Meanwhile in Ukraine

[Tovi]

I'm of the opinion that this situation will just be drawn out and tensions held because a country can't become a member of NATO as long as it has an ongoing territorial dispute.

You mean..like Turkey in Cypria ? 

[Xant]

Ой, то не вечер, то не вечер,
Мне малым-мало спалось,
Мне малым-мало спалось,
Ох, да во сне привиделось...

Мне во сне привиделось,
Будто конь мой вороной
Разыгрался, расплясался,
Разрезвился подо мной.

Налетели ветры злые
Со восточной стороны.
Ой, да сорвали чёрну шапку
С моей буйной головы.

А есаул догадлив был —
Он сумел сон мой разгадать.
"Ох, пропадёт, — он говорил,
Твоя буйна голова."

Ой, то не вечер, то не вечер,
Мне малым-мало спалось,
Мне малым-мало спалось,
Ох, да во сне привиделось...

Ох, да во сне привиделось...
Ох, да во сне привиделось...

[Dezilagel]

Wow Tovi, you for real? 

[Tovi]

Not really, I took the red pill 

[Leshma]

Slightly less fascist, but yes, that's when it started gaining more hold as a popular philosophy among the elites, notably the military.

 

Well technically, you are right. Those people are elite because they are in power. But being elite also means they should be virtuous, and they are not.

In Russia and other post-soviet republics smart, honest and people of integrity were (and still are) victims of criminal groups. There are few russian documentaries which explain what happened when USSR fell apart.

[Falka]

Western Ukrainians have been enslavered by Poles for centuries and you want to obey to Brussel and his NAFTA shit now? Slave a day, slave always ?

Actually Kievan Rus was enslaved firstly by Mongolians, then Lithuania got this area and Poland just inherited it when The Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth was created.

[Oberyn]

Well technically, you are right. Those people are elite because they are in power. But being elite also means they should be virtuous, and they are not.

In Russia and other post-soviet republics smart, honest and people of integrity were (and still are) victims of criminal groups. There are few russian documentaries which explain what happened when USSR fell apart.

"Elite" as a social class merely means that first thing. There is absolutely no moral judgement either way when you say someone is part of the "elite" of a country. Merely that they have a lot of power, whether that is money, education, instutional, etc. And I'm quite aware of the oligarchic system of post-soviet Russia. It is one of the reasons I classify them as "fascist".

[Tovi]

Be patient, Troïka is coming.
What was the job of the Ukrainian 1st minister before ? 
He's the US candidate : http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1bi2ch_ukraine-la-manipulation-americaine-audio-victoria-nuland-geoffrey-r-pyatt-ambassadeur-us-en-ukraine_news
This is not a revolution, it's a coup.

[DaveUKR]

So, Russia would annex the half of your country that WANT to be annexed.
Western Ukrainians have been enslavered by Poles for centuries and you want to obey to Brussel and his NAFTA shit now? Slave a day, slave always ?
 EU is just a province created by US. And now the US empire want to place his Nato troops at the Russia's gate. What will be the next step ?

Obviously some ukrainian do not want to be westerners, so let them go.

It's not true, it's a cliché that's used by Russians to justify their actions. Randomised social research (taken the medium rounded value using a lot of them during 2013-2014). Would not mind to join Russia:

(click to show/hide)

Crimea: about 41%
Donetsk: about 33%
Lugansk: about 24%
Odessa (my native city): about 24%
Zaporizhe: about 16%
Kharkiv: about 15%
Chernigiv: about 14%
Dnipropetrovsk: about 13%
Kirovograd: about 8%
Кiev: about 5%
Chernivtsy: about 5%
Zhitomir: about 5%
The rest is less than 5%(western are 0%)

Why on earth letting those "some Ukrainians" make their cities Russian? What do you suggest for those who don't want that? If people want to live in the other country - they move there. We're not living in middle ages.

Be patient, Troïka is coming.
What was the job of the Ukrainian 1st minister before ? 
He's the US candidate : http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1bi2ch_ukraine-la-manipulation-americaine-audio-victoria-nuland-geoffrey-r-pyatt-ambassadeur-us-en-ukraine_news
This is not a revolution, it's a coup.

What do you mean revolution? Are you any competent? I'm tired to repeat it over and over again: Parliament is all the same. The only difference is that Ukraine has no President, Parliament is exactly the same as it was with Yanukovich. US diplomats discussing Ukrainian politics with those who they want to see and those who they don't want to see in Government: what's wrong with it? I can give you millions of exactly same links from the Russian side.

[Bob_Ross]

Actually Kievan Rus was enslaved firstly by Mongolians, then Lithuania got this area and Poland just inherited it when The Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth was created.

And Ruthenia enjoyed relative religious tolerance within the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. It was in fact the Russians who implemented a harsh policy of Russification in Ukraine in the 19th century, mainly because they feared the influence of the numerous Polish nobility living in modern-day Ukraine and Belarus.

[Kafein]

The greatest conspiracy is that Tovi is in fact Truman and has been living as the star of a TV show since he was born.

[Tagora]

In the wiki for Russia it says that they have free healthcare since '96 but that care has declined since the collapse of the USSR.  What's the healthcare like in the Ukraine? Just curious because if the wiki page is at all accurate that means Russia provides free healthcare for all of its citizens whereas Ukraine doesn't?  Thanks.

[AntiBlitz]

In the wiki for Russia it says that they have free healthcare since '96 but that care has declined since the collapse of the USSR.  What's the healthcare like in the Ukraine? Just curious because if the wiki page is at all accurate that means Russia provides free healthcare for all of its citizens whereas Ukraine doesn't?  Thanks.

hot damn what a deal breaker, better hand over the whole country now, that free health care really threw a wrench in our plans, how can the west compete with russian free health care!

U.S should just cede into canada too, cuz healthcare

[Tagora]

huh? I was only wondering because there are Ukrainians in this thread who could comment on their healthcare...I don't know what you're going on about.

[Segd]

hot damn what a deal breaker, better hand over the whole country now, that free health care really threw a wrench in our plans, how can the west compete with russian free health care!

U.S should just cede into canada too, cuz healthcare

You got it all wrong! Our healthcare is one of the main reasons why Ukraine still resists annexation   
Free doesn't mean good.

Outdated,but still nice example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Health_Organization_ranking_of_health_systems_in_2000
79   Ukraine
130   Russia
131    Honduras   
132    Burkina Faso

Life expectancy(I hope you know where Ukraine is ):
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