Hello. I guess I'll explain part of what went down last night from my perspective.
I believe the rule is if you are in an unplayable area, you must do your best to get out, or go spec/quit. Normally, it doesn't take Canary an hour to enforce this on battle, I wonder why it did here.
It took longer than it would have in the battle server because there was more at stake. Instead of smoothing the progression from round to round during any similar situation that would come up in the regular battle server we had to actually look at different sides of an issue in order not to waste the resources of dozens of peoples' spent time with what might have been a bad call.
The rule you're referring to, incidentally, is
no camping unreachable areas, not "being in an 'unplayable area'", whatever that means. A more appropriate rule to cite would be NOT OK: exploiting invisible barriers. To what extent spawning uncontrollably in an area of a map you can't easily escape from is considered "exploiting", well, that's the question, isn't it?
And it was less than an hour, actually. I was still spawning on flags in the proper part of the town by the time I decided to stop respawning altogether in order to confer better with the other admins via I-chat. Attackers only started "going for flags" around 47 minutes before the fight ended,
including overtime due to attacker retreat.
Listen:
Here's why we didn't make a ruling before the issue came to the forefront of the battle (that is, when the attacking side was asking admins to make a ruling
before it really came up so that they could change their strategy): It would have hinged upon admins predicting the outcome of a battle and assigning victory based upon that prediction. Before the issue had even come into play. Past battles had seen victory for attackers in spite of the bug at this fief, so it wasn't a certainty that it was going to become this big of a problem. In the past we've kicked people behind the barrier, but they were hiding, not fighting, and tickets were down to zero for defense.
While there are precedents for defenders delaying at the end of strat fights and being kicked for it, it almost always comes down to them positioning themselves in an area of a fief without any spawn flags (or tickets remaining). If they're in an otherwise unreachable position under more normal circumstances (say, if attackers run out of ladders) and if they
have got a flag they can continue to spawn on, they are allowed to remain there by rights.
There are also precedents for
attacker spawns having invisible walls making them unreachable to defenders to capture. It's not immediately punishable to be in a position behind an invisible wall, in a strategus scenario that would be a ridiculous rule to enforce in light of the unpredictable nature of map quality and spawn selection. If you're attacking from behind the barrier, there's a problem, yes. If you're standing behind the barrier and doing nothing and you're one of the last players alive at the end of a fight, that is also a problem. It's unfortunate for defenders, when there could be a theoretical scenario where the flag being captured would've swayed the outcome of the fight. When battles have come down to attackers having only one remaining flag behind a barrier, they aren't immediately removed from the server assuming they're still attempting to attack the defense (after coming out of the barrier, of course).
There were several reasons not to jump to conclusions and start kicking the entire defending team for spawning at a spot where the attackers had an incredibly difficult time reaching them.
In the end we were going to go with giving it to the attackers on this one. However, along the line of discussing the issue with other admins, I wound up in a conversation with Hospitaller leadership. I started talking to Peppovitch about the nature of strategus issues and the glitch in question, about the exploitation of game mechanics and the feeling of abandonment by the devs most players are feeling. I talked with him about how this battle would go if there was no glitched spawn. How it could serve the game to play it as it was intended, despite the intended mechanics being broken. I discussed with him how he had an opportunity to play better, and eventually he took it. Instead of handing out rulings, I allowed the people at the short end of the stick to be the better men.
I'm sorry that it took so long to get to the conclusion. (most of all to Les Chevaliers Occitan and Velucan Empire, as their following battle was delayed by several minutes, and also to the mercs involved in the following fights)
I'm not sorry that I helped some players treat the game better and play it better, instead of sullying it with unnecessary arbitration and furthering the rift between already clashing personalities. I'm not sorry if you guys have more respect for the Hospitallers and their actions as a result of this, even if that means I lose more of your already waning respect for me.
It was clear FCC had complete control of the city. It was a matter of an unreachable flag that spared Hosp for some time. I think most players on FCC side including me were mad about the admins decision( that took way too long ). Also we are blaming Canary because he doesn't give a shit about FCC( everyone knows ). You can side track or stand up for your fellow admin. But I know Canary is biased. If it was Chaos in FCC's position Canary would jump on it right away like a bird to a worm. In NA1 as murder stated. I hate this bird brain. I think he was a good admin when he started but now he is a "has been". If you can't handle such an important responsibility just step down and do us all a favor. A bigger favour if you can pop a couple pills at the same time.
Completely and totally biased against FCC, totally pro-Hospitaller.
Relax Mal, Wesley is only implying that Canary forgot to take his Common Sense pills.
But it's only because some of you FCC and Fimbulvetr folks forgot to take your chill pills.
There is no question of fault here, we are not trying to place blame.
I dunno, it certainly seems like I'm getting blamed despite your side having gotten your way in the end.
Hospi still had a very low chance of winning. What would have happened was with timer out we would have killed your final 300 tickets eventually. We had plate on, you were naked and coming through a very limited choke that was surrounded. We were building healing tents too so even if you managed to land a cudgel hit it on someone they'd heal it. It would have taken another hour but we woulda killed those 300 tickets it eventually with you guys on 60 second respawns.
Never give them the odds.
Pretty sure that "enforcing rules" seems to get you deadminned/threatened to be permabanned in this community. The devs are ignorant and the admins are all shamelessly petty and corrupt or obsessed with internet Power due to failed real lives (or use the position to pursue pedophiliac urges with impunity despite warning the heads of the game). Expect nothing to ever be done about anything remotely attempting to enforce fair rules and fun in the game unless you bribe admins with cRPG gold/looms or are in a clan with them. I'm dead serious.
Fuck Admins. Fuck cRPG. Play Other Games 2013.
I think we've all figured out that that's your biggest problem, by now.
Ten years I was a referee for the NHAHA (volunteer) and I have never seen a bigger display of dilatory in my life. It is almost as if the admins went out of their way to waste as much time as possible JUST to say that they gave it "due process". I have handed out real life suspensions to athletes after careful review in less time and with even more unclear rules/precedents. Absolutely shameful.
You have more experience being a referee than I have being an admin, I'll give you that. I'm sure if I knew as much about hockey as you do I could've handled this issue not entirely related to rule violations in a distinct and vastly more intricate and dynamic environment with far less clearly defined rules and guidelines in mere seconds!
it's unfortunate you guys didn't have better armor to sit afk and leech with in the unreachable spot for 2 hours.
Why you gotta be raidin', Homey?
