Message and Poll to NA

[Gash]

Gash I think the EU is experiencing this as well, It is a bug i believe

If that's the case, then my apologies, I was mis-informed.

[Rikthor]

so banning a handful of trolls out of a 100 strong clan is collective punishment? I was under the impression that like a dozen guys got banned, but surely you weren't posting about something you don't know anything about were you?

Read the quotes, they were telling them to ban everyone with a LLJK tag, whether they did anything or not. One guy was on the ATS/Hospitaler team and got banned for doing nothing. Once we saw the 3rd member get banned in a row, especially for doing nothing, we all left to prevent them from banning all of us.

[Dan lol]

The number I am hearing banned is 13, most of whom are just going to get unbanned anyway. We can get a solid number though from gash when he gets back, and hopefully this will stifle all of you talking out of your ass about a blanket goon banning. Maybe then you euros can fuck off and let us run our servers? you probably have some votes for removing your admin power to tend to anyway nuffen

[Ronan]

Haha drama indeed. You notice how many posts drama threads get? This is good, people are talking. Besides that we all need 'bad guys', or else whose going to be the good guys? I find it funny that most people love to hate and yet they try to drive the hated away. I say temp ban, they do it again temp ban and so on. Obviously though, if their "clan leader" cant keep them under some kind of control the clan should be dispersed. IMO of course

[Dan lol]

obviously we are just sowing the seeds of international hatred before strat comes up

[nuffen]

The number I am hearing banned is 13, most of whom are just going to get unbanned anyway. We can get a solid number though from gash when he gets back, and hopefully this will stifle all of you talking out of your ass about a blanket goon banning. Maybe then you euros can fuck off and let us run our servers? you probably have some votes for removing your admin power to tend to anyway nuffen

Nice one, you cant defend the collective punishment, so you attack me as a person instead. Nice. Ok, I challenge you, try the same nomination/vote system on ATS servers, and lets see if YOU survive.

PS: NAh, dont, you wont last 2 seconds.

[Dan lol]

Hey look you're talking out of your ass about shit you don't know about again

surprise!

[Gash]

I see the irony tho. In your statement "I can respect the fact that you don't support it." you distance yourself from being against collective punishment, means you actually support it, in a post where you protest against it. One word:  hypocrisy

Nuffen, how old are you?

My apologies if I sound condescending here with this question but you assume many things about my personality which are rather unwarranted.

You are publicly questioning my integrity and honesty, even though I've posted my thought and beliefs on the situation rather clearly.

I am not a hypocrite - and the fact that you make this statement with so much confidence and without knowing me is rather pathetic and speaks volume on your character and maturity.

I do not distance myself from collective punishment.  I've already stated so - I am against it. Putting words or intentions in my mouth is rather insulting.

You are being hard-headed in this issue of which you have no experience in. How you feel legit about giving us lessons is beyond me.  I don't go to EU admins and tell them how they should handle their issues and yet you have the nerve to do so. I can understand now why there are so many nominations to have you removed as admin.

I shall refrain from talking with you on the subject matter as we maintain our course to a dead-end.

[nuffen]

Im 28, and you?

I dont really assume a lot. I just respond to your answers. On one hand you react on NA being collectively punished, on the other hand you defend LLJK being collectively punished. Thats hypocrite.
I apologise if I called you a hypocrite, I was talking about your statements, not about you as a person. I dont want this to go down to a personal level, I wanna talk about the facts, the situation, whats going on on the NA servers atm.

[Jacko]

What, no, wait!

We need more ADMIN DRAMA.

Seriously, what the hell is this thread about? Ecko wants people to stop whining? He wants more credit? Man, just quit if you feel so unappreciated. You are clearly doing something right, and you will NEVER please everyone, so you better make a choice, carry on with whatever you are doing or pass on management to someone else.

It's that simple, really.

[Digglez]

I see.
We got loads of LLJKs visiting. All of em because they are banned from ATS servers. They dont cause any problems, makes me wonder, really.

