Tipping thread (who do you tip/don't tip)

[Rumblood]

Hey, I got a great idea, why not offer everything for free and request 100% of the price as tips? More money for the people, right? Who needs roads, we can drive through densest forest with our 4x4.

Roads would be privatized, as the government already is moving to make standard. The governments are currently selling the rights to new and roads that were originally toll roads but are already paid for by the public to private companies to operate for profit. Oh yes, if they fail to mail the bill for the automated toll booths to your proper address, they can act as though they were a government entity and issue a warrant for your arrest for the unpaid bill. Imagine if you had a dispute with AT&T over your phone bill and they could send the sheriff to your door to take you to jail. The NTTA has already done this.

Oh yes, the government has not reduced the tax rate for roads even after these companies have bought the roads and charge you to drive on them.

So no, I don't think the government needs any more taxes or their fingers more firmly entrenched into any area of our country my sarcastic friend.

[Duster]

Yeah, and if you cant afford to buy a band-shirt you cant afford to go on a concert or what?

Oh wait, that comparison isnt really good because when I buy a band-shirt, I get actual value, while a tip is just something I give to someone that has just fullfilled the service I was paying for in the first place.

So basically it would be like giving the guy you just bought a band-shirt from more money for selling you the shirt.

Maybe it´s just the cultural difference and probably we wont ever get to an agreement in this discussion acceptable for both, but I have stated my opinion and I find that most people I meet in my country share it.

I was speaking as an American in America, where the accepted standard is that the waiter takes care of you, and you tip the waiter. Because it's their income. What's sad is that people have the same attitude as you, but they live in America.

[Leesin]

Here's a free tip. Don't eat in places where tips are expected as part of the service. Eat at McDonald's or a cafeteria where they don't. Or eat at home. You aren't forced to eat at those establishments. It is part of the business practice in the U.S. and you are well aware of it. Case in point, depending upon the restaurant, they automatically add a 15% gratuity on parties larger than X number of people. Why? Because their servers are being taxed on a percentage of your bill and while being stiffed by a single person doesn't hurt that much, larger tables do. And yes, it is called being stiffed.
The only reason you should walk out without paying an appropriate tip is when the waiter simply didn't service your table properly, e.g. you were constantly without a drink refill, your food came out cold, etc. Otherwise you are just as much a douche as you make the people out to be who expect you to follow the common expected business model.

But they can't force you to tip, expecting people who have nothing to do with the business to follow the "expected business model" is a joke, tips are a privilege, not a right, you've got to earn those tips and people shouldn't expect to get them or a specific %, they should be thankful they got them at all considering it is down to ones own free will whether they leave a tip or not. A free tip to that shitty "business model" if that's what you call it, get real, pay the waiters more money because relying on tips is good as not having a job.

[B3RS3RK]

Seriously, you don't understand what you would get if you got your way. You are asking to be fucked in the ass with a bristle brush.

Okay, so why does it work in europe, then?

Instead of insinsting on this kind of makeshift approach on the topic, the whole system should be revamped.

But really, whatever.I don´t live in the US so I already care much more than I should.
It seems that most people who gew up to this practice are fine with it, so be it.

My main problem with the System is that, all over the world, by law and by custom, when you buy something, it´s yours.There´s a price tag on things and services, and if you pay that price, you will get that object or service.To take something like tips for granted or act like it´s mandatory while it is not rooted in actual law is irrational.

As I already said, it is probably only cultural difference why we have such a different opinion on this topic, so, to each his own now.I know if things like that started to get customary in germany, I would act against it.

[chadz]

Having a debate about tips is (from my experience) usually getting very hot if US is amongst themselves.

Add some euros to the discussion and it's not moving anywhere.

US and EU is completely different, there's no purpose at all in comparing.

From what I understand, in the US, waiters need the tip to survive. And the tip isn't really a tip, it's a more or less fixed percentage that you can't decide yourself. I've also heard that restaurants will not let you leave if you do not pay a tip. Literally stop you from walking out if you don't pay a tip. It's basically a tax on food, just without a legal background, just a social one.

In (most places in) the EU, the waiters get a shitty wage as well, but enough to make a living. When you don't give a tip, most waiters will ignore it, some will be slightly weird, but rarely does one say something.

In the end, I think the cost is the same in both EU and US (relatively speaking).

As for my personal tipping: I tip usually around 1€, for guys that deliver food to my flat, for my favorite diners where they serve exceptionally good food, and when going out and the service was at least ok. If I feel the waiter didn't really care, I don't tip.

[Mala]

... Under your system you couldn't. Then it would result in the employee paying more to the government in taxes because they would pay exactly what the employer reports that they are paying them, which would be less than good waiters and waitresses make under the current system.

...
The employer would have to pay more in matching social security and medicaid taxes, but not much and they would ...

Umm, this will backfire later. If you and your employer pay less in social security, then you get less in return when you need it.

[dynamike]

I'm a German living in the US and what pisses me off is that because waiters do not earn a sufficient basic salary, tipping has lost its meaning of "giving extra to appreciate quality service".

Now everyone feels entitled to it (+ needs the tips to make a living) and gets pissed off if you tip less to show your displeasure with the service you have received.

Again, not the waiters' fault - but the system sucks.

[Rumblood]

I'm a German living in the US and what pisses me off is that because waiters do not earn a sufficient basic salary, tipping has lost its meaning of "giving extra to appreciate quality service".

Now everyone feels entitled to it (+ needs the tips to make a living) and gets pissed off if you tip less to show your displeasure with the service you have received.

Again, not the waiters' fault - but the system sucks.

No, the waiters know when they've received a good tip and appreciate the gesture.

[Kafein]

Umm, this will backfire later. If you and your employer pay less in social security, then you get less in return when you need it.

If you as an average citizen pay less in social security, the money you save is millions of times larger than what you would get out of that same amount of money through any social security you might need. As long as no real disputes occur, everybody involved profits from black market transactions.