so are shielders the strongest class now or what?

[Grumbs]

So you respond by being "overly sensitive" to people with differing opinions by saying they are "blasting" someone due to a mere downvote?

Its petty, thats all. Saying "blasting" is overly sensitive? You part of the problem if you think so. People need to chill and let people post without getting personal

[Grumbs]

So who here would be interested in me taking a screenshot at the end of EVERY battle map I play from now on, and see who is in the top 5 for each team?


After three years of this silliness, I am so tempted...

People doing well with a class doesn't represent its strength or OPness. It depends on what inputs are required from the player, and how safe the player can be while dealing damage. Risk vs reward etc. Ranged should not be ever anywhere near top because of their relative safety from which they can deal damage. Similar with shielders (but not as bad as ranged)

[Matey]

I only read page one. Shielders are not OP. They are actually under powered. Their thrust is unreliable, the overhead doesn't have the insanely long hang-time that the 2h does, their right and left swings are pretty good but they still can't throw the same kind of goofy feints that 2h and polearm can. They have the shortest weapons and are the easiest to kick, they can't kick and block but everyone without a shield can (at least on NA, I heard they fixed kicking on EU... lucky bastards). Hoplites have exactly ONE attack direction, yeah they can be pretty good support but if you lose to hoplite in 1v1 it is your own fault. Backpedalling as a shielder is far less effective than backpedalling with a long hafted blade or a long bardiche or other such weapons, you typically have to dart forward to actually get into range to hit anyone with a shield, also in order to have the mobility to actually backpedal effectively, you need to go light armour with a high agi build, in other words you die in 1-2 hits and you do shit damage so you have to hit people a lot.

Buff 1handers.

[Nehvar]

My shielder that I rarely play does better in siege/battle than my main, a two-hander.  I don't know exactly why that is though so I'm a bad example.  I think this game hates me.

If siege and battle get shield bash as it is now...oh man...shielders, shielders everywhere.

[Phew]

I´m playing my lvl 30 18/18 1h shield alt at the moment and it is more effective than my lvl 33 main 2h spammer.

I make more points, survive longer and can slaughter archer folks easily. It definitily does not need any kind of a buff. It´s fine as it is.

I´m even thinking about respeccing my main to 1h shield once I reach lvl 34, because it´s so much more effective on battle mode.

The class is most effective at earning points/valour, since those are based on being alive and near the action. They are not the most effective at actually killing people. Once the reward system is reworked (as I'm sure it will be), all will be well.

I know shielders aren't OP, because they are the #2 easiest class for me to kill behind archers. 2h is still by far the hardest, because they can 1-2 shot me (using 'tricks' like hiltslash and lolstab and blockkick), but I need like 8 hits to kill them with a 1h sword. Against other shielders, I can usually break their shield with like 4-5 axe swings, then they die in about 3-4 swings. So same number of hits required, but if I mess up against the 2h, I'm done. You can make all kinds of mistakes when fighting a shielder and still win.

Now, the top shielders are really tough, but so are the top players in any class.

[Tears of Destiny]

youre implying that 2h heroes rule the servers still i believe.

No, I'm implying that there is a wonderful spread every time I play, and the percentages of top performers match up pretty well with the percentage of who is playing what... On average.


Also note that the map or even mode (Battle VS Siege VS Duel (Which is a microsystem of what can happen in any mode)) modifies to a certain extent who does what better.


Most people when "balancing" only look at a small window of the game and not the grand scope of things, and make dumbshit threads.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

youre implying that 2h heroes rule the servers still i believe.
They do.
why should 2h/polearm users be equal with shielders in terms of damage and kills? you get the easiest valor by being a shileder or cav, you are here to soak up dmg not deal one. 2H WILL ALLWAYS BE THE CLASS THAT GETS THE MOST KILLS BECAUSE THAT IS THEIR ROLE!!! get it right fellas and start playing your roles on the battlefield, equaling 2h/1h and arcehrs makes no sense. you can't play defensivley with 2h you cant make a shieldwall and protect your teammates, you can only slay, why are you all so jelly ffs.
lawl, and in everything but strat shieldwalls are pretty useless.
do you actually believe that 2h is an easier class to play and master?
Yes, most noobs can do much better with 2h than 1h, even though they can't block, and most somewhat bellow average players can perform much better with 2h, average players can perform much better with 2h, good players can perform much better with 2h. Also note that I'm talking 2h and not poles, 2h are pretty superior to polearms, 1h is still the weakest melee class, but poles aren't near 2h. (now go ahead and whine about op glaives who can kick you when you come close and outreach your sideswings and nearly match your stab, the only reason you have issues with glaives is becaused you're used to outreaching everything and therefore not capable of comprehending the idea of staying inside your weapons reach and his weapons reach without just facehuggin'.