Anyway, you're defending collective punishment. What if we, EU admins, started to ban all NA users, just because we got problems with some? Would you feel that that was ok?

If you dont know SA/Goon reputation from other games, you havent been on the internet for very long.  People switch MMO servers if Goons show up on theirs

They're very good at what they do, sometimes its funny most times its annoying.

[Gash]

I dont really assume a lot. I just respond to your answers. On one hand you react on NA being collectively punished, on the other hand you defend LLJK being collectively punished. Thats hypocrite. I apologise if I called you a hypocrite, I was talking about this action, not about you as a person.

Once again, there's a big difference between LLJK and most normal clans.  LLJK troll and cause problems collectively. The more of them there are, the worse it gets. They relish in that reputation and they laugh at the rage it creates. Then they'll collectively jump down an admin's throat when he makes a call on the server.  I find LLJK members to be fine when they are by themselves or only a couple of them.

Perma-mute? Shame there's no such thing. We could mute them everytime they come in - but they say it themselves, if we mute them, their trolling will become more physical in-game (kicking & punching teammates, exploiting terrain, pushing the rules to the limit, whatever a goon can come up with to annoy folks)

Peppovitch has had to deal with complaints about LLJK for a long time. It accumulated and gave the result we have today.

It's a shame really.

[nuffen]

Uhm, you were asking my age, I politely answered, whats yours?

[Tydeus]

Obviously though, if their "clan leader" cant keep them under some kind of control the clan should be dispersed. IMO of course

Goons (lljk) aren't a clan, at least not in the ways of any other crpg clan.

From someone who was there for the lljk banning, someone who has been around for BkS bannings, the shit that went down was a lot closer to collective banning rather than banning from an individual case by case basis. I'm not saying this to get on anyone's bad side or to ruffle anyone's feathers. But it seems to me that there is a fair bit of injustice that goes on specifically in Devilize's server that is always targeted at groups rather than individuals. I've got nothing against Devilize, he's one of the few people I think uses admin powers sparingly.

First, for the actual lljk collective banning incident, from my perspective, it certainly seemed like the intentions were to ban every lljk on the server. Especially considering the fact that lljk was being punished for camping when there were several other people (not affiliated with lljk) that for the previous two rounds, had been doing the exact same thing as lljk. Correct me if I'm wrong, but for this incident specifically, it sure looks like a collective ban to me. If ten robbers choose to rob a bank and nine of them are black, the tenth guy being white, there's no way in hell only nine people are going to get convicted.

Secondly, the statements of lljk members in this thread about "both sides trolling" is far too underplayed. I can go back and cite the BkS incidents much like the lljk ones, where they get banned/muted/threatened for doing things that I've seen all other clans do in the 100 man without even getting questioned by an admin. The worst I ever see lljk do, is tk each other. Something I see clan members do on a daily basis, something that doesn't harm anyone, yet lljk/BkS are the only ones I've ever seen punished for it.

Finally, as awesome as it was for Ecko(Nothing against you here ecko, setting them up with a server rather than giving them no place to go, was nice to see. Though I'd have much rather seen the bans immediately reverted.) to hook lljk up with their own server, essentially what happened was segregation. lljk were removed from the 100 man and 5 minutes later they were given their own server.

I'm surprised there's still this much lljk bashing going on in this thread. If I were put through the same shit as lljk, I'd be creating a lot more of a fuss than they currently are. I'd say it's rather mature of them to be handling this segregation issue as they are, rather than flooding the forums with shit.

[vinnytk]

I'm surprised there's still this much lljk bashing going on in this thread. If I were put through the same shit as lljk, I'd be creating a lot more of a fuss than they currently are. I'd say it's rather mature of them to be handling this segregation issue as they are, rather than flooding the forums with shit.

It's ok Tydeus, we are separate but equal

(I need to play my Dr Martin Luther King Jr character again)