Author Topic: 0.3.0.0  (Read 16187 times)

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Offline IG_Saint

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #60 on: May 20, 2013, 11:03:08 pm »
0
In this post, chadz did say "You can expect your wpf points to be wiped when this happens." about the wpf changes, but I wouldn't expect a complete respec. As far as I can remember the only time (after the very old days) the devs have given a complete respec was after the big patch that added the current retirement and max lvl system.

Offline Prpavi

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #61 on: May 20, 2013, 11:51:49 pm »
+2
In this post, chadz did say "You can expect your wpf points to be wiped when this happens." about the wpf changes, but I wouldn't expect a complete respec. As far as I can remember the only time (after the very old days) the devs have given a complete respec was after the big patch that added the current retirement and max lvl system.

I think doing somtehing so radical as removing wpf points at this moment would be a welcome breath of fresh air in the mod.
And now he can't play because of "common sense" and he doesn't understand how this common sense works
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Offline karasu

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #62 on: May 21, 2013, 12:09:12 am »
+1
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Offline Phew

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #63 on: May 21, 2013, 04:18:48 am »
+2
chadz did say "You can expect your wpf points to be wiped when this happens." about the wpf changes, but I wouldn't expect a complete respec.

well, the people most screwed by a wpf curve change would be people with 0 WM, and those people wouldn't benefit from a "wpf wipe". They would want some mechanism to convert points in other skills to weapon master. Like I said before though, those people shouldn't be rewarded for their prior min/maxing.

Offline Angantyr

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #64 on: May 21, 2013, 07:18:08 am »
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The wpf curve rework should not yield really much faster results for those with wpf, it should instead slow down those WITHOUT it compared to where they are now.

Offline Chris_the_Animal

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #65 on: May 21, 2013, 10:05:19 am »
0
Since 3.0 I have problems to find servers when searching "Internet" wide...
In my favorites everything is okay...but when I search for Internet i cant find servers like NA_3 and others...

Any solutions or suggestion what I can do or change?
Bros never die!

Offline cmp

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #66 on: May 21, 2013, 12:55:18 pm »
+7
The wpf curve rework should not yield really much faster results for those with wpf, it should instead slow down those WITHOUT it compared to where they are now.

Yeah, this is what we plan to do.

Offline F i n

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #67 on: May 21, 2013, 02:18:12 pm »
+2
6) plan to go away from the multi system

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Offline Panos

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #68 on: May 21, 2013, 02:20:51 pm »
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Yeah, this is what we plan to do.

can you give us an ETA at least  :?:
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Offline cmp

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #69 on: May 21, 2013, 02:22:03 pm »
+5
ETA: when it's done.

Offline F i n

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #70 on: May 21, 2013, 02:24:23 pm »
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ETA: when it's done.

Answers that actually dont answer anything. Love them.
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Offline Angellore

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #71 on: May 21, 2013, 02:33:48 pm »
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Almost a year ago chadz wrote those changes are planned, so you can figure out yourself when they will be done :D.

Offline Christo

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #72 on: May 21, 2013, 04:45:01 pm »
+5
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Offline Turboflex

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #73 on: May 21, 2013, 05:39:07 pm »
+1
Right now, most builds have a choice between like 2% more speed and damage from 5+ points in Weapon Master, or 8%+ more damage from more strength+power strike/~20% more HP from Ironflesh/Riding skill to ride the best horses/etc. Weapon master is too crappy of a skill compared to all other skills/stats (at least for dedicated builds).

I think the leading proposal is to remove "free" wpf from leveling, replace it with wpf from the agility stat, coupled with making Weapon Master more rewarding to spec. This simultaneously makes agility and weapon master more effective.

There are lvl 33+ guys running around with builds like 30/18, all their points in PS+athletics, with a +3 longsword/HBS or similar and loomed medium armor. They are top-tier in damage, speed, and survivability, with nearly no compromises. The balanced/agility builds with weapon master should be a viable option compared to these juggernaughts, and a wpf rework is the best way to make this happen.

