Author Topic: One Hander Build Help  (Read 4167 times)

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Offline oprah_winfrey

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2012, 08:53:50 pm »
+2
IMO you want 6 ps and 6 ath, anything more on either of those is just gravy. So if you dont plan on retiring, or dont think max IF/WM are worth it, go ahead and get an additional ps or ath, but I would suggest not going below 6 ps or 6 ath.

Offline rustyspoon

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2012, 09:38:18 pm »
+1
Rusty, when you add holds and speed bonus it stacks with PS, so it should increase the spread between 6 & 8 because everything is magnified, not lower this spread...

Also even if that italian sword hit a "fluke" threshold, it still shows how tough a time a finesse low damage slash weapon has with guys at 55+ armor. Usually it's better vet players wearing 55+ armor too (Kuyak weight armor + gloves heirloomed tops 55+), and it gets tougher to lay 4-5+ (assuming hold + speed bonus) hits on them when they maybe need to hit you 2-3 times with a beefy 2h or polearm. If 8 PS can cut that that down to 3 hits, that's at the very least 33% better at killing hard targets, a significant difference in a tough fight on a chaotic battlefield.

Sort of, but not really. Again this is mostly a factor for 1-handed weapons because of the low initial damage. Another huge factor is the fact that everything in this mod is based on percentages.

1st off, higher agility will have a higher on average speed bonus, so they'll get an extra point or two of damage from that.

Now, let's talk about holds. A perfect hold will net you a 25% damage increase.

Say we have a weapon that does 30 cut damage.

With 6 PS, (48% damage increase) you'd do 44.4 damage per swing. A 25% hold bonus on top of that would add an additional 11.1 points of damage to bring you to 55.5 points.

With 8 PS, (64% damage increase) you'd do 49.2 damage per swing. A 25% hold bonus on top of that would add an additional 12.3 points of damage to bring you to 61.5 points of damage.

So, the held attack from 8 PS only nets you an extra 1.2 points of damage in this example. The actual attack only does 6 more points of damage. Now, here's where things get crazy.

Armor has 2 values, soak and resist. Soak totally nullifies damage and resust reduces it.

Not sure if these are the old or new values.

armor_soak_factor_against_cut       = 0.8
armor_soak_factor_against_pierce    = 0.65
armor_soak_factor_against_blunt     = 0.5

armor_reduction_factor_against_cut       = 1.0
armor_reduction_factor_against_pierce    = 0.5
armor_reduction_factor_against_blunt     = 0.75

Anyway, what this means is that both attacks are reduced by the exact same amount regardless of initial damage. This also determines whether you glance or not.

The second value is a percentage-based reduction. Since it is percentage-based the higher damage value is reduced MORE than the lower damage value. That knocks off even more of the higher PS advantage and brings the two values closer together.

Since the soak factor was reduced a while ago, it actually helped agi builds out and hurt str builds. The previous advantage of str builds was the reduced glance chance. Now, you'll really only glance due to bad footwork. So the biggest advantage of str builds was taken away.

Also, since PS is percentage-based, you don't gain much of a bonus off of the low-damage 1-handers. Poles and 2-handers have a much better bonus from PS.

Also that build in my first example; I would say I average about 3.5 hits to kill someone like that. That's with 6 PS and a MW Italian sword.

IMO you want 6 ps and 6 ath, anything more on either of those is just gravy. So if you dont plan on retiring, or dont think max IF/WM are worth it, go ahead and get an additional ps or ath, but I would suggest not going below 6 ps or 6 ath.

Really good advice, by the way.
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Offline HarunYahya

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2012, 09:39:40 pm »
+2
21 str.
15 agi

Power Strike - 8

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Offline Mlekce

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2012, 09:43:20 pm »
0
Don't listen to him,there is hudge difference between 6 and 7 ps,not to mention difference between 6 and 8 ps.
With 8 ps you will kill everything in 2 hits,heavier guys with 3 hits,str whores 4.

go 21/18 build and make it like this.

5if,shield
6athl,7 ps
114 wpf in 1h.

This is build i will try this gen i already rage respec 3 times.

Offline oprah_winfrey

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #19 on: August 24, 2012, 10:06:01 pm »
0
Don't listen to him,there is hudge difference between 6 and 7 ps,not to mention difference between 6 and 8 ps.
With 8 ps you will kill everything in 2 hits,heavier guys with 3 hits,str whores 4.

go 21/18 build and make it like this.

5if,shield
6athl,7 ps
114 wpf in 1h.

This is build i will try this gen i already rage respec 3 times.

Rusty is arguing that you want 6 ath as a shielder. You are saying not to listen to him, then posting a build with 6 ath. Nice argument.

Offline Jarold

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #20 on: August 24, 2012, 10:53:53 pm »
0
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Oops derp. It appears I accidentally put  8 instead of 7 when I was typing it up  :lol:



Thanks for the help guys.



 I dunno if this is retarded but I usually run away from fights if I can when there are like 2-3 two hander guys after me  :lol:       If they do catch me I tend to jump around slashing faces and holding my swings, using my weapons reach, so thats why I like my arabian cavalry sword.

I will think about some of these builds and see if I want to use them, thanks again.

Offline Fartface

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #21 on: August 29, 2012, 11:50:36 pm »
0
Id be happy to show you bjord , when I reach lvl 13 ps ... o yeah already got it well prepared to be showed!
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Offline Smoothrich

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2012, 12:03:54 am »
+1
I did a 15/24 1hander build with some polearm WPF too, having an Awlpike on my back to avoid team damage in clusterfucks and scare off cav.