[Ujin]

I'm really tired to elaborate , so i'll make it short, here's my opinion :

- shielders have the survivability in clusterfucks and protection against multiple opponents/ranged. In exchange they get teamhit the most , have to take the beating in the front lines and have overall less damage output as well as mobility, not to mention some of the most annoying problems that come from animations.

- two handers are the class that specializes in either mobility or taking punishment (both is possible via min-maxing) depending on the build and also delivering the most amount of damage in the shortest amount of time. Superior animations also are very helpful for dueling AND for crowd fights too.

- polearms have the widest variety of equipment to choose from (both cav and infantry specialized), good damage output and some of the most versatile weapons out there (poleaxe), however their animations are still sub-par compared  to 2h, but not that much.


To sum it up, i think it's pretty good as it is atm.

[Ronin]

I'm really tired to elaborate , so i'll make it short, here's my opinion :

- shielders have the survivability in clusterfucks and protection against multiple opponents/ranged. In exchange they get teamhit the most , have to take the beating in the front lines and have overall less damage output as well as mobility, not to mention some of the most annoying problems that come from animations.

- two handers are the class that specializes in either mobility or taking punishment (both is possible via min-maxing) depending on the build and also delivering the most amount of damage in the shortest amount of time. Superior animations also are very helpful for dueling AND for crowd fights too.

- polearms have the widest variety of equipment to choose from (both cav and infantry specialized), good damage output and some of the most versatile weapons out there (poleaxe), however their animations are still sub-par compared  to 2h, but not that much.


To sum it up, i think it's pretty good as it is atm.

Good analysis, but let me add two things:
- One hander's short reach can be an advantage to avoid doing tk and killing the enemy in crowd fights.

-Polearmers and twohanders can spam without the fear of staying dead for a whole round, because they can spawn 5-30 sec later. For siege of course.

[Zlisch_The_Butcher]

To sum it up, i think it's pretty good as it is atm.

Just sayin', but 1h no shield get none of the 1h bonuses besides sexy animations.

[Kafein]

do you actually believe that 2h is an easier class to play and master?

Yes ?

Reach and footwork became extremely dominant factors in melee gameplay, to some extent replacing blocking, feints, holds and whatnot, hence why a short weapon is an enormous disadvantage. Low reach forces you to be extremely concentrated on keeping your opponent close enough, which is already not trivial, and instantly switch to a defensive behavior in case he goes out of your reach, even when that happens in the middle of one of your swings. Spectate a good shielder and a good 2h and count the number of times they have to block and the number of times they have to interrupt one of their own attacks to block, maybe you'll see what I'm talking about.

People doing well with a class doesn't represent its strength or OPness. It depends on what inputs are required from the player, and how safe the player can be while dealing damage. Risk vs reward etc. Ranged should not be ever anywhere near top because of their relative safety from which they can deal damage. Similar with shielders (but not as bad as ranged)

Shielders have to be closer to their target and hit it more often to kill it, how is that less dangerous ?

[Matey]

Just sayin', but 1h no shield get none of the 1h bonuses besides sexy animations.

yeah 1h no shield is what really needs love, but it is hard to buff that without overbuffing shielders. I still think improving the animations or adding a damage or two to the majority of 1h weapons would help.

[oprah_winfrey]

yeah 1h no shield is what really needs love, but it is hard to buff that without overbuffing shielders. I still think improving the animations or adding a damage or two to the majority of 1h weapons would help.

One handers already have the best animations...

[Phew]

One handers already have the best animations...

If you evaluate the "quality" of an animation by the size of its sweetspot and reach bonus, 2h has equal or superior animations for every attack direction.

All 1h has going for it over 2h is that left swing tends to hit the head, but 2h sideswings have the "crouch" feature with is a nice defense bonus (and counter to the 1h left swing, since they duck under it by attacking). 1h right swing glances during the first 40% of the animation and has a long delay and 1h thrust has a whole litany of problems. Overhead is about the same for all three weapon types, except 2h gets a nice reach bonus.

[Prpavi]

oki thats your opinion, i have no problem with different opinions.

for the record i play Polearms now either bamboo or LHB, so im in no way a kuyak hero trying to lobby for 2h but most of 2h hero hate is unjustified and utter bullcrap. i find polearms to be a better choice atm.