Still don't see the point.

First off, right now you have people with high PS not just cuz they don't have WM but cuz everyone is running around in 55-70 loomed armor. I have 8 PS which is high for a shielder, not cuz I'm trying to min-max but because I need that PS to actually hurt these armoured people with a slash damage weapon (even a high one with 38c), let alone in strat battles where armor is usually over 70.

So what's going to be done about armor? Nerf PS-STR builds and high loomed armor just gets indirectly buffed.

Second, take a look at the most dangerous players around. They all know animation breaking tricks, all the best 2h can do this animation breaking double hilt slash thing, polearms can do this point blank animation breaking stab where they bring it up quick then down, and shielders have animation breaking turns also. None of this is dependent on WPF, they could have zero and still do this. Compared to this speed from broken animation tricks, even 200 wpf is a marginal improvement.

Third, WM is already balanced: It's a specialty skill for people either trying to get 180+ wpf for certain weapons where it actually is marginally effective (super slow ones like long maul or arbalast, or super fast ones for a marginal boost to ultimate spam) and for hybrids. If you have multiple melee, or melee + range, you need to sacrifice some points for WM. Seems fair to me. The mistake is people think you need WM otherwise, or need WPF past like 110-120.

So again, I don't see the point, or the point is based on faulty calculations and will lead to unintended consequences: PS is currently to counter high armor, nerf it and you buff armor. If I have to drop from 24-15 to 18-18 to get more WM, well goodbye to cut weapons I guess I will have to use a steel pick instead to open up 65 armor people in reasonable time. Also the fastest meleers don't use WPF anyway, they use turns and the engine's bad animations.

Now the devs are smart guys and I don't think they'd just patch in a mess of a rebalance, but taking this on seems like a more effort than it's worth and won't accomplish anything except to mollify some weirdoes here who have an obsession with having their gimmick 12-27 ninja builds perfectly "fairly balanced" with everyone else.

Offline engurrand

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Re: 0.3.0.0
« Reply #74 on: May 21, 2013, 05:47:10 pm »
-1
Still don't see the point.

First off, right now you have people with high PS not just cuz they don't have WM but cuz everyone is running around in 55-70 loomed armor. I have 8 PS which is high for a shielder, not cuz I'm trying to min-max but because I need that PS to actually hurt these armoured people with a slash damage weapon (even a high one with 38c), let alone in strat battles where armor is usually over 70.

So what's going to be done about armor? Nerf PS-STR builds and high loomed armor just gets indirectly buffed.

Second, take a look at the most dangerous players around. They all know animation breaking tricks, all the best 2h can do this animation breaking double hilt slash thing, polearms can do this point blank animation breaking stab where they bring it up quick then down, and shielders have animation breaking turns also. None of this is dependent on WPF, they could have zero and still do this. Compared to this speed from broken animation tricks, even 200 wpf is a marginal improvement.

Third, WM is already balanced: It's a specialty skill for people either trying to get 180+ wpf for certain weapons where it actually is marginally effective (super slow ones like long maul or arbalast, or super fast ones for a marginal boost to ultimate spam) and for hybrids. If you have multiple melee, or melee + range, you need to sacrifice some points for WM. Seems fair to me. The mistake is people think you need WM otherwise, or need WPF past like 110-120.

So again, I don't see the point, or the point is based on faulty calculations and will lead to unintended consequences: PS is currently to counter high armor, nerf it and you buff armor. If I have to drop from 24-15 to 18-18 to get more WM, well goodbye to cut weapons I guess I will have to use a steel pick instead to open up 65 armor people in reasonable time. Also the fastest meleers don't use WPF anyway, they use turns and the engine's bad animations.

Now the devs are smart guys and I don't think they'd just patch in a mess of a rebalance, but taking this on seems like a more effort than it's worth and won't accomplish anything except to mollify some weirdoes here who have an obsession with having their gimmick 12-27 ninja builds perfectly "fairly balanced" with everyone else.

The animations are not broken. Thats how they are supposed to work.
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