Meanwhile in Ukraine

[Nebun]

US has wanted to end the conflict there all the time, you utter fucking moron.

Seriously, what the fuck? How do you even get that dumb? Russia ATTACKS UKRAINE and sustains the conflict with its own troops, equipment, money, leads the separatists, etc., etc.... yet, the US is at fault in these retards' minds. Like, how twisted can you get?

if so then why are they or germany agreeing on things for ukraine? u stupid shit

[Xant]

if so then why are they or germany agreeing on things for ukraine? u stupid shit

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[Nebun]

more news, Kerry told Ukrainians not to start any aggressive actions against donbas - after their conversation with Putin ))
yes right, they had nothing to do with it

[Nebun]

we can go back and forth forever Xant, only time will tell

[DaveUKR]

))

Your nickname can be translated as insane, right? Then it describes you at best. Stop it or I'll have to congratulate you with achieving a Tovilist member status.

[Lt_Anders]

You do realize the ultimatum was written specifically so any sovereign nation with any self respect would refuse, right? Unless of course you would consider unrestricted access for foreign military personnel completely acceptable.

Yea, i Know. The whole point of this entire thing was the "America did X!" Idiocy and showed how, using "Russian Logic," Russia started WW1 (and WW2).

Austria did all that knowing that Germany had it's back, but, if you look at true troop movements, Russia and it's little puppet Serbia, mobilized their forces first, causing everyone to gear up for war and mobilize.

[Tibe]

Easy - Libya, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Venezuela, Serbia, Sudan, Ruanda, Somali and so on

Libya had an internal struggle, completely unrelated to the West, Syria had relatively same. Iraq and Afghanistan are exactly in the same situation they were pre US, their situation didnt get worse. Afganistan was ruined already during the Cold war by basically everybody, including ussr. Dunno about Serbia. Venezuela is completely corrupt. Sudan and Ruanda have always been extremely unstable without anyones help and the most Somalians can prove is that the West stole all their fish and shat all over their coast. Not so easy. You still have nothing m8.

Even if you do manage to pull USA and EU out of your arse, you cant really find a reason why they did it. Its not like USA goes to random countries makes them unstable and than buys all their raw resource cheap. What are you stupid? There are actual countries where theres very solid evidence that USA has taken their democracy for their own gain, but none of these countries you just listed are those.

[DonNicko]

Libya had an internal struggle, completely unrelated to the West, Syria had relatively same. Iraq and Afghanistan are exactly in the same situation they were pre US, their situation didnt get worse. Afganistan was ruined already during the Cold war by basically everybody, including ussr. Dunno about Serbia. Venezuela is completely corrupt. Sudan and Ruanda have always been extremely unstable without anyones help and the most Somalians can prove is that the West stole all their fish and shat all over their coast. Not so easy. You still have nothing m8.

Even if you do manage to pull USA and EU out of your arse, you cant really find a reason why they did it. Its not like USA goes to random countries makes them unstable and than buys all their raw resource cheap. What are you stupid? There are actual countries where theres very solid evidence that USA has taken their democracy for their own gain, but none of these countries you just listed are those.

Tibe you just showed that you know so little about this countries(and only what you saw on your TV). USA and EU dinn do nuffin. Do you realize that it is enough to keep frozen conflicts in the area to hold all area poor. That's what happenning. You need to learn deeper about countries. Your excuse just like those countries were bad, because of that USA and EU involved there and made them better. No. they made them worse much worse. Also they killed a lot of civillians, by mistake as they apoligize later. The qoute from John Major describes everything so clear, you just don't want to admit it.

[Tibe]

That wasnt my point at all. My point was that USA and EU werent even related at all. That these countries collapsed on its own weight, because if I DO look at their HISTORY, i can clearly see their own people have always fucked their own countries for their own gains, which is why they are poor. USA didnt make them worse, because USA wasnt even there and your proofs for it are extremely lacking and quite frankly made up by similar anti-westerners who might have been there, but are totally looking for a connection to throw shit at the US. Like for example when Gaddafi in Lybia came to power 40 years ago, he instantly kicked all the jews and italians out of his country - clearly this is the man, who was good, wanted economic growth and freedom.

True. Mybe I am relying too heavly on TV. But the fact is that you are desperately looking for leads and cases which arent quite simply true. If I do look at their history I can clearly see they have been poor and broken without USA-s help long ago.

[DonNicko]

USA didnt make them worse, because USA wasnt even there

Tibe what? Do you answer for you words? USA wasnt there? Tibe don't be idiot

[Tibe]

Again, he pulls some random statement out of posts, to dodge replying to the actual points in them. Why do I bother....

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[DonNicko]

Again, he pulls some random statement out of posts, to dodge replying to the actual points in them. Why do I bother....

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Tibe that was your words, or I understood them wrong anyhow, then explain what you meant USA didnt make them worse, because USA wasnt even there

[Tibe]

In some of those cases yeah.

Iraq. Saddam invaded his neibhour. Wanted to completely wipe out a country. If USA hadnt invaded, the Arab league would have invaded Iraq instead and much more people would have died. And what do you even think USA gained from Iraq and Afganistan? Do you have even the slightest idea how much USA actually pays these countries these days? They didnt and dont earn anything, they just lose a fuckton of money which they really need for themselves on these countries. So, again, USA invading them, so that they could get a profit, is not true, because there isnt a single possible way they can actually get a profit. And if they dont get a profit. Why are they there?

USA and EU hasnt earned any money at all from any of these countries you listed and they arent ever going to either. I fail to see how keeping these countries poor is in anyones intrests in the West.

[DonNicko]

In some of those cases yeah.

Iraq. Saddam invaded his neibhour. Wanted to completely wipe out a country. If USA hadnt invaded, the Arab league would have invaded Iraq instead and much more people would have died. And what do you even think USA gained from Iraq and Afganistan? Do you have even the slightest idea how much USA actually pays these countries these days? They didnt and dont earn anything, they just lose a fuckton of money which they really need for themselves on these countries. So, again, USA invading them, so that they could get a profit, is not true, because there isnt a single possible way they can actually get a profit. And if they dont get a profit. Why are they there?

USA and EU hasnt earned any money at all from any of these countries you listed and they arent ever going to either. I fail to see how keeping these countries poor is in anyones intrests in the West.

Geopolitics. And they made a lot of mistakes which tries to improve. For the beginning they supported Saddam and his war against Iran. And so on.

[DaveUKR]

Again, he pulls some random statement out of posts, to dodge replying to the actual points in them. Why do I bother....

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Just ignore, it's a cure for it.