With cut weapons like the NCS or Italian, I seriously 2-3 shot everyone regardless.  I was just so fast, if I ran into enemies before attacking with held swings at their face I hit like 10 PS, on top of having much more fun being a speedy asshole who could dissect groups of enemies by myself with big play finesse.  STR builds would often end up tanking a lot of hits but I mean.. you have a shield.  You are invincible to everything so who cares how many swings you need if you choose your battles wisely.  I actually did this build to try to hunt archers but you can imagine how that ultimately worked out :(

Of course I also did a 27/12 1hander build with elite scimi and it was even easier, since I didn't have to factor in held swings, speed bonus, positioning, or minimizing damage done to me or anything.  I just walked up to people grunting like a Neanderthal and spammed right swings at 2handers and left swings when facehugging and 2-3 shotted everyone just the same.  I just felt like a douche because strength builds should be a bannable offense in cRPG.

Ultimately I would recommend 21/18 or 18/21 over any other build because balanced builds own and its all skill no crutch whenever you play.  But experiment on skip the funs and use levels of armor to compensate for your athletics so you find a good speed and a weapon that suits your playstyle and go hogwild. 
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Offline Mlekce

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #23 on: August 30, 2012, 02:16:35 am »
0
This will sound wierd but i don't feel any difference in speed when i have 4,5,6 or 7 athl and carry a shield. I am so god damn slow.
Do you guys notice any big difference?
I never thought abbout 27/12 build but now i think that this build will totaly fit my playstyle.
Insane dmg with blunt weapon,74 hit points on my +3 gear,i don't mind if i am slow this could be it. Thanks smoothrich.

Offline San

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #24 on: August 30, 2012, 02:24:06 am »
0
If you like to hold shield a lot, I would recommend a more strength oriented build. Since you already tried 21/15, try 6-7 athletics builds. Do you hold shield a lot when you move around, Mlekce?

Offline Mlekce

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #25 on: August 30, 2012, 02:36:46 am »
0
i tried 12/24 i think or it was 12/27 and it is fast,fun to play for day or two,and then it is nightmare to play. One,or 2 hits and you are dead.
tried 15/21 fast,little stronger but still too weak for mine taste. I also die too easily.
tried 18/18 fast,but still weak.
tried 21/15 slower but ps is still weak. I would reccomend this build for all new shielders. It is good,but i like more ps.
tried 24/15 this is build i liked the moust,dmg is very good.
building now 21/18 currently lvl 28.
next to try is 27/12.

Yeah,i first played with shield because it was less tense that way,but now i forgot how to block properly. I can block in singleplayer bots,but here it is too fast for my reflexes.
So i need to carry shield with me. I depend on him. I press right click when i am in danger of ranged,cav or infrantery,and i never put him on my back because i know it slows me down even more.
I feel slower in combat no matter how much athl i have. Ppl faint too easily.
I also like to have a lot of health because i get wounded and shot a lot,so i like to go with my shield and don't care abbout anything. :D

Offline Mlekce

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #26 on: August 30, 2012, 02:43:56 am »
0
That build can be good with this new valour system,you will get a lot of points if you hit someone with 9 ps and mw weapon.
It is more likly you will get valour or good score with 9 ps then with 5 ps.

Offline Formless

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #27 on: August 31, 2012, 02:56:31 am »
0
I mostly agree with Rusty. 

But I prefer:

 Strength: 21
Agility: 18
Skills to attributes: 8
Ironflesh: 6
Power Strike: 7
Shield: 4
Athletics: 6
Weapon Master: 0
One Handed: 110

But I mostly play 1 hander without shield these days hence the extra IF comes in handy. I also found that 1 hand really does not need any weapon master 110 wpf works just fine.  The 6 athletics is nice, lets you move around well, and you will need that extra bit of speed against 2 hander agility players cause of their advantage of having a longer weapon. 

The 7 PS is nice, you will still bounce off armour but most opponent go down with about 3 to 4 hits.  With a cut sword you might not want to fight anyone in plate cause many of your hits will bounce off, many times I ended up having to hit a plate str guy about 9 to 10 times to take him out.   

I tried a 9 PS one hander, and I really did not notice that much difference between 7 ps and 9ps,  low armour opponents went down faster but I would still get many bounces off plate despite the 9ps.  Plus the sacrifice in athletics was a hudge disadvantage against 2 hander agility guys.  Overall I preform much better on my 21/18 one hander then I do on my 27/12 one hander.

Hope this helps,

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Offline Tindel

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #28 on: August 31, 2012, 11:41:52 am »
0
Spec and gear loadout comes hand in hand.

If you want to use a certain weapon or armor you have to choose spec accordingly.
And playstyle of course, what your general approach to combat is.

There is alot of merit both to agi and str heavier builds, depending on what you want to accomplish.


My recommendation is,  try alot of different builds and weapons, and see what fits you.
When i played shielder i tried:  21/15 18/18 24/15 27/12 ,  using long espada eslavona.
And like others have posted before me, different builds have different pros and cons, its about how you utilize those that matters.

Agility lets you score hits easier, and avoid hits easier
Strenght lets your hits matter more, and you can take more hits.

I

Offline Nogu

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Re: One Hander Build Help
« Reply #29 on: August 31, 2012, 12:09:29 pm »
0
Lvl: 30
---------------------------
Strength:18
Agility:18
---------------------------
One Handed:154
---------------------------
Weapon Master:6
Athletics:6
Iron Flesh:5
Shield:6
Power Strike:6
---------------------------
Use Elite Spamitar or Nordic Champion's Sword