Author Topic: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!  (Read 7050 times)

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Offline BlindGuy

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #75 on: June 13, 2013, 06:46:07 pm »
0
It's easy to settle back and claim that's inevitable and there's no real freedom, but you are free to change it if you're an American citizen. You just need to make enough friends. Friends who whine a lot.

no. This is the biggest phallacy written here.


No amount of political pressure, civilian protest, budget cuts, etc, will stop the behemoth that is running the world you live in. You have no rights. No power. You just won't EVER be able to change ANYTHING of any meaningful value. There are too many vested interests. Too many of the ruling class of your country have invested too many generations into becoming the ruling class. They will never allow anything to interfere with their ambitions. I honestly cannot understand WHY you continue to tell yourself that you have any say. You werent born to it. Or maybe YOU were. I don't know who you are related to.

But let's be honest, PLEASE: there is no such thing as democracy in the same location as capitalism. There is no such thing as equality, equal representation, or even freedom while we have a monetary system. I'm not trying to preach the evils of capitalism or something, it is just NOT possible for everyone's best interest to be the same: Those in charge HAVE what they want, and those not in charge CANNOT have they want, or those in charge would no longer have it. The ppl who make descisions in the NATO aligned countries were never elected, they are not answerable to the public, and to pretend that the politicians you elected get to decide policy is just literally lying to youself. You do what your told, when your told to do it, or you can opt out and go be self sufficiant in a lost valley somewhere. It's not your society. Short of a revolution, there is no way to loosen the control of the power set. But, as we can clearly see from the word: revolutions are just that: a circular motion -> the most u can ever hope to achieve is a short period of time before those who were in control before are in control again. Maybe with a different puppet waved in front of you. Maybe not.

Untill you all stop craving bread and circuses, that's how life is. I am not criticizing it: It works. But when I see people purposefully telling themselves that things are not this way it makes me sick for humanity. Ffs grow up.
I don't know enough

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Offline Kafein

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #76 on: June 14, 2013, 12:41:44 am »
+1
no. This is the biggest phallacy written here.


No amount of political pressure, civilian protest, budget cuts, etc, will stop the behemoth that is running the world you live in. You have no rights. No power. You just won't EVER be able to change ANYTHING of any meaningful value. There are too many vested interests. Too many of the ruling class of your country have invested too many generations into becoming the ruling class. They will never allow anything to interfere with their ambitions. I honestly cannot understand WHY you continue to tell yourself that you have any say. You werent born to it. Or maybe YOU were. I don't know who you are related to.

But let's be honest, PLEASE: there is no such thing as democracy in the same location as capitalism. There is no such thing as equality, equal representation, or even freedom while we have a monetary system. I'm not trying to preach the evils of capitalism or something, it is just NOT possible for everyone's best interest to be the same: Those in charge HAVE what they want, and those not in charge CANNOT have they want, or those in charge would no longer have it. The ppl who make descisions in the NATO aligned countries were never elected, they are not answerable to the public, and to pretend that the politicians you elected get to decide policy is just literally lying to youself. You do what your told, when your told to do it, or you can opt out and go be self sufficiant in a lost valley somewhere. It's not your society. Short of a revolution, there is no way to loosen the control of the power set. But, as we can clearly see from the word: revolutions are just that: a circular motion -> the most u can ever hope to achieve is a short period of time before those who were in control before are in control again. Maybe with a different puppet waved in front of you. Maybe not.

Untill you all stop craving bread and circuses, that's how life is. I am not criticizing it: It works. But when I see people purposefully telling themselves that things are not this way it makes me sick for humanity. Ffs grow up.

So, who are those mysterious people in control of everything ?

Offline Kalam

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #77 on: June 14, 2013, 02:35:55 am »
0
no. This is the biggest phallacy written here.


No amount of political pressure, civilian protest, budget cuts, etc, will stop the behemoth that is running the world you live in. You have no rights. No power. You just won't EVER be able to change ANYTHING of any meaningful value. There are too many vested interests. Too many of the ruling class of your country have invested too many generations into becoming the ruling class. They will never allow anything to interfere with their ambitions. I honestly cannot understand WHY you continue to tell yourself that you have any say. You werent born to it. Or maybe YOU were. I don't know who you are related to.

