exchanges can occur without a direct lineage, giving us an even greater ability to exchange useful genetic information.

We don't understand animal (and human) instincts, what they are, and where they come from. Some studies on children suggest that our ability for math is built right into our neurons. I've seen anecdotal evidence of this in my own son. At 4 years of age, he had been taught how to count, add, and subtract and basic fractions like 1/4 and 1/2, etc. But certainly not above that. Yet while playing a game called Monster Rancher, he could tell that after a battle the monster with 31 of 52 hit points left had a greater percentage than a monster with 68 of 115 hit points and announced the winner before it was displayed.
http://discovermagazine.com/2009/nov/17-the-brain-humanitys-other-basic-instinct-math#.Ushbs7QhTDg

In other words, it is very possible that the more we learn, the more we pass on in our DNA and so future generations are able to pick up and use this knowledge easier than their parents, reducing the amount of time that it takes to "learn" the further we advance.

My point is, don't presume to know how far our intelligence and our very structure for retaining information can take us.

For the religious, I believe that it is mandated that we expand into the stars. Certainly if one were to believe in a God, you should have a much greater faith in the ability of his creation to allow us to continue to grow as a species. In this, I believe that the very limited understanding of early humans limited the interpretation of two very old written passages.
1: Be fruitful and multiply and fill the Earth.
In their limited understanding, humans assumed "Earth" meant this planet, I choose to believe that it would refer to all Creation.
2: Come thou and all thy house into the ark; for thee have I seen righteous before me in this generation. Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female. Of fowls also of the air by sevens, the male and the female; to keep seed alive upon the face of all the earth.
Rather than a story of events gone past, I choose to believe that this refers to what we are to do in the future. Build our own ark and fill it with the creatures and plants that we will need to survive and bring them with us as we multiply throughout creation.
So it is written, so shall it be done. 

[Xant]

That's how evolution works. We did need advanced enough intelligence to begin manipulating objects, but the physical ability to do so rewarded those with higher intelligence with better chances of survival, thus we evolved to be even more sophisticated?

Intelligence is evolutionary, it doesn't just appear out of nowhere.

What. No, that is not how evolution works at all. Even if we humans did become more intelligent solely because we manipulated objects (HIGHLY debatable), that doesn't mean intelligence isn't needed for anything else. Intelligence helps EVERY aspect of survival and reproduction. Thus it has a fitness advantage for all species, whether they are capable of object manipulation or not....

[Kafein]

What. No, that is not how evolution works at all. Even if we humans did become more intelligent solely because we manipulated objects (HIGHLY debatable), that doesn't mean intelligence isn't needed for anything else. Intelligence helps EVERY aspect of survival and reproduction. Thus it has a fitness advantage for all species, whether they are capable of object manipulation or not....

The usual argument is that being able to manipulate objects to a certain degree trains and rewards intelligence more, in turn favorising more dexterity, which forms a strong feedback cycle. There is some empirical evidence of this, as most intelligent species tend to be able to manipulate objects. Think parrots, elephants and apes. It is also quite clear that a physical ability for communication has a tremendous impact too. After all, we are the only species capable of emitting such a wide variety of different sounds with extreme precision.

Rumblood: to say that "the religious view" is that we have to colonise and grow is a very Christian-centric view. Not all religions push towards population growth. Societies that inhabited fragile environments such as many isolated Pacific islands learned to actively maintain zero population growth and limit their per-capita impact on their environment, sometimes via drastic measures such as forced suicides or killing every single pig. Ultimately, the entire Earth is not different, it can only support a limited amount of humans at any given per-capita impact (unless that impact becomes 0 or lower which is simply not possible).



About the space travel stuff, travelling at near lightspeed wouldn't take that much power and therefore fuel. This is empty space with no gravitational field, there is very little continuous force required to keep up your speed once near-lightspeed is acheived. But it would be stupidly long. The main energy problem would be to keep all the onboard equipment functioning during the entire trip. Now, if we find a way to put the whole solar system under a gigantic sphere and move everything inside, we would probably succeed given the huge amount of energy released by the Sun at any given moment. It's basically everything we have.

[Xant]

There's even more evidence that intelligence developed as much as it did because of our complex societies. Apes also back it up: usually, the larger the social group of the ape, the larger its brain. Sometimes the correlation is even 1:1.

[Leshma]

Agree with what's said in OP. Like our tech very much. It's what differentiate us from other animals. You can train as much you want but you'll never beat grown up chimpanzee in a fair fight, our genetic "relative". But with a gun he's easy mode.

