Author Topic: What do western people think about Syria? What does your media tell you?  (Read 5914 times)

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Offline donib

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Here is the truth:

Ataturk was a zionist and helped the west to destroy the caliphate.  :wink:

Offline zagibu

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+2
While most conspiracy theories are too fleshed out to make sense (they often contain contradictions), it should be clear that western nations profit from regular wars in the middle east. Not only is it good for selling weapons, but it also hinders the general development of these countries, which means they consume less of their natural resources and have more ready for export. And yes, I know that Syria isn't particularly resource-rich.
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 Why am I beswung by sharpe and pointed utensyls?

Offline Kafein

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Sunni(a ridicilous islamic sect)

wait what

Isn't sunni the global name for like 80% of islam, as opposed to shia ?


Also, truth is that nasrtv seems about as trustworthy as Fox News, and less subtle about their bullshit if that is at all possible. Also Syria is a bloody mess. Both the government and some rebel factions have good reasons to open a conflict with foreign powers (not always the same though).


Offline Herkkutatti666

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+2
blame america and israel for everything
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Offline donib

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some ones irrelevant opinion
« Last Edit: May 20, 2013, 07:59:47 pm by donib »

Offline Henry_Broodsonson

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"Just found out my opinion isnt valid in this thread."

Okay, come back when you're ready to start barking at the moon. :/

Offline Overdriven

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+1
A: I think the refugee situation is pretty sad

The refugee part is the main bit I've been keeping up with. The numbers are simply appalling and they are only increasing every day.

Other than that for me it just seems to be a war a bunch of different groups who are all as bad as each other. As far as I'm concerned, whoever eventually wins it will be no better than what it started with.

wait what

Isn't sunni the global name for like 80% of islam, as opposed to shia ?

Yup the vast majority of Muslims are Sunni

Sunni is in short for ahl as-sunnah wa l-jamāʻah. Basically a sunni is someone who follows the path or the traditions of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh. And you are right most of the muslims are on this and shia is one of the sects who are not of the sunnah, the problems are in the fundaments of the faith and the division was mainly political, ie people who were after power. After the shia there are plenty more sects in islam, as the prophet himself said "Islam will divide into 73 sects" (part of his quote, aka hadith). The Alawites that are in Syria and also in Turkey are considered to be a sect by this ahl as-sunnah wa l-jamāʻah (jama'ah is something like majority) and they, the alawites, are offspring of the Shia.

Please don't ever quote the Hadith. They are an even bigger load of crap than the New Testament. I don't care what reasoning it's for it's not in the least applicable.

But you're right in saying the divisions were political. Only made worse by vastly differing version of the Hadith between the different sects. It's to the point now where despite the Quran saying only follow the Quran, huge swathes of Muslim's follow the Hadith more.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2013, 03:41:21 pm by Overdriven »

Offline Overdriven

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Forgot to edit lol.

Offline donib

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It's to the point now where despite the Quran saying only follow the Quran, huge swathes of Muslim's follow the Hadith more.

That is not true. You cant simply follow the Qur'an and disregard hadith.

And i will tell you why.

For example, both the Shia and the Sunni have the Qur'an yet they are fundamentally different. The Shia consider some of the Companions to be apostates or kafirs and by that they can disregard maybe 10.000 of ahadeeth. And we both agreed before that the split was political.

But what do we see today? The Shia have legalized prostitution (So called nikah mut'ah) and some of them even consider the Qur'an is corrupt, all because they discarded loads of hadith because they are of the source of people who they claim to be apostates.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2013, 03:51:43 pm by donib »

Offline Leshma

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Quote
My parents for example in communist yugoslavia, islam was really restricted by the communist and while before the ww2, burka and fully veiled women were really common in the streets of bosnia, after ww2 it was all gone. What one Imam (spiritual leader) told me recently that he sees more and more youth in bosnia waking up 4:00 am to go to the local mosque and offer their morning prayers there and that is a very healthy sign. So the youth have more acces to the proper islamic education while their parents didnt.

That's because communism is against religion, any religion (we can argue that communism is another form of religion). Communists are mostly atheists. And what Imam said is true. Last time I've been to my birthplace I've seen that with my eyes. That small town was multinational, now it's mainly muslim and it shows. I bet you can't find a place in Istanbul like that. Maybe in Teheran...

Also I think that education is a universal thing, it doesn't belong to muslims, catholics, communists etc. I think the correct term you were looking for is indoctrination.

Offline Overdriven

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That is not true. You cant simply follow the Qur'an and disregard hadith.

The first Hadith were written over 100 years after Mohammed's time. They are a collection of 'stories' written from word of mouth that past down through generations and some idiot Caliph decided to write down. They are continually edited over time by Islamic 'scholars' and despite several Hadith saying first hand that nothing should be followed post Quran, they still are (contradiction much). I converted to Islam and my fiancée is Muslim. One of the fundamental things I decided after a lot of extensive research and talking to many other Muslims was that following anything other than the Quran goes against the very basics of Islam.

The problem is they were only ever meant to be a record of Mohammed's life to supplement the teaching in the Quran to give you a broader understanding. But now in many societies they are considered law and usually turned to before the Quran. Which is wrong on every level and also one of the reasons for such massive divisions between different sections of Islam.

For example, both the Shia and the Sunni have the Qur'an yet they are fundamentally different. The Shia consider some of the Companions to be apostates or kafirs and by that they can disregard maybe 10.000 of ahadeeth. And we both agreed before that the split was political.

But what do we see today? The Shia have legalized prostitution (So called nikah mut'ah) and some of them even consider the Qur'an is corrupt, all because they discarded loads of hadith because they are of the source of people who they claim to be apostates.

Well that's precisely like the sect of Islam I'm reading about now that was well established in the ruling classes of the Moghul's of India. They believed themselves to be direct descendants of Mohammed and even went so far as to ban any marriage out side of their community. But such thinking is also flawed.

In my opinion though I'd much rather rely on the Quran which has under gone minimal changes, certainly in the modern era. The Hadith however are continuously edited which automatically draws a line under them as being largely fabricated.

Here we go...a nice quick thing about it for others:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/islam/subdivisions/sunnishia_1.shtml

Now I personally believe much of that to be very loose history. Mohammed's life story is continuously debated and so is his legacy. Which is why I'd much rather rely on something supposed to be more solid, than something constantly changing. At least in terms of the fundamentals. Regardless of that though my faith is my own and I certainly fall into a little bit of a hole when it comes to being put into groups with other Muslims.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2013, 04:04:24 pm by Overdriven »

Offline SixThumbs

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Well, I like to think I'm slightly more informed then the average person in my age-group/culture but all I've been able to gather, like Overdriven, is my country (the U.S.) doesn't like the current regime and we may or may not be giving support and weaponry to the rebels while all the while a metric-shit ton of refugees are flooding into Jordan and Turkey.
And how!

Offline baybars

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to the guy who said he avoids hadith, what a seriously jahel notion, Allah tells us in quran for example prayer is prescribed on the believers, but Allah does not tell us how to pray for example, we get that from sunnah ie hadith so now if u reject hadith how do u pray? do u pray based on how u think u should? you cant reject one part of hadith and accept other ie prayer ones that is being a munafiq, hadith is bigger than just what the prophet said but its our way.
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Offline Christo

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+6
I wonder when will Humanity stop killing because of crafted fairytales.

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