But let's be honest, PLEASE: there is no such thing as democracy in the same location as capitalism. There is no such thing as equality, equal representation, or even freedom while we have a monetary system. I'm not trying to preach the evils of capitalism or something, it is just NOT possible for everyone's best interest to be the same: Those in charge HAVE what they want, and those not in charge CANNOT have they want, or those in charge would no longer have it. The ppl who make descisions in the NATO aligned countries were never elected, they are not answerable to the public, and to pretend that the politicians you elected get to decide policy is just literally lying to youself. You do what your told, when your told to do it, or you can opt out and go be self sufficiant in a lost valley somewhere. It's not your society. Short of a revolution, there is no way to loosen the control of the power set. But, as we can clearly see from the word: revolutions are just that: a circular motion -> the most u can ever hope to achieve is a short period of time before those who were in control before are in control again. Maybe with a different puppet waved in front of you. Maybe not.

Untill you all stop craving bread and circuses, that's how life is. I am not criticizing it: It works. But when I see people purposefully telling themselves that things are not this way it makes me sick for humanity. Ffs grow up.

I would love a big phallus.

I'm sorry, I couldn't resist.

It's our lot to typically justify what we believe with reason, and attempting to take a step back to perceive things as they are is impossible. Still, I fully believe meta-thought- that is, thinking (I like the color orange. Why, I ask myself? I like Newcastle United. Why? I believe in being able to say anything I want...why? Be as thorough and honest with yourself as you can) about your thoughts helps with that process.

 Get the best answer you can. Labeling a modern economic system as completely capitalist, socialist, or otherwise is misinformation. That's the kind of thing that allows people (you,me, and your cousin Sara- not some amorphous group of bankers or whatever) to more easily convince others to do whatever the fuck it is they want them to do, and, if you're like me, that means whatever serves myself and those I love best. If, in order to secure that, I need to work with a wider group of people in order ensure that, then I'm going to do it.

It's like this. Society, and the institutions within it, are built on faith. You trust your Doctor to know what's best for your health- or at least know better than you, don't you? That's what she's chosen to do with her life- practice medicine. I trust you to do whatever it is you do best. Whatever web of knowledge and skill you've chosen to devote your life to.

Life is built on this exchange, and if we can't trust our governments, they won't be successful as anything other than something with a kleptocratic bent. It's on us to keep them honest.

I do agree that no society is equal, especially not anything that embraces merit in the ways ours has. Thing is, it's still possible to for most people to become whatever they want to become. Yes, you might have to become one of "those in charge" in order to have everything but there's absolutely nothing stopping some poor kid from Detroit from becoming a Congressman one day. There are many hurdles yes, and he won't have the same opportunities as some rich kid who's parents ensure he's taught at least three 'marketable for college and high-end job' skills by the time he's eighteen, but it's possible and it happens every couple of years.

I guess we're getting to the point, though, after all that needless exposition. Our politicians don't have power and some shadowy group does, eh? Who? YOU have the truth?

Are you going to tell me that we've all been duped by Satan and you've got the secret to everything good and the after life?

No, I know you're not some hardcore religionist. Judging by reading a single post, I'd guess you're an atheist.

That's arrogance, bud. Thinking you've got the world figured in a circular argument. Not hubris. Not confidence. Just blind arrogance.

Change the world, or tell yourself you can't because somewhere deep inside, you know you don't have the will to.

Okay... why?

That's some fucked up thinking you got there. You go from not caring to "turn urself in or i call the police." Because of...? Why is there such a huge difference between "no definitive proof but strongly suspect" and "definitive proof"?

Cynicism makes idealism sweeter. I'd choose to ignore it, much like choose to ignore the starving children I've come across in my life unless they were somehow related (not just familial bonds, but relational bonds, such as knowing someone's name and holding conversations with them) to me. If I didn't know for sure that my dad was killing people, I wouldn't really care. If I did know, I would.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2013, 02:45:49 am by Kalam »

Offline Sir_Hans

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #78 on: June 14, 2013, 07:08:57 am »
+1
If ANYONE thinks that presidential elections are "democratic" or worth voting for, I suggest you look into the yale university club dubbed "skull & bones".

When bush jr, ran for his second presidential term, he was running against now and then senator john f kerry. Not only was he a yale classmate, he was a skull and bones member in the same class year as bush. A fact which neither of them has denied when being questioned on camera/ on the record.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skull_and_Bones

But honestly, this is just the tip of the iceberg, skull and bones is just one quill on the porcupine which controls most, if not all, of the world.... one factual example of many, on why you nor your children have any chance of living in a truly democratic society... not just one which just calls itself thus.