That colonel/general/whatever is just being honest, and prefer that over sugarcoating any day. But sugarcoating and faking is also something we perfected and we should be proud of it. Most animals fake to survive, but we're best at it.

We should continue to populate/ruin everything we touch because that's what we are. Not to serve nature and crap like that, for sure.

[Rumblood]

Rumblood: to say that "the religious view" is that we have to colonise and grow is a very Christian-centric view.

It's a very Abrahamic point of view, which covers about 99.99% of the religious people on this forum. Good enough for guvmint work, good enough for here.

@Leshma - I see nothing to be proud of in having a segment of the human species who is so narcissistic as to have the need to invent an alien strawman to bash in order to be made to feel superior. Boy! That fictional character sure told that made-up alien species off didn't he? Woo!!!! Hooomans!!!

[Clockworkkiller]

I say fuck humans.

Let's all evolve into furries

[zagibu]

My ass is already hairy enough to be part of a furry.

[Christo]

I say fuck humans.

Let's all evolve into furries

Devolve, you mean?

[Oberyn]

It's a very Abrahamic point of view, which covers about 99.99% of the religious people on this forum. Good enough for guvmint work, good enough for here.

@Leshma - I see nothing to be proud of in having a segment of the human species who is so narcissistic as to have the need to invent an alien strawman to bash in order to be made to feel superior. Boy! That fictional character sure told that made-up alien species off didn't he? Woo!!!! Hooomans!!!

I think you're confused. The quote in question was never said in the movie. The fictional alien species in the movie was actually used for exactly the opposite reason you are claiming. For self-loathing, self-flagellating emo hipsters to cry about how evil and destructive humanity/civilization is(while watching it in air-conditioned movie theaters of course, or in their home dvd players). I'm sure you'd love it.

And Leshma is probably being sarcastic, because he's one of these worthless cunts. Anyone who's ever had extended close contact with "nature" would never willingly "serve" it. There's a reason humanity spends so much time and effort circumventing nature. Because it is a massive fucking bitch. Natural=/=good, or right, or pure, or any of that ridiculous hippy bullshit. Naturalistic fallacy is like the go-to arguement for these people. Ultimately all the morons whining about humanity being a virus are just misanthropes. One can only wish they would heed their own gut instincts and off themselves, leaving more room for those who aren't filled with digusts for their own kind. Or at least try to live "naturally", which will have same outcome. But of course they are cowardly hypocrites so the most that will happen is some self-righteous rants on the internet before they continue to take advantage of all the "evil" things society provides for them.

[zagibu]

There are stupid people on both sides of the conflict. Avatar isn't THAT bad, of course it's mostly romanticizing nature, but it also shows a few weaknesses of the ancient tribal culture, namely xenophobia and superstition.

But yeah, there are a lot of self-proclaimed saviors of nature that wouldn't last a week without electricity, central heating and processed food. This doesn't mean that everyone blaming humans for their greed, selfishness and short-term orientation is a fool.

[Rumblood]

I think you're confused. The quote in question was never said in the movie. The fictional alien species in the movie was actually used for exactly the opposite reason you are claiming. For self-loathing, self-flagellating emo hipsters to cry about how evil and destructive humanity/civilization is(while watching it in air-conditioned movie theaters of course, or in their home dvd players). I'm sure you'd love it.

I'm not confused at all. We are talking about the poster linked in the OP of this thread. Don't get confused yourself just because it was created from material from a movie 

[Kafein]

This doesn't mean that everyone blaming humans for their greed, selfishness and short-term orientation is a fool.

The problem is that those messages tend to be thrown around without being correctly justified. The correct justification being a purely utilitarian one (we positively need to control the climate, keep endangered species alive and reduce our waste production because those things will mean trouble for us in the future). Too many times I've heard that kind of agenda being supported by random anthropomorphisations of unrelated stuff and nothing else. The most hilarous one I've heard was something like "we can't dump nuclear waste on the moon, we have to solve our own problems ourselves" oh yeah the moonians would be so pissed.

[Leshma]

And Leshma is probably being sarcastic, because he's one of these worthless cunts.

Leshma is too stupid to even make an attempt at sarcasm. Filled with misanthropy, fueled by jealousy. Lack of human qualities in one can make him/her truly pathetic self-centered and useless mass of organs and living tissue. Not even a cockroach, they can survive on their own. Hatred rising, plot thickens.