Author Topic: Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?  (Read 697 times)

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Offline mulas

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Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?
« on: May 11, 2011, 11:52:19 pm »
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2h damage and speed nerfed significantly and yet polearms still the same, I keep glancing on people when I try to stab, worse is I can't block right afterward for a second or 2. This leaves me extremely vulnerable.

Either change unnerf 2h or nerf poelarms to be fair.

Offline Cyclopsided

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Re: Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2011, 02:47:35 am »
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this is the trade off to prevent 2h from having an OP thrust.
2h has more thrust distance in a faster animation, Pole arms have less thrust in a slower animation that does more damage.
2h previously had a really broken OP thrust and it is now closer to where it should be.
Also, I have declared myself #1 NA hybrid thrower
Formerly known as Marathon.
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Offline Thucydides

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Re: Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2011, 02:48:35 am »
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adjust to the new animations. I do just slightly worse using swords without wpf compared to my GLA.

Offline v/onMega

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Re: Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2011, 01:30:23 pm »
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The current stabanimation is better than the old one.

If stab woul ve kept its damage, their would be 100+ threads about stab being OP.

2h get nerfed, thats good, yet still the same 2h guys top the boards.

Differnce is, you can find players from all classes up there now.

Offline Tydeus

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Re: Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2011, 03:24:19 pm »
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The current stabanimation is better than the old one.

If stab woul ve kept its damage, their would be 100+ threads about stab being OP.

How is it any better? I'm assuming you're saying it's better because you die to it less(obviously if you died to it more that probably wouldn't mean the changes did anything, same could be said if you died to it the same as before the patch). And that's because people are using it less and less, many people don't even use Two-Handers with thrusts anymore. This is because of the overnerf to the animation. If you thrust someone and they block early in the animation, they're able to swing back and hit you while you're still recovering from the thrust animation. It means your opponent gets a free hit simply because he was able to block one of your attacks.

The statement about its damage is groundless and based on what I posted above, hard to agree with.

2h get nerfed, thats good, yet still the same 2h guys top the boards.

Differnce is, you can find players from all classes up there now.

People who topped the boards with Two-Handers weren't doing so because of the thrust. They were doing so because they were skilled, the thrust was merely a tool for them to use. Pre-patch I used the German Greatsword and I used the thrust as an opener on nearly everyone I came across. Now, I use the miaodao, a weapon that doesn't even have a thrust and I do just as good as before.

The reason you are seeing more polearm builds and sword and board builds, is because many people who were Two-Handers, simply aren't anymore. Even I went heavy polearms for a generation.

Many of the Two-Handed sword users are still raging about the change to the animation, no one I've talked to has even complained about the damage.

2h has more thrust distance in a faster animation, Pole arms have less thrust in a slower animation that does more damage.

This isn't true anymore. It's also the reason a blocked thrust can give you a free hit, because of the animation length.


Side Note: People need to realize there's two kinds of balance. Balance for the casual players and balance for the skilled players. Balance for casual players, isn't really balance. What it is, is it's removing anything from the game that takes skill to overcome. Allow me to cite every mmo that ever been released to the industry as proof. A great example of this is comparing DotA/HoN to LoL. Balance for competitive vs balance for casual.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2011, 03:29:45 pm by Tydeus »
chadz> i wouldnt mind seeing some penis on my character

Offline v/onMega

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Re: Why is 2h stab speed + damage nerfed and Polearms isn't?
« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2011, 04:43:10 pm »
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How is it any better? I'm assuming you're saying it's better because you die to it less(obviously if you died to it more that probably wouldn't mean the changes did anything, same could be said if you died to it the same as before the patch). And that's because people are using it less and less, many people don't even use Two-Handers with thrusts anymore. This is because of the overnerf to the animation. If you thrust someone and they block early in the animation, they're able to swing back and hit you while you're still recovering from the thrust animation. It means your opponent gets a free hit simply because he was able to block one of your attacks.

The statement about its damage is groundless and based on what I posted above, hard to agree with.

People who topped the boards with Two-Handers weren't doing so because of the thrust. They were doing so because they were skilled, the thrust was merely a tool for them to use. Pre-patch I used the German Greatsword and I used the thrust as an opener on nearly everyone I came across. Now, I use the miaodao, a weapon that doesn't even have a thrust and I do just as good as before.

The reason you are seeing more polearm builds and sword and board builds, is because many people who were Two-Handers, simply aren't anymore. Even I went heavy polearms for a generation.

Many of the Two-Handed sword users are still raging about the change to the animation, no one I've talked to has even complained about the damage.

This isn't true anymore. It's also the reason a blocked thrust can give you a free hit, because of the animation length.


Side Note: People need to realize there's two kinds of balance. Balance for the casual players and balance for the skilled players. Balance for casual players, isn't really balance. What it is, is it's removing anything from the game that takes skill to overcome. Allow me to cite every mmo that ever been released to the industry as proof. A great example of this is comparing DotA/HoN to LoL. Balance for competitive vs balance for casual.

Okay, your first assumption is wrong.

I play 2 handers as good as exlusively since August 2010.
Pre January patch 2h char was lvl 45.

I ve seen it all, always adapted and always kept a 4/1 k/d.
No show off, just to get you closer to my point of view:

I find it challanging, I dont see the problems in the anim. I try to find my options and possibilities for combat.

I love the animation, not comparing it to prior ones.
Being able to delay a spin thrust for 1 second or longer can be awesome... :-)
Funny enuff, I recon that the stun of a bounced or blocked stab is long, yet I just blame me for bad positioning. Rarely happens I get hit after it though.

On the other hand: If something felt overnerfed, I would be the first to open a thread, believe me.

I am a 2h enthusiast maybe thats my biggest fault :p.

About your balancing statement, well + 1 for that...
But yeah, I like the challange, prepatch stuff wasnt anymore.
Mastering the "new" stabanim. and using it effectively WHILE 90% dislike it is so much more uncasual than simply switching to polearms :-)

Btw. : Miadao is a great choice, only thing that stoped me from using it is our item restriction :-)
« Last Edit: May 12, 2011, 04:50:49 pm by v/onMega »