Offline SoA_Sir_ODHarry

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #79 on: June 14, 2013, 07:26:31 am »
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Crob: i'm in duel tryin to not be shit
Crob: now i'm running round eu2 with a dagger

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Offline Leshma

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #80 on: June 14, 2013, 12:29:25 pm »
+3
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Offline [ptx]

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #81 on: June 14, 2013, 12:47:19 pm »
+2
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Offline Kafein

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #82 on: June 14, 2013, 01:26:48 pm »
+2
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Except you can replace all those humans by computers with little to no understanding of semantics.

This is a big part of my specialization right there. Trust me, it's funny coming to a course that was introduced as "how to sell more things ?".

Offline Erasmas

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #83 on: June 14, 2013, 03:14:28 pm »
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Incredible interview with Edward Snowden:

http://www.liveleak.com/ll_embed?f=ce3a18468135
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Offline SixThumbs

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #84 on: June 14, 2013, 03:42:10 pm »
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Everything I've come across is either making jokes about the systems government/private entities have set up or accusing Snowden of being a hero/traitor/whistleblower/spy. He released this information in hope that it would spark a public debate and instead everyone just wants to personify the actor by focusing on the choices he made instead of people opening public discourse on what this means to civil liberties; which seems to be let's make a bunch of voyeuristic jokes.
And how!

Offline CrazyCracka420

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #85 on: June 14, 2013, 04:28:07 pm »
+1
I'm a cynic, nothing I do will change the system of government we have in place.  The election system is fucked up, without changing this, we will never have real change.  We also have so much pork in the bills that are passed, that we can't be fiscally responsible.  But that's done on purpose, because politician's pet projects get funded by being buried in other bills.  Corporations write laws and regulations for their own industries, and politicians have a revolving door in almost any industry of their choosing when they get out of politics.  It's a one big circle jerk of legal kickbacks and bribery in exchange for tax loopholes and lack of regulation/oversight. 

Unless we stop arguing with each other and focus on the overlords who rule the country, we'll never see real change.  And we'll never stop arguing with each other about social issues.   

Carlin (as usual) sums it up perfectly...I encourage you to watch:



Another one I really like about him talking about "rights" (aka you have no rights):  Fast forward to 4:20 (seriously)


Paraphrasing:  "If you still think you have rights, go to Wikipedia and search for Japanese Americans 1942 and learn all about your precious fucking 'rights'"
« Last Edit: June 14, 2013, 04:42:01 pm by CrazyCracka420 »
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Offline Swaggart

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #86 on: June 14, 2013, 04:41:52 pm »
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Wow Kalam, you wrote all that just to make an assumption that a person is atheist, and then dismiss him for arrogance based on this assumption? Yes, you wrote other things, but it was all in an effort to chastise him for not believing what you believe (and even then, you can't be sure he isn't in seminary). I won't get into a religious debate because arguing with religious people is like trying to herd cats. I would just like to recommend you not casually dismiss people for having different beliefs than you, especially when basing it off an assumption.

I will address this though:

Quote
Our politicians don't have power and some shadowy group does, eh? Who? YOU have the truth?

Financial oligarchs. It's not a big secret. It's the people who have political power simply because they have the wealth to buy it. This is not something that only happens in Russia, China or India. Watch this, although I have a feeling you will dismiss it for "arrogance."


Offline Kafein

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #87 on: June 14, 2013, 05:52:53 pm »
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If atheists are arrogant, religious people have the fault of not being arrogant enough. Simply believing in things that are not disprovable is silly and spurious but at least it is intellectually honest. Dismissing the knowledge of humanity because it is arrogant is not the same thing.

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #88 on: June 14, 2013, 07:12:52 pm »
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Need more funny pictures in this thread.

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Things don't exist simply because you believe in them, thus sayeth the almighty creature in the sky!

Offline Kalam

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Re: US goverment, Invading the internet's privacy? You DECIDE!
« Reply #89 on: June 14, 2013, 07:52:52 pm »
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You're right- that would be ridiculous. I should've phrased it better. I didn't mean he's wrong because he's an atheist- I was drawing a comparison between hardcore fundamentalists and conspiracy theorists, and as an aside, acknowledging that I don't believe he's a fundamentalist Christian/Buddhist/Muslim/Whatever. I'm saying that being a conspiracy theorist comes from a certain kind of arrogance.


I guess we're getting to the point, though, after all that needless exposition. Our politicians don't have power and some shadowy group does, eh? Who? YOU have the truth? 

That's arrogance, bud. Thinking you've got the world figured in a circular argument. Not hubris. Not confidence. Just blind arrogance.