Author Topic: Your Opinion on Arbalests  (Read 5699 times)

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Offline Tanken

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2013, 06:50:03 am »
+2
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Offline Segd

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #16 on: September 30, 2013, 06:56:10 am »
0
Str req should be increased for using them. For ex Arbalests 18 STR instead of 15
Nice joke  :lol: My almost 35lvl char totally agrees what I(& all dedicated xbowmen) will need a respec. Increasing pd requirements for end tier bows from 6 to 7 would be a good thing too, Steevee  :rolleyes:

Arbalests are fine in Strat(except rain time). Do whatever you want if c-rpg though. Greater skill dependency for aim & reloading time would be fine(great penalties at 0wpf, none at 150)

Offline Penitent

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #17 on: September 30, 2013, 07:16:16 am »
+1
I think they a re fine.  Great damage and range, but super slow.  If you miss a shot at someone, or dont kill them, you aren't getting another chance.

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #18 on: September 30, 2013, 07:24:11 am »
0
Nice joke  :lol: My almost 35lvl char totally agrees what I(& all dedicated xbowmen) will need a respec. Increasing pd requirements for end tier bows from 6 to 7 would be a good thing too, Steevee  :rolleyes:

Arbalests are fine in Strat(except rain time). Do whatever you want if c-rpg though. Greater skill dependency for aim & reloading time would be fine(great penalties at 0wpf, none at 150)

I forgot to write about free respec in case of implementing my idea, but it won't heppen.
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Offline [ptx]

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #19 on: September 30, 2013, 09:04:35 am »
0
Losing *most* of your HP shits on your round? Try losing ALL of your HP to a single (non-headshot) hit. :rolleyes:

Offline WITCHCRAFT

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #20 on: September 30, 2013, 09:11:43 am »
+4
Even with 160+ WPF, the reload time limits their power. An arbalest ripping you apart feels cheap 1v1, especially when the arablester is very far away and probably concealed in terrain. However, the arbalest's damage over time is nowhere near as strong as a melee weapon. There's a reason you rarely see crossbowmen topping the charts in score or kills. Battle, siege, strategus, even DTV.

A skilled arbalest user can take down important targets on the other team if they can recognize enemies by appearance. That is a benefit to their team that is not shown on the scoreboard. I still don't think they are OP though.

If you fire and miss your target, you need to pray you are in a safe spot or the target doesn't notice you. Reload time means you will often have to run away from aware enemies if you are going to reload for another shot. Depending on the map, you may only get 2 or 3 shots off before the enemy team closes in on your position. Having 75% or more of your ammo left (assuming you only have 1 slot of bolts) when enemies reach you will greatly reduce your impact in the battle. You have to run and run if you want to stand a chance of reloading. The entire time you run, you are being nearly useless to your team. A level 5 peasant could kite players to the same effect.
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Offline Kafein

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2013, 09:31:31 am »
0
Nothing personal, but after years of seeing you kick insane ammount of arse, its quite logical that any team that opposes you, should throw everything they haz at you first thing, before they start aiming for other people. :D You....and also Royanss. God damn that player.....

That exactly why the tendency to bitch about ranged in particular increases when you ask better players (which doesn't mean someone that complains a lot about ranged is necessarily good at melee...). Ranged kills are much too random and should be made more skill based on both sides. Arbalests even push that further, as there are few things more gratuitous than a mid round bolt in the chest.

Offline Tennenoth

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #22 on: September 30, 2013, 10:17:30 am »
+4
Personally, for me, it's the high missile speed coupled with the infinite hold that really gets me.

If you spot an archer aiming at you, you know they have a limited time to judge the shot & loose, then the arrow moves at a reasonable pace so that you have enough reflex time (providing you're a reasonable distance* away) to get out of the way.

With an arbalest (and in fact any crossbow) they can follow you indefinitely and they're not pushed for time, so, if you're in the open, unless they have never played an FPS (exaggeration) before you're going to have to avoid a super speed projectile. Now, I would expect most of the people playing today to have quite good reaction times (given our pedigree of playing partially reaction based games) and it's ridiculously difficult to avoid it.

In short, my opinion on arbalests, ignoring the massive reward for little risk & payload of damage that they dish out, the missile speed really detracts from a higher degree of skill needed to successfully hit a target. To suggest a change, it would be to missile speed, but that would be considered a nerf & I would preferably know the mathematical repercussions & current damage over distance.

Crossbowmen in general have their own place on the battlefield. They're very good at keeping people suppressed just by looking at their target & they should be used to effectively take down high profile targets. They have their place & of course we all hate being taken out in such a manner, but at the end of the day, they did get us.

* Please take into account I'm not talking when you're right up in the face of the ranged player, I'm talking, lets say... A ranged player on the other side of the field on "Field by the River".

I should mention I am trying to see this objectively, but failed to avoid relating it to my own personal experiences versus my own classes draw backs.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2013, 10:22:40 am by Tennenoth »
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Offline Gnjus

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #23 on: September 30, 2013, 11:10:56 am »
+3
before you're going to have to avoid a super speed projectile.


I usually stay away from item balance discussions but in this case I don't know what you people are talking about, half of the players base runs & turns around faster then the bolts, thus all your arguments are invalid. Most of the time you can sip your cup of coffee and at the same time play an Irish reel by the time a bolt reaches you and you know it.
Do you honestly think you have any sort of moral authority, Reyiz? Go genocide some more armenians and deny it ever happened, please, and stay in the middle east.
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Offline XyNox

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #24 on: September 30, 2013, 01:08:50 pm »
+1
As an archer, I can share the hate about arbalests. You can easily chain-row "click" archers to death from the edge of the map when they stop walking to take a shot. Not to mention that you dont even need an arbalest for that as the heavy crossbow is enough to one-hit most archers in the body. I did this with an STF once and topped scoreboard even though I rarely use Xbows.

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One thing I dont understand, why do Xbows still get such massive bonuses for looming ? 3 dmg on bolts and another 4 dmg for Xbow at +3.

On the other side, any nerfs to the damage or missile speed would pretty much cancel the purpose of the weapon. When it comes to the damage, people in discussions often justify it with things like "If you would see a picture of an arbalest you would know why it would be so powerful", implying that an arbalest is a massive contraption like this one:

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If so, why dont give a massive weight increase that represents its true form ? Currently a single quiver of arrows ( 10 ) weighs about the same as arb + steel bolts ( 10.3 ).
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Offline woody

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #25 on: September 30, 2013, 01:29:38 pm »
0
Arabalests are not super slow.

The reload time for a 1 shot kill weapon is fast either in terms of balance or realism.


Offline bavvoz

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #26 on: September 30, 2013, 01:40:28 pm »
+1
Its fun to take down hx and ha with arbalest :)

Offline RobertOfDrugsley

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #27 on: September 30, 2013, 01:45:15 pm »
0
One thing I dont understand, why do Xbows still get such massive bonuses for looming ? 3 dmg on bolts and another 4 dmg for Xbow at +3.

That always seemed mighty strange to me too.
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Offline Gravoth_iii

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #28 on: September 30, 2013, 02:19:44 pm »
+2
Dont mind them at all, 15 str 5 IF and around 50 bodyarmour never got oneshot, unless it was in the head ofcourse.
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Offline SirCymro_Crusader

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Re: Your Opinion on Arbalests
« Reply #29 on: September 30, 2013, 02:33:41 pm »
0
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