Meanwhile in Ukraine

[Leshma]

When you're weak against a strong opponent you have two options: to bend over and take the dick or go endure severe beating like a champ. Ukraine wasn't the first to have to make this choice. European counties after WWII were forced to bend over, some took USA dick, some Soviet, some managed to avoid it by playing dumb or standing aside minding their own business (which still goes under foreplay, part of sexual intercourse). Europe took the dick, Yugoslavia didn't want at first, but after they got beaten rape never stopped. Ukraine decided to fight the big guy and expect another big guy to aid them, beating the shit out of the dude bullying them. That isn't going to happen. Economic sanctions are the only measure west will ever support and that measure will lessen when global crisis hits the shores of the western world.

It's easy for the likes of Teeth and Nessaj to preach democracy, independence and freedom of choice. But they don't live in a misplaced country, surrounded by conflicted powers, basically in a sandwich between mean and meaner. Ukraine, Poland and Yugoslavia are those kind. Countries that were in war more than not, mostly because their shitty geopolitical location.

[Tovi]

Democratic government? Since when? You did read that Ukraine is among the top 3 most corrupted nations on Earth.
Saying Ukraine had a democratic government is like saying Putin was elected democratically, how many percentages above 100% was it again? ...

The EU treaty was fine, maybe you were just worried about Tymoshenko's foreign medical check which was the only ultimatum; plus NATO would have been perfect for Ukraine, they should have joined when they gave up their arsenal, but hey that's why they got this treaty:

If you wan't talk to about something undemocratic, then try and read about the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances

Which parts of those did Russia honor? Yeah, none. If Ukraine have still had their arsenal none of this would have happened.

This whole thing is beyond stupidity, all that this entails and implies for the future is bad..

I know this treaty, but the counterpart was : do not join NATO....

Corrupted or not, I'm not sure he had not the support of the majority of his country. Riots is not a proof he was rejected by the majority of Ukrainians. It's the same problem with islamists in arab countries : they try to usurp any popular revolution, but they are infiltrated by Saoudis or qataris (western allies).

[Oberyn]

Oh they are scary, very scary. Saying they aren't scary is an insult to all those people who died during WWII, few years before and after. When communists narrowly defeated fascists, they did everything in their power to exterminate that idea (by killing people among other measures).

What we have now is also quite scary. Communism collapsed two decades ago and we already have neo-fascists who wholeheartedly support all those "values" but are hiding direct ties with nazis. Today fascism is a choice, opinion and is cool as long einstein, 88, 14 and nazi svastika aren't associated with it. But those symbols aren't responsible for deaths of millions of people, ideas are. That is why it's okay for Svoboda and Golden Dawn to have an opinion as long that opinion isn't directly connected with einstein and everything he represents.

Just because communism isn't around anymore (which is a good thing), doesn't mean that fascism should be allowed to show up its ugly head again.

Ukraine is the first European country that gave power to fascists after many years. Next country to do so will be Greece. That must be stopped. These new generations seem to be very fond of fascism.

If you count Russia as european, much earlier than that. I'm getting tired of explaining how much more fascist than any other country involved Russia is, and the ridiculous irony of their propaganda considering that.
But I understand why they use those symbols, "chocolate chip cookie", as if ukrainians were on the point of ethnically cleansing russians out of the country. It's because all of the countries on the european border of Russia chose to side with the only counterbalance to the gigantic imperial nation that had been fucking them up the ass for centuries, and had recently become even more expansionist do to a universalist ideology. That some factions in Finland, the baltic countries, Romania, Ukraine, etc sided with the chocolate chip cookies had much more to do with geopolitical balance than any racial ideology. The ukrainians have always identified as slavs, for fuck's sake. They weren't somehow uberslavs in the chocolate chip cookie racial hierarchy, they counted as much as any other ethnic russian. And as another example there were highly placed and decorated jewish fins during the war.
So following WW2 there was implemented a policy of "russification", a deliberate attempt to completely erase these cultures and languages, by assimilation and elimination of all intelligentsia, and anyone fighting against these policies in those countries was automatically tarred as a "chocolate chip cookie" sympathizer, because of the recent history. Nationalism was inextricably linked to chocolate chip cookie ideology in soviet parlance for these countries, and it's propaganda effectiveness has obviously been transferred rather easily to the russian Federation. So much so that despite peaceful coexistence for decades all it took was a few weeks of blaring repeatedly that ZOMG the chocolate chip cookies are back in Ukraine and about to genocide all slavs!!1!!, some masturbating about Glorious Red Army and the Great Patriotic War, and presto. 

[Tovi]

Well, ok, fascism is a plague in every country from the old soviet bloc. What do you want to prove ? That Russia is as bad as Ukraine ? But US imperialism is not better.
So, now everybody should just try to find an issue to a possible war. Talking about WW2 is pointless.
Does Ukrainians really want to fight for Crimea ? Is it a question of honor or something like that ? They just cannot imagine than Crimean chose to join Russia ?

[Falka]

They just cannot imagine than Crimean chose to join Russia ?

Chose??? don't make me laugh.

Does Ukrainians really want to fight for Crimea ? Is it a question of honor or something like that ?

If russians would try to take away even pinch of polish soil I'd be all for shooting the hell out of them. Without my participation ofc, cause I'd rather stay in my home, watching war in tv

[Tovi]

But it's not a game here.

Be honest. Does Russia threathened Europe ? Why NATO does exist ? Why expand to the East ? Why deploy anti-missiles system at russian border ?
Iran, China or Russia are constantly surrounded by US armada. That's Brzezinsky's strategy.
Their only justification is : "We are the good guys" (Soft Power strategy)
 Don't be surprised if they respond.

[Rumblood]

But it's not a game here.

Be honest. Does Russia threathened Europe ? Why NATO does exist ? Why expand to the East ? Why deploy anti-missiles system at russian border ?
Iran, China or Russia are constantly surrounded by US armada. That's Brzezinsky's strategy.
Their only justification is : "We are the good guys" (Soft Power strategy)
 Don't be surprised if they respond.

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[Christo]

dat party tho

[DaveUKR]

dat party tho

Crimea is Russia!
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[Leshma]

If you count Russia as european, much earlier than that.

No, I don't. Probably not how most people perceive it, but I don't consider Russia or Turkey as European countries.

Also, I'm talking about small scale fascism not about genocide. For example, Brice Taton wasn't killed by random houligans. He was killed by members of smaller fascist organization. Many organizations like that exist in Belgrade, they are all involved in criminal activities and were sponsored by the state and still are. That is possible because Serbia is heavily corrupted country just like Ukraine. There won't be large scale genocide in Ukraine, but many fascist groups will kill people on daily basis and won't be prosecuted for it.

[Butan]

Omg dat guy is still alive after 14 reports of dubious objectivity? You mean they dont burn reporters from american journalism group in Russia controlled territory?  :P

All of those were interesting to watch though, just funny after some post a few days back to see he is still alive and well  :)

[Leshma]

If russians would try to take away even pinch of polish soil I'd be all for shooting the hell out of them. Without my participation ofc, cause I'd rather stay in my home, watching war in tv

I know you meant it as a joke but, when war starts in one country it spreads like a fire. Sooner or later you'll be involved in it, one way or another. Only way to avoid it is to become a refugee.

[[ptx]]

Well, ok, fascism is a plague in every country from the old soviet bloc. What do you want to prove ? That Russia is as bad as Ukraine ? But US imperialism is not better.

Dat reading comprehension.
It's like you attempted to read Oberyn's post, only understood a couple of keywords ("fascism", "soviet bloc") and are now trying to put this into your warped perspective of whatever.

[Molly]

Omg dat guy is still alive after 14 reports of dubious objectivity? You mean they dont burn reporters from american journalism group in Russia controlled territory? 

All of those were interesting to watch though, just funny after some post a few days back to see he is still alive and well 

Why dubious objectivity?
I might have missed 1 or 2 of them but as far as I can tell he tries to get every opinion across, isn't trying to steer with his questions and the comments to the shown pictures were obviously less biased than from anything else I've seen.

I'd say he does a pretty good job to be objective.

[Christo]

Simon Yolostrovsky is da man